65 replies to this topic

[Bigbacon]

Bishop Steiner, on 07 February 2015 - 03:56 PM, said:

aside from the part where the AA only has 4 Energy Hardpoints? 1R has 5.

opps, yea I meant R...I mix those 2 up all the time.

[Bishop Steiner]

mmmmmmmm...just enjoyed a nice 820 dmg, 4 kill match in my 1R on HPG. Love it when battles bog down..then I can run around the edged and harass away!

[Vindicator Jones]

The 1R is quite underestimated. a great crowd brawler flying around dealing damage from above. I just wish they would re-do some of the quirks, especially on the St Ives Blues. I love this little mech, I think its great fun and could be so much better if the right quirks were used. Ive set up a forum post today discussing the quirks for the St Ives Blues

http://mwomercs.com/...rks-adjustment/

Cheers

[CocoaJin]

Vindicator Jones, on 07 February 2015 - 08:57 PM, said:

The 1R is quite underestimated. a great crowd brawler flying around dealing damage from above. I just wish they would re-do some of the quirks, especially on the St Ives Blues. I love this little mech, I think its great fun and could be so much better if the right quirks were used. Ive set up a forum post today discussing the quirks for the St Ives Blues

http://mwomercs.com/...rks-adjustment/

Cheers

All that flitting about is why the quirks arent so great...JJs are already considered a significant perk for the mech.

[STEF_]

Understanding the mech is very important, and if I found it bad, it was only my fault, because I haven't undestood the mech before.
The fact is that thanks to this thread I've basiced the "Bishop 1AA" in a blinck

So, Vindy is a skirmisher for sure.
Now I'm looking for the 1R, but I'm worried. Because if I used well the 1AA, it's been for the engine, letting me to reposition, hit and run away.

Any tips are welcome.

Energy boat, with lpl/ppc + ml?

It seems to me quite slow, I don't think I can use it "with my style": I'm manly a flanker or a sniper (and a light pilot).
Must I be sticked to assault's ass?

[CocoaJin]

Nothing wrong with Chubby Chasin'...I do it all the time.

[MikeBend]

Stefka Kerensky, on 08 February 2015 - 12:11 AM, said:

Understanding the mech is very important, and if I found it bad, it was only my fault, because I haven't undestood the mech before.
The fact is that thanks to this thread I've basiced the "Bishop 1AA" in a blinck

So, Vindy is a skirmisher for sure.
Now I'm looking for the 1R, but I'm worried. Because if I used well the 1AA, it's been for the engine, letting me to reposition, hit and run away.

Any tips are welcome.

Energy boat, with lpl/ppc + ml?

It seems to me quite slow, I don't think I can use it "with my style": I'm manly a flanker or a sniper (and a light pilot).
Must I be sticked to assault's ass?

If you go single PPC, stick it on the left arm, it is somewhat higher hardpoint than the right arm.

[Artgathan]

Stefka Kerensky, on 08 February 2015 - 12:11 AM, said:

Understanding the mech is very important, and if I found it bad, it was only my fault, because I haven't undestood the mech before.
The fact is that thanks to this thread I've basiced the "Bishop 1AA" in a blinck

So, Vindy is a skirmisher for sure.
Now I'm looking for the 1R, but I'm worried. Because if I used well the 1AA, it's been for the engine, letting me to reposition, hit and run away.

Any tips are welcome.

Energy boat, with lpl/ppc + ml?

It seems to me quite slow, I don't think I can use it "with my style": I'm manly a flanker or a sniper (and a light pilot).
Must I be sticked to assault's ass?

I've been using 2 PPC + 3 ML and XL225. Use it as a sort of pop-sniper / skirmisher, but don't get too far from your Heavy / Assaults (try to support them).

[STEF_]

Artgathan, on 08 February 2015 - 06:17 AM, said:

I've been using 2 PPC + 3 ML and XL225. Use it as a sort of pop-sniper / skirmisher, but don't get too far from your Heavy / Assaults (try to support them).

I've tried 2LPL+3ml untill now, but it seems that it doesn't work well for me: lpl range is too short and the mech is too slow; so it always ends in a brawling fire, which is very bad for a Vindy.
Yes, I think that the best loadout to built a 1R Skirmisher is 2 PPc and 3ml.

[Kjudoon]

Hated the 1X to start with. Then I said 'sod those cruddy ballistics, I'm going Lurms'!... and it started working very VERY well.

A single LRM10 with 3 tons of ammo is heavenly as a compliment to that fast PPC and a head mounted MPL. Max engine and jumpjets, toss in the speed tweak, and it's a solid harrasser that most people underestimate or ignore till it's too late.

But but but... 3 machine guns! yeah whatever... waste of tonnage for too little use.

How about an LB10x or UAC5? Meh. You really gotta like ballistics, and the tactical flex of LRMs outweighs the pinpoint in this case because you just can't bring enough pressure of fire.

LRM 15 is too heavy an d 5 is too light, SRM and streaks are waste of time unless you ignore the PPC quirks and go short range brawler.

The joy of a Vindie is engaging and doing damage at 500m plus when most pilots think they're safe and REALLY popping them between 500 and 200m

YMMV

[CocoaJin]

Work those builds and niches gents! Mechs aren't the problem...the pilots are. A good pilot plays to the mech, he doesn't try to make the mech play to him.

Until that lesson is learned, the forums will be inundated(as it currently is) with short-sighted players begging to fix mechs that aren't broke...essentially trying to make the mech into something it isn't, trying to make the mech into another mech, trying to make the mech fit their style or some meta being used on another chassis better suited for that style...that needs to stop.

Every mech fits a niche(s), it comes with strengths and weaknesses. If a mech didn't feel like it was lacking or wanting something, then there would be no balance/counter-balance, no variety...essentially PGI would be doing it wrong.

Every time you wish the mech had or did "X", remember that's the point. Then re-focus on the mech's strengths and build your mech around it, then learn to operate your mech to its strengths. If you can't do that, sell it and buy a mech that does suit your style...don't try a forum rant campaign for PGI to change a mech "Y" into a mech "X" because you can't adapt.

[Deathlike]

CocoaJin, on 08 February 2015 - 10:24 AM, said:

Work those builds and niches gents! Mechs aren't the problem...the pilots are. A good pilot plays to the mech, he doesn't try to make the mech play to him.

Until that lesson is learned, the forums will be inundated(as it currently is) with short-sighted players begging to fix mechs that aren't broke...essentially trying to make the mech into something it isn't, trying to make the mech into another mech, trying to make the mech fit their style or some meta being used on another chassis better suited for that style...that needs to stop.

Every mech fits a niche(s), it comes with strengths and weaknesses. If a mech didn't feel like it was lacking or wanting something, then there would be no balance/counter-balance, no variety...essentially PGI would be doing it wrong.

Every time you wish the mech had or did "X", remember that's the point. Then re-focus on the mech's strengths and build your mech around it, then learn to operate your mech to its strengths. If you can't do that, sell it and buy a mech that does suit your style...don't try a forum rant campaign for PGI to change a mech "Y" into a mech "X" because you can't adapt.

I'm pretty much compatible with most mechs... but I have to build them in such a way to make the most out of them. There is frustration that exists in different mechs whether you agree with them or not, and that is why the competitive community tends to stay away from them like the plague. They can certainly run them, but that's only for fun or for science.. and not for ANY sort of serious play.

I simply don't play mechs often that don't play to my preferred style. Then again mechs like the Spider-5V cannot be helped. A mech must be built in such a way that the player doesn't feel they are restricted... or otherwise it is essentially banging the head against the wall and thus getting annoyed over bad design decision... whether it is your own mech building skills... or PGI's bad balance testing.

When people avoid a mech... whether they (the players) are competitive or not, there's a reason for it. Not acknowledging deficiencies or problems will never bring diversity in this game. If you don't like the mass of Timberwolves and Stormcrows... you better make the alternative options (Summoner and Nova) better. Trying to be a special snowflake in this instance is treating the entire goal of mech balance for what it is... sheer ignorance.

Edited by Deathlike, 08 February 2015 - 10:47 AM.

[MeiSooHaityu]

I've retooled the 1AA and I am having better luck with it now.

I was running the 1AA with 2 PPCs and 1 MLaser. When I built the 1R up though, I made that my PPC sniper (2 PPCs and 3 SLasers for some under 90m defense.

I tried something different with the 1AA by making it 1 PPC in one arm and 1LPLaser and 1 MLaser in the other. It worked ok at first but I found it difficult in such a quick scurrying mech to hit effectively with all the weapons.

Now I am running the 1AA with 2 LPLasers and 2 MLasers. It is now the quick little damage machine I like. It's not symmetrical since one MLaser is in the head, but I seem to focus damage ok.

Its my new 1AA build of the week anyway lol.

[CocoaJin]

Deathlike, on 08 February 2015 - 10:45 AM, said:

I'm pretty much compatible with most mechs... but I have to build them in such a way to make the most out of them. There is frustration that exists in different mechs whether you agree with them or not, and that is why the competitive community tends to stay away from them like the plague. They can certainly run them, but that's only for fun or for science.. and not for ANY sort of serious play.

I simply don't play mechs often that don't play to my preferred style. Then again mechs like the Spider-5V cannot be helped. A mech must be built in such a way that the player doesn't feel they are restricted... or otherwise it is essentially banging the head against the wall and thus getting annoyed over bad design decision... whether it is your own mech building skills... or PGI's bad balance testing.

When people avoid a mech... whether they (the players) are competitive or not, there's a reason for it. Not acknowledging deficiencies or problems will never bring diversity in this game. If you don't like the mass of Timberwolves and Stormcrows... you better make the alternative options (Summoner and Nova) better. Trying to be a special snowflake in this instance is treating the entire goal of mech balance for what it is... sheer ignorance.

Lack of mech diversity is due more to lack of combat diversity. All combat scenarios in game are variations on the same theme. We lack diversity because we lack open combat, both spatially and temporally. Because forces can't seek to choose where, when to fight, in an open theater of war sandbox/semi-sandbox, we essentially get stuck with the same cookie cutter, play-date, arena battles. This limited combat scenario with different cosmetic set pieces will inherently favor certain niches and chassises over and over and over again...but that's not the mech's fault.

We need to campaign PGI to expand the dynamics of war, both within time and space. Free us up to give off their combat on rails philosophy and gives us a truly tole and niche embracing theater of war.

Edited by CocoaJin, 08 February 2015 - 10:57 PM.

[Kjudoon]

MeiSooHaityu, on 08 February 2015 - 11:18 AM, said:

I've retooled the 1AA and I am having better luck with it now.

I was running the 1AA with 2 PPCs and 1 MLaser. When I built the 1R up though, I made that my PPC sniper (2 PPCs and 3 SLasers for some under 90m defense.

I tried something different with the 1AA by making it 1 PPC in one arm and 1LPLaser and 1 MLaser in the other. It worked ok at first but I found it difficult in such a quick scurrying mech to hit effectively with all the weapons.

Now I am running the 1AA with 2 LPLasers and 2 MLasers. It is now the quick little damage machine I like. It's not symmetrical since one MLaser is in the head, but I seem to focus damage ok.

Its my new 1AA build of the week anyway lol.

SPLs on the Vindie actually work extremely well paired with that big PPC punch. It's amazing how many guys run away like little girls from a spider when you suddenly pop them on chainfire with that... Shades of Firestarters dancing in their heads... and then they get outside 90m... blammo.

[Blood Rose]

I run my Vindicator 1X with an ERPPC, a Medium Laser, an SSRM2 and triple MG's.

It makes a good brawler, but the ERPPC can also engage targets at long range. I primarily use her as a finisher, picking on the damaged and crippled targets. Earlier on in the match I snipe, escort or harass as the situation calls for it.

[Kjudoon]

Pssst....

The ERPPC gets no quirk bonuses on the vindie.

[Nothing Whatsoever]

Kjudoon, on 10 February 2015 - 06:29 PM, said:

Pssst....

The ERPPC gets no quirk bonuses on the vindie.

Well, not specific quirks, but the generic energy ones should work on ERPPCs just fine.

[Bloodweaver]

Bishop Steiner, on 06 February 2015 - 07:39 PM, said:

Funny thing? Most effective VND I run is the 1AA...and I ignore the Quirks. 110 kph, max JJs, 4 Mlasers and an ALRM15. Best fast harasser I have. Many many 5-6 kill games. Damage runs between 400-800 on good matches.

And yes, I think ALL of them need an extra Missile Hardpoint added. But I love the mobility, and they are decently tanky. So while I agree with a lot of your findings, I still find one can play around with builds outside the quirks, and match it to playstyle.... and be quite decent.

Pretty close to how I do the 1AA, as a mobile rear-strike/commando element that can double back and support the team when needed. I put a bit more focus lasers and a bit less towards missiles, while adding TAG and dual AMS, but other than that, pretty close. And frankly, I love it. Both fun and effective. A second missile hardpoint would be cool, and open up quite a few options. Narc? SRM-4? Who knows...

[Kjudoon]

Wish there was a variant with 3 energy and 2 missile points (10 tubes each) and able to carry a 275 engine.