134 replies to this topic

[Stealth Raptor]

Ax2Grind, on 01 March 2015 - 08:34 PM, said:

Die Clanner! (to everyone who has or will post in this thread, including myself)

ha ha ha ha

die clanner!

[Dirk Le Daring]

If you held them in such high esteem, then why chose a corridor that would lead you to killing them ?

[Prussian Havoc]

Dirk Le Daring, on 01 March 2015 - 09:50 PM, said:

If you held them in such high esteem, then why chose a corridor that would lead you to killing them ?

In this case Lore is quite correct:

(EXERPT from Sarna's account of the Smoke Jaguar portion (http://www.sarna.net...an_Smoke_Jaguar) of OPN REVIVAL - "In the Grand Council meeting to determine the basic plan of attack, ilKhan Leo Showers in conjunction with Jade Falcon Khan Elias Crichell decided that the four invading Clans would bid for one of four "invasion corridors" which stretched from the Periphery towards Terra. The purpose for this was that, according to an obscure passage in Nicholas Kerensky's diary, the two Khans proposed that whichever Clan captured Terra would become ilClan, the supreme Clan. When it came time to bid, Smoke Jaguar Khan Lincoln Osis achieved a great victory by winning the corridor which ran through the Draconis Combine. Besides worthy opponents, it was believed that House Kurita aided the infamous Stefan Amaris in bringing about the downfall of the Star League, and the Smoke Jaguar warriors welcomed the chance to fight such a foe. As the assembled invasion force gathered in orbit above Strana Mechty ilKhan Showers gave a final speech, promising swift victory and boldly predicting Clan Smoke Jaguar would conquer Terra within the year."

DCMS Units are worthy opponents, one must not chose to not game with them if one admires their gaming acumen.

[hopterque]

Tasker, on 01 March 2015 - 06:33 PM, said:

*makes motion of pointing finger to temple and spinning it*

Haha, agreed, he is quite clearly insane and also incredibly stupid.

[Khanesh Loral]

hopterque, on 02 March 2015 - 09:11 AM, said:

Haha, agreed, he is quite clearly insane and also incredibly stupid.

What is the world coming to? Hopterque and I agree on something...

[Prussian Havoc]

hopterque, on 02 March 2015 - 09:11 AM, said:

Haha, agreed, he is quite clearly insane and also incredibly stupid.

Khanesh Loral, on 02 March 2015 - 12:27 PM, said:

What is the world coming to? Hopterque and I agree on something...

Prussian Havoc (http://mwomercs.com/...prussian-havoc/) - bringing Peace, Tranquility and Common Ground to the Inner Sphere since 03MAR3050!

Edited by Prussian Havoc, 03 March 2015 - 09:24 AM.

[Tasker]

Prussian Havoc, on 03 March 2015 - 09:06 AM, said:

Prussian Havoc (http://mwomercs.com/...prussian-havoc/) - bringing Peace, Tranquility and Common Ground to the Inner Sphere since 03MAR3050!

In all seriousness: please never change.

[Prussian Havoc]

To be honest, this pic has already been used to good effect, elsewhere on various forums:

[wanderer]

Ironically, Kurita was responsible for the preservation of the last of the Cameron bloodline- Theodore having married into said bloodline and his children bearing it's DNA.

[Connor Sellock]

Prussian Havoc, on 07 March 2015 - 09:32 AM, said:

To be honest, this pic has already been used to good effect, elsewhere on various forums:

[Prussian Havoc]

Prussian Havoc, on 13 February 2015 - 11:10 AM, said:

Good Citizenry and Honored Warriors of the Draconis Combine Mustered Soldiery,

Consider for a moment the Lie of a "Marik" Star league... http://mwomercs.com/...ost__p__4192852

As you will note I have already annotated references, assessments and recommendations.

It is this last, a recommendation, that I bring directly to you here and now..



Clan Smoke Jaguar did NOT return to the Inner Sphere to WAGE WAR on the Coordinator's people.

The Clans returned to the Inner Sphere to put down the imminent Reforging of the Star League: http://mwomercs.com/...ost__p__4169910

We Clans FAILED in our OPN REVIVAL http://www.sarna.net...i/Clan_Invasion for the Marik sow has indeed birth forth an ABOMINATION of a Star League before we could safeguard the people of the Inner Sphere from it... For THAT is the stated and true intent of the Clan's Operation REVIVAL.

Notable Clan Smoke Jaguar Elders have ALWAYS held the Warriors of House Kurita in high esteem, indeed it is why when Clan Smoke Jaguar won the right to select ANY Invasion Corridor, that my Clan chose an axis of advance that was wholly within House Kurita borders.

Even on Strana Mechty, the stories of DCMS Deeds, Bushido's superior Moral Code and the Dragon's famed vitality and strength hold powerful sway.



I call upon the Heart and Soul of the Dragon now...



...in this time of new found COMMON CAUSE, let the Dragon and the Jaguar BOTH come to grips with #ManiacalMarik.

In much the same way as a Clan must contend with an errant and winding PGI logarithm in order to push toward Terra, "I" (perhaps alone) now view House Kurita and the NECESSARY EVIL of having to work and wind our CSJ-way through YOUR planets in order to COME TO GRIPS WITH OUR TRUE ENEMY, the Marik-Star League.




It will take time for the realization that our COMMON and GREATEST FOE IS NOT ONE ANOTHER, but is the Marik Star League ...nay... the burgeoning Marik Hegemony.

I would see (and make Forum-advocacy for) a CSJ LOYALIST petition to PGI to unilaterally repatriate Arkab, Alshain, Wolcott and Turtle Bay as DUE COMPENSATION for the worlds the PGI algorithm will place in Clan Smoke Jaguar's unfortunately-chosen path, prior to FINALLY opening a Smoke Jaguar Invasion Corridor into the Marik "Pocket" and finally House Davion Space.


Please understand that Terra has only EVER been one stop on Clan Smoke Jaguar's path to New Avalon, another true seat of a potential bastardized reinterpretation of a Star League.

Given Hans/Victor Davion's actions and demonstrated intentions [as well as the ever-closer Davion ties with House Steiner, watch well what might just soon be a Common-Federation (COMFED)] it is only RIGHT and PROPER that CSJ sweep though Davion Space right to the seat of Federated Suns power on Mew Avalon and clear out this second nest of world-be-Hegemons.


It has been and will be an Honorable and Courageous test of Martial Prowess our two peoples. Regardless of future decisions by PGI (with regard to planet repatriation) or subsequent decisions by our respective Unit Leaders...


....as the single most accomplished and recognized Smoke Jaguar gamer (https://twitter.com/...355710118207490) I extend to you my deepest appreciation for your willingness to daily share in a game we all enjoy so very much. If we two groups of gamers come to share a common Axis of Advance on House Marik, I will look to best coordinate and sequence attacks with whatever elements of the DCMS High Command that may find this advantageous. I will also add a portion to our forum's "pinned" CSJ OPORD AND FRAGO (http://mwomercs.com/...ost__p__4181502) in order to better deconflict and synergies game effects pursuant to the earliest possible liberation of Terrra AND THUS end to the nightmare of a Marik Star League.



Good Luck and Good Gaming,

Meet you on the high (New Avalon) ground,

May your true-Enemy's will fail them, long before your Dragon's last A/C5 round slams home in its breech or soon!

Rebooting a Tread 101 - Restate OP and add updated or value-added comments.

Both Marik's New Star League and my own meager attempts to jumpstart a Clan pursuit of an ilKhan/ilClan...



...have both failed to produce their framers intended results.


But why did these efforts at Lore-based, overarching Factional Unification fail?

IMO the reasons for failure can be tied back to at least two primary causes:

PGI's game does not include features unique to / empowering / enabling of such efforts as a New Star League or ilKhan/ilClan.

PGI Game features that could enable Gamer-Constructs ABOVE the Unit Level could be as simple as Supra-Unit Funds, Coalition (or if you prefer Alliance or Confederation) Chat Channels, or perhaps most useful of all Coalition/Alliaance/Confereration Community Warfare Screens where ongoing Offensive Efforts and Defensive efforts can be better managed through API-data graphic depiction of which constituent Units/Gamers are active on which worlds and what are the status of their Battles (winning a Boreal Hold Action 36 Enemy killed to 24 Friendly losses - for example.

But the second factor as to why the New Star League and the above effort at jumpstarting Clan progress toward an ilKhan/ilClan failed IMO would severely limit success regardless of PGI game functionalities added to specifically enable greater Factional Unification Efforts - Unit parochialism is rampant throughout much of MWO Community Warfare.

For two years prior to Community Warfare, MWO taught us all to be insular to our Unit. NOTHING inculcated within MWO gamers an appreciation for gaming above the Unit level... we as gamers did not even gain the functionality to choose Factions until just 8-months ago or so when we received Comunity Warfare Phase One.

MWO Gamers in some cases will be hard pressed to see ANY value in a Unification Effort past the comfortable confined of their original Clan or Inner Sphere Unit.


I would hope as Beta progresses we can see BOTH PGI wicker some enabling functionality for supra-Factional groupings of Factions AND an increasing willingness on the part of gamers to look beyond their Units.




Why do you think these efforts failed?

We are still in Beta, how can we and how can PGI look to bring more success o such efforts in the future?

[MischiefSC]

Prussian Havoc, on 03 April 2015 - 06:44 AM, said:

Rebooting a Tread 101 - Restate OP and add updated or value-added comments.

Both Marik's New Star League and my own meager attempts to jumpstart a Clan pursuit of an ilKhan/ilClan...



...have both failed to produce their framers intended results.


But why did these efforts at Lore-based, overarching Factional Unification fail?

IMO the reasons for failure can be tied back to at least two primary causes:

PGI's game does not include features unique to / empowering / enabling of such efforts as a New Star League or ilKhan/ilClan.

PGI Game features that could enable Gamer-Constructs ABOVE the Unit Level could be as simple as Supra-Unit Funds, Coalition (or if you prefer Alliance or Confederation) Chat Channels, or perhaps most useful of all Coalition/Alliaance/Confereration Community Warfare Screens where ongoing Offensive Efforts and Defensive efforts can be better managed through API-data graphic depiction of which constituent Units/Gamers are active on which worlds and what are the status of their Battles (winning a Boreal Hold Action 36 Enemy killed to 24 Friendly losses - for example.

But the second factor as to why the New Star League and the above effort at jumpstarting Clan progress toward an ilKhan/ilClan failed IMO would severely limit success regardless of PGI game functionalities added to specifically enable greater Factional Unification Efforts - Unit parochialism is rampant throughout much of MWO Community Warfare.

For two years prior to Community Warfare, MWO taught us all to be insular to our Unit. NOTHING inculcated within MWO gamers an appreciation for gaming above the Unit level... we as gamers did not even gain the functionality to choose Factions until just 8-months ago or so when we received Comunity Warfare Phase One.

MWO Gamers in some cases will be hard pressed to see ANY value in a Unification Effort past the comfortable confined of their original Clan or Inner Sphere Unit.


I would hope as Beta progresses we can see BOTH PGI wicker some enabling functionality for supra-Factional groupings of Factions AND an increasing willingness on the part of gamers to look beyond their Units.




Why do you think these efforts failed?

We are still in Beta, how can we and how can PGI look to bring more success o such efforts in the future?

I think it's worth mentioning that PGI is actually designing the system thus far to punish any investment in the game above unit level. Faction is irrelevant. In fact you gain more rewards faster by switching factions regularly. The dots mean nothing, faction colors and tags and success or failure means nothing.

WHY you should play CW, WHY helping your side wins is important, these are the first questions that need a solid answer in CW. Strong benefits to being a faction loyalist or at least having long term contracts. Value to the dots on the map. In addition to that coordination tools for alliances between factions - Coalition Chat being a great idea. The ability for House Units to add bonuses to attacking or defending certain worlds that are obvious immediately to everyone in their faction when they go to drop, etc.

Without these CW is irrelevant. If the direction PGI wants to go is 'everyone be mercs and move around a lot' then just drop the map. It's overly complex and irrelevant. Give us a faction leader-board and a unit leader-board that tracks points and just add the game modes to the pug and group queue.

CW is about factions fighting factions. If you make the factions in that process largely irrelevant then you eliminate the whole point of it. Without that there is no point or foundation upon which to build larger sociopolitical structures.

[Wildstreak]

"Have you gone mad?"


"Prussian be illin'."


"Traitor."

[callmejon]

solution to the vatborn idea, join kurita gain honor, commit genocide in attempts to keeping honor, failed attempts end in your death, Kurita wins overall, and plushy kitties learn what honor is, wins for all and Dear Coordinator smiles at vatborn on vatborn violence in attempts to please him.

All Praise to Dear Coordinator

[Prussian Havoc]

MischiefSC, on 03 April 2015 - 10:13 AM, said:

I think it's worth mentioning that PGI is actually designing the system thus far to punish any investment in the game above unit level. Faction is irrelevant. In fact you gain more rewards faster by switching factions regularly. The dots mean nothing, faction colors and tags and success or failure means nothing.

WHY you should play CW, WHY helping your side wins is important, these are the first questions that need a solid answer in CW. Strong benefits to being a faction loyalist or at least having long term contracts. Value to the dots on the map. In addition to that coordination tools for alliances between factions - Coalition Chat being a great idea. The ability for House Units to add bonuses to attacking or defending certain worlds that are obvious immediately to everyone in their faction when they go to drop, etc.

Without these CW is irrelevant. If the direction PGI wants to go is 'everyone be mercs and move around a lot' then just drop the map. It's overly complex and irrelevant. Give us a faction leader-board and a unit leader-board that tracks points and just add the game modes to the pug and group queue.

CW is about factions fighting factions. If you make the factions in that process largely irrelevant then you eliminate the whole point of it. Without that there is no point or foundation upon which to build larger sociopolitical structures.

Your frustrations sound loud and clarion clear.

I would counter with, "Beginnings are a very delicate time." (Sorry for the cheesy "Dune/Princess Irulan" quote.) Beta is where gamers like you and I make the strongest possible case we can for the changes we would BOTH like to see. I too would greatly favor PERMCON benefits befitting the inherent LOYALTY involved when someone forgoes ANY other Faction in order to go deep with JUST one. Look at my own example - my "Prussian Havoc" account reached 20th Level just 54-days into CW on 04FEB. Ever since then I have been grinding out Loyalty Points (upwards of 1.4m total thus far) with that account in the so far unrequited hope that PGI will eventually get around to announcing Levels past 20 for each Faction.

But instead of becoming overly frustrated by perhaps banking points toward something that will never happen (Levels past 20) I instead dusted off two of my family's accounts, my daughters' "Connor Sellock" and "Phaelon Wolf" accounts and instead invested a few hundred dollars in each for the Resistance pack, MC buys (with free Clan Mechs, Woot!) and for one account the Clan Wave 3 pack. Now my daughters and I are in the process of leveling both those accounts to Level 20.

At the end my family will enjoy one Level 20 Clan, one Level 20 Inner Sphere and one endlessly #MercLife Jack-of-all-Factions/Master-of-None - my intend for this last family account (and one that best befits Lauren's nature!) is to eventually reach Level 6 in each Faction, followed by Level 10 in each Faction.

PGI offers us an immersive game FROM MANY ANGLES. I can truly offer personal testimonial that "CSJ-style of Factional Politics/in-game tactics evolution" is GREATLY divergent from "House Kurita-style Factional Politics/in-game tactics evolution."

And MWO is all the stronger and more immersive for the fact that each Faction has in deed developed its own FLAVOR, it's own TEXTURE.


As to, "How best can we work within the process of aiding PGI to evolve MWO into the game WE would best enjoy playing at Community Warfare Phase 3 Launch?"

Our dialogue here.

Our various threads and posts here on MWO Forum.

Our various threads and posts on REDDIT.

Our individual Tweets on Twitter.

ALL MWO-Support requests.

There are these and no doubt other means by which PGI learns what its gamer population for MWO wants.

MOST CRUCIAL in all this is PGI's fiscal health. I learned with Demigod (http://demigodthegame.com) and MechWarrior:Tactics (http://en.m.wikipedi...Warrior_Tactics) that if care by the player base is not given toward the continued fiscal health of the developer/publisher (for us there is only PGI...thank goodness!) games either "fade away" like Demigod... or are "AX MURDERED" like MWT.

For my family's part, we have no problem investing in PGI sufficient to ENCOURAGING PGI TO COMPLETE MWO and then take up DEVELOPMENT OF MECHWARRIOR7 (MWO being considered MW6.)

PGI is not a gamer-welfare program. "MWO" puts food on the tables of all 50-odd employees at PGI. Make no mistake about it, if PGI's Steam Launch doesn't go well, it will be a nail (or twenty) in the coffin of MWO.

I, for one would rejoice if PGI were to open up another title for development... and after my family's investment in multiple MWT Founder's packs, few would blame me if I tried on occassion to suggest PGI "pick up the option" on MWT:

https://twitter.com/...539456323084288

callmejon, on 03 April 2015 - 11:44 AM, said:

solution to the vatborn idea, join kurita gain honor, commit genocide in attempts to keeping honor, failed attempts end in your death, Kurita wins overall, and plushy kitties learn what honor is, wins for all and Dear Coordinator smiles at vatborn on vatborn violence in attempts to please him.

All Praise to Dear Coordinator

The Coordinator eventually interns his own set of "plushy kitties" Warrior Caste: http://www.sarna.net...Wars_of_Reaving

I suppose that please the Coordinator to no end, especially as these Clan Smoke Jaguar Warrior Caste descendants eventually formed the New Republic's "Fidelis" Unit: http://www.sarna.net...Jaguar#Dark_Age

[callmejon]

Yes that is 25 years or so ahead of mwo timeline. so for now and until Dear Coordinator deems otherwise please proceed with option A.

[MischiefSC]

So the idea is.... you should just not invest in a faction or spend hundreds on multiple accounts?

That's bad and a bad design.

[Ultra-Laser]

MischiefSC, on 05 April 2015 - 06:17 PM, said:

So the idea is.... you should just not invest in a faction or spend hundreds on multiple accounts?

That's bad and a bad design.

From what I recall of the last town hall Russ & Co. didn't really seem to think that most players would even care about sticking with individual factions when they were fist working on CW. Good news is it sounds like their waking up and will be expanding the significance of factions once they've had time to put some polish on the actual game modes.

[Davers]

Ultra-Laser, on 05 April 2015 - 06:40 PM, said:

From what I recall of the last town hall Russ & Co. didn't really seem to think that most players would even care about sticking with individual factions when they were fist working on CW. Good news is it sounds like their waking up and will be expanding the significance of factions once they've had time to put some polish on the actual game modes.

Not surprising. Originally they didn't realize people would even want 'Faction Units'.

I think their original idea for the game was Merc Units fighting over territory that rewarded MC a la WoT, with pugs/pug groups fighting over what is now the CW map.

[AdamBaines]

Davers, on 05 April 2015 - 07:14 PM, said:

Not surprising. Originally they didn't realize people would even want 'Faction Units'.

I think their original idea for the game was Merc Units fighting over territory that rewarded MC a la WoT, with pugs/pug groups fighting over what is now the CW map.

Yea I agree with this, but back with the launch party they outlined a very thorough House/faction life style. I think/believe it was based mostly on community feedback initially that moved to the focused merc life style. That seems to have changed and I'm glad for it as I think a really good and rewarding House/Clan life style would be awesome with rank progression and etc.