178 replies to this topic

[pwnface]

Gyrok, on 13 March 2015 - 12:42 PM, said:

In a CW match last night, dropped against pubs and F i s s i o n was in with them. He ran 3 WVR 6Ks and 1 STK-4N.

He is playing clans because they are OP, right, like all the other guys who say clans are OP...

Wait, those are IS mechs?!? A top tier comp player from a team that professes to play only the most OP mechs in the game was playing quirked IS mechs, with quirked builds, while running with pubs, but clans are OP?

Ok...

You do realize that LORD / EmP both barely play CW right? They pretty much don't give a crap about CW at all and choose their factions randomly. The fact that you are basing your argument about mech balance on what 1 player runs because of what faction his unit has chosen randomly is hilarious.

I can't really respect any of your opinions on gameplay balance because you don't really make any valid arguments. You just scream loudly and point to good players playing good mechs.

xxXKryotech OneXxx, on 12 March 2015 - 04:18 PM, said:

Well the IS mechs are just as powerful as the clans isn't exactly manifesting itself out there on the faction map is it?

The faction map has nothing to do with Clan / IS tech balance.

Population matters more than skill.
Skill matters more than tech.

Tech balance right now is not as horrible as so many people think.

[pwnface]

Ozealot, on 13 March 2015 - 05:00 PM, said:

IS can fire "5 sets of 3 LL volleys" in 7.2 seconds for 125 damage/105 heat, 27 each. Using your (assumed) formula Clans can fire "4 sets of 2 LL volleys" in 7.5 seconds for 88 damage/80 heat, 22 damage each (we don't include Pulse Lasers atm).

IS = 17,7 dps
Clan = 11,7 dps

So Clans only have a dps disadvantage of around 33% or 1/3. That's pretty balanced isn't it? From your point of view. I'd call that a handicap. Maybe you want to elaborate on your statement?

How far do C-ERLL reach out to compared to IS LL?
740m vs 450m
with quirks/modules
814m vs 585m


How much space/weight does C-ERLL take compared to IS LL?
4 tons 1 slot vs 5 tons 2 slots

How far do C-ERML reach?
450m with module, equivalent to a standard IS LL.


Are things balanced?
Not exactly, but it isn't worthy of the QQ you guys are spewing in this thread.


Edit: To quote Gas Guzzler...

Gas Guzzler, on 14 February 2015 - 03:07 AM, said:

As a result of a conversation on twitter I began to compare to loadouts, one is IS and one is Clan. They both consist of 6 lasers.

On one hand, we have 6 IS Large Lasers, with the following specs

54 damage
450 m Range
30 tons
1 second duration
72 Heat (42 w/o Heat Scale)

On the other hand, we have 4 cER Medium Lasers and 2 cLP Lasers

54 Damage
400m/600m range
16 tons
1.12-.15 second duration
44 Heat


What do you guys thing about this?

http://mwomercs.com/...mit-ponderings/

Edited by pwnface, 13 March 2015 - 05:25 PM.

[pwnface]

Actually his post is outdated, heat for a volley of STK-4N 3LL is 16.8 or 33.6 for a 3/3 cycle.

33.6 heat for a 52 damage cycle over 1.5 seconds on a 85t STK-4N w/ 30t of weaponry
vs
44 heat for a 52 damage alpha over 1.15 seconds on a 75t TBR w/ 16t of weaponry

[HARDKOR]

Comparing LL to ERLL is disingenuous. The comparison of laser vomit vs LL is more accurate.

Both are good. Different, but good.

[HARDKOR]

IS LL = C ERML

[HARDKOR]

Nah, Clan ac's have no equivalent and neither do IS AC's. They are different enough weapons to be beyond compare. As in, the Clan ones are garbage and the IS ones are pretty decent.

[ThrashInc]

pwnface, on 13 March 2015 - 05:31 PM, said:

Actually his post is outdated, heat for a volley of STK-4N 3LL is 16.8 or 33.6 for a 3/3 cycle.

33.6 heat for a 52 damage cycle over 1.5 seconds on a 85t STK-4N w/ 30t of weaponry
vs
44 heat for a 52 damage alpha over 1.15 seconds on a 75t TBR w/ 16t of weaponry

Well if we're pretending the 4N has duration quirks, I guess, but ignoring that at best it would be 3/3 over 2.1s for 54 damage for 21+21 heat (pre-heat calculations), which is a silly way to run the 4N anyway because it runs better at 2/2/2 but still.

We'd also have to pretend that firing 4 C-ERLL is in any way similar to firing 3 IS LL.

Since it isn't.

The TBR fires 2 C-ERLL for 18 heat and 22 damage over 1.5s. The TBR fires 3 C-ERLL for 42 heat and 33 damage over 1.5s. The TBR fires 4 C-ERLL for 72 heat and 44 damage over 1.5s. To run 2/2 you'd see 18+18 and 44 damage over 3.1s.


The 4N is able to put out 20% more damage 33% faster at 70% of the range of a TBR at the cost of having to equip 14t of additional weight in weapons.

[pwnface]

Ozealot, on 13 March 2015 - 06:10 PM, said:

You really compare LLs to CERLLs altough you also have ERLLs? To prove what? That this is actually a snake not a dragon in your faction logo?

I was the one that was pointing out that comparing Inner Sphere LL to C-ERLL is incorrect in the first place due to the range difference. Inner Sphere large lasers should be compared to either C-ERML or C-LPL. The entire discussion thus far has been about the STK-4N with 6xLL.

Consider these stats with quirks/modules:

STK-4N LL: 585m range, 27dmg before ghost heat, 16.8 heat per volley
C-ERML: 450m range, 42dmg before ghost heat, 36 heat per volley
C-LPL: 660m range, 26dmg before ghost heat, 20 heat per volley

Both the C-LPL and C-ERML are more similar to the Inner Sphere large laser than the C-ERLL in terms of range.

I believe my statements in this thread have been both factual and fair, I have no reason to "QQ" about anything as I've only stated that the tech is relatively balanced. Your ad hominem fallacy makes you look incredibly stupid here. If you have something useful to contribute beyond "HAHA SNAKE GUY is QQing" please make a non-idiotic response.

[pwnface]

ThrashInc, on 13 March 2015 - 06:47 PM, said:

Well if we're pretending the 4N has duration quirks, I guess, but ignoring that at best it would be 3/3 over 2.1s for 54 damage for 21+21 heat (pre-heat calculations), which is a silly way to run the 4N anyway because it runs better at 2/2/2 but still.

We'd also have to pretend that firing 4 C-ERLL is in any way similar to firing 3 IS LL.

Since it isn't.

The TBR fires 2 C-ERLL for 18 heat and 22 damage over 1.5s. The TBR fires 3 C-ERLL for 42 heat and 33 damage over 1.5s. The TBR fires 4 C-ERLL for 72 heat and 44 damage over 1.5s. To run 2/2 you'd see 18+18 and 44 damage over 3.1s.


The 4N is able to put out 20% more damage 33% faster at 70% of the range of a TBR at the cost of having to equip 14t of additional weight in weapons.

Please show me how you got 2.1seconds for a 3/3 volley.

Inner Sphere large laser beam duration is 1 second, you need to wait 0.5 seconds in order to not trigger ghost heat.
Ergo, 1.5seconds total. Someone please correct me if I've missed something here...

I also disagree with the sentiment that 2/2/2 is somehow better than 3/3. After the IS large laser ghost heat change, I don't see a reason to waste an extra half second to deal the same amount of damage.

The 30% range difference is pretty significant also...

Edited by pwnface, 13 March 2015 - 06:56 PM.

[Gas Guzzler]

Ozealot, on 13 March 2015 - 07:34 PM, said:

Why? To get some nonsense together? Fallacy, to quote you?

ML is to be compared to CML.
ERLL is to be comapred to CERLL.
LPL is to be compared to CLPL.
LL has no Clan equivalent.

Now take modules, quirks, customization possibilities, critslots etc. into your equation all at the same time and you can try to get a picture. Oh and don't forget to get ballistics into the picture, max real PPFLD per techtype, velocity per damage value of the projectiles fired, SRM spread, LRM angle, dps, heat to damage values bla bla bla...

Haha snake guy is speaking with forked tongue. *insanely, idiotic giggle*

A cER ML is more like an IS LL than it is like a IS ML.

cER ML: 405m range, 7 dmg, 6 heat
IS ML: 270m range, 5 dmg, 4 heat
IS LL: 450m range, 9 dmg, 7 heat

How can you argue that IS tech is OP??

In fact, an unquirked 6 LL Stalker without ghost heat would have a comparable alpha to the standard laser vomit TBR (2 c LPL, 4 cER MLs).

[pwnface]

Ozealot, on 13 March 2015 - 07:34 PM, said:

Why? To get some nonsense together? Fallacy, to quote you?

ML is to be compared to CML.
ERLL is to be comapred to CERLL.
LPL is to be compared to CLPL.
LL has no Clan equivalent.

Now take modules, quirks, customization possibilities, critslots etc. into your equation all at the same time and you can try to get a picture. Oh and don't forget to get ballistics into the picture, max real PPFLD per techtype, velocity per damage value of the projectiles fired, SRM spread, LRM angle, dps, heat to damage values bla bla bla...

Haha snake guy is speaking with forked tongue. *insanely, idiotic giggle*

Because people were discussing the STK-4N LL and comparing it to C-ERLL?? I was not the one starting the discussion about the STK-4N 6xLL build, I was correcting misrepresented information and giving my opinion. If you can't understand the context behind a post please don't post stupid responses.


Do you even have an argument or are you just here to say everyone is wrong just because?

Edited by pwnface, 13 March 2015 - 08:42 PM.

[pwnface]

Can't fix stupid I guess, owell I'll continue enjoying beating noobs like you with my "OP" mechs.

No point in arguing with someone who refuses to even make valid arguments.

Edited by pwnface, 14 March 2015 - 12:17 AM.

[DaFrog]

Necromantion, on 22 February 2015 - 09:17 AM, said:

I am so tired of playing against OP is mechs and weapons....

1) Why are all your AC's front-loaded damage rather than 5 pellet bursts that allow you to hit the component you aim at and not spread damage if a target is moving, and it allows you to use cover better

2) Why do you get all these nice reduced heat quirks that let you mash your alpha key while I get to feather 1-2 weapon groups in a forced battle situation and risk overheating while you run around me going LOLOLOLOLOL ALPHA ALPHA ALPHA

3) Why do you get reduced burn-time on lasers that lets you use cover to better advantage?

4) Why do your lights travel at 120+ KPH and have better load-outs than an ice ferret and have jump jets?


Why? Why must My stupid clan tech make me stay out in the open to use the full burn time on my lasers that is at times twice the duration of yours resulting in all that pinpoint damage from PPCs and AC's all over my face.... whyyyyyyyy? Its so OP and unfair...


Seriously though, I am tired of bad pilots saying that Clan* tech is OP. I am usually blunt and direct while remaining tactful but this time I will digress.


Join an organized unit, use your mechs quirks to optimize your builds, alter your play style to use those quirks/builds to their optimal use and if that fails then GET BETTER.

Good grief, our unit plays both IS and Clan and our win/loss is the same on both. On our clan weeks our better fights have been vs IS groups like 228/OLD etc who do exactly what I said above in bold.

This game is not hard, you make it hard for yourself.

*Edit: Because I never realized I wrote IS instead of Clan >.<

Please let me have lasers with longer burn time on IS mechs so I can correct my crappy aim from the center torso to a head shot every f ing time...

[A Large Infant]

Comparisons of the stalker to the timber wolf amuse me considering the timber wolf is a whole third faster

[Alienized]

this thread needs to go to k-town immediatly. please start the race towards it.

[Ripper X]

What the Inner Sphere forces seriously needs is a viable heavy mech that can carry ECM.

[Wrayeth]

Alienized, on 14 March 2015 - 07:09 AM, said:

this thread needs to go to k-town immediatly. please start the race towards it.

<3 Amon Amarth

[Alienized]

Ripper X, on 14 March 2015 - 08:26 AM, said:

What the Inner Sphere forces seriously needs is a viable heavy mech that can carry ECM.

no we dont.
people dont even know how to play a atlas d-dc properly so forget a heavy.
IS needs alot more of anything but a heavy with ecm.
it will be just another sniper or lrm thrower.

[LordKnightFandragon]

IS tech isnt really OP, though they do have some very nice strong points. Esp the quirked mechs. And those PPFLD Auto cannons sure are a nice little perk. IS isnt OP, but it sure as hell isnt UP. And Clans are not near the OP players are claiming.

[HARDKOR]

Alienized, on 14 March 2015 - 01:09 PM, said:

no we dont.
people dont even know how to play a atlas d-dc properly so forget a heavy.
IS needs alot more of anything but a heavy with ecm.
it will be just another sniper or lrm thrower.

Shh,
I want a tbolt with ECM.