74 replies to this topic

[LordKnightFandragon]

zudukai, on 06 March 2015 - 12:14 PM, said:

The Adder has potential to be a venomous beast! just as much of a chance to as the warhawk does with quirks.

And hopefully when they quirk up the WHK P's energy power and PPC Velocity, that mech will be alot nicer to.

My dream quirk really is a 50% dmg increase so we get a 15/15 CERPPC on the WHK. It wont happen, but I have alot of hopeless dreams...

[Bloodweaver]

I think the Adder Prime, Warhawk Prime, and Summoner Prime should all be given a quirk that lets them do more focused damage with their ERPPCs, as opposed to the typical Clan spread of 10+2.5+2.5 damage. You don't need more than 15 damage, just make more than 10 of it hit the central point. They should also have the option to retain lower arm actuators even with ERPPCs, and Summoner Prime should have that option for both arms regardless of what ballistic it uses.

Edited by Bloodweaver, 11 March 2015 - 11:02 AM.

[DrRedCoat]

Kain Thul, on 10 March 2015 - 03:08 PM, said:

Firing 4 C-ERPPCs even with the 'mech full of DHS and elited results in a shutdown.

**** that. I ran the 4 x C-ERPPC build with pure DHS for a while and it is just completely sub par compared to the builds I posted on page 1. The problem is you will not always be able to dictate range and number of targets so that if everything goes your way you can sit at the back and carefully manage your heat but if your position gets pushed you hit the heat cap fast and then you are going to get hammered while waiting to shoot again as your rate of fire slows.

If your position gets pushed then your team is dead and you've already lost the match anyway. Saying that the possibility of not being able to dictate the range makes a loadout bad means that LRM builds are also bad. We all know how true that is.

[FearNotDeath]

Get the warhawk for the aesthetics alone. Eventually it will be completely obsolete when a mech like the Deimos beats it at everything for the same weight.

[LordKnightFandragon]

FearNotDeath, on 12 March 2015 - 07:31 PM, said:

Get the warhawk for the aesthetics alone. Eventually it will be completely obsolete when a mech like the Deimos beats it at everything for the same weight.

Lol, and it only looks like a warhawk when it has the PPCs on it, otherwise it just looks like it got neutered with those stubby laser pods.

[NUJRSYDEVIL]

My two cents: the x4 LPL with range mod and the rest DHS is effective when the LPLs are chain fired. I was getting tired of shooting 2x2 and having to retreat after firing a few shots due to heat.

Having said that, this variant is still banned from CW. Too big a target, not enough armor.

[Mad Ox]

Good luck Warhawk was real pain initially for me but once I redid it to fit my play style was a very nasty mech.

Considering your liking the seriously gimped trail version you should be more then good for an owned one.

[Kain Demos]

DrRedCoat, on 11 March 2015 - 06:00 PM, said:

If your position gets pushed then your team is dead and you've already lost the match anyway. Saying that the possibility of not being able to dictate the range makes a loadout bad means that LRM builds are also bad. We all know how true that is.

So, are you disagreeing with me an then agreeing with me or do you actually think that is a valid build and that LRMs are not a waste?

[LordKnightFandragon]

Bloodweaver, on 11 March 2015 - 11:00 AM, said:

I think the Adder Prime, Warhawk Prime, and Summoner Prime should all be given a quirk that lets them do more focused damage with their ERPPCs, as opposed to the typical Clan spread of 10+2.5+2.5 damage. You don't need more than 15 damage, just make more than 10 of it hit the central point. They should also have the option to retain lower arm actuators even with ERPPCs, and Summoner Prime should have that option for both arms regardless of what ballistic it uses.

If the goal is to prevent PPC Spam again, then yes, they should give the Adder/SMR/WHK the 15/15 CERPPC damage quirk, 30% veocity buff and a quirk that reduces cool down on the CERPPC to 4.5 or 5s. That way, its better damage, little longer cool downs. Then, other Clan mechs have normal meh CERPPC, but the mechs that are suppsoed to have them have good ones. Besides, Clans are being quirked based on their 8/8 omni pod bonus....so a WHK-P should defs get some good CERPPC quirks. Maybe even a 10% heat dissipation bonus, since it has masses of 1.4 Heat sinks and not 2.0s.

[Bloodweaver]

LordKnightFandragon, on 14 March 2015 - 09:00 PM, said:

If the goal is to prevent PPC Spam again, then yes, they should give the Adder/SMR/WHK the 15/15 CERPPC damage quirk, 30% veocity buff and a quirk that reduces cool down on the CERPPC to 4.5 or 5s. That way, its better damage, little longer cool downs. Then, other Clan mechs have normal meh CERPPC, but the mechs that are suppsoed to have them have good ones. Besides, Clans are being quirked based on their 8/8 omni pod bonus....so a WHK-P should defs get some good CERPPC quirks. Maybe even a 10% heat dissipation bonus, since it has masses of 1.4 Heat sinks and not 2.0s.

15/15 may be a bit much, especially if it's combined with heat reduction quirks and (what I would really like to see for these three variants) arm mobility quirks. Even 12/1.5/1.5 or 13/1/1 would be enough to make a significant difference.

I'd like to see the following quirks when all omnipods are of the same variant:

Summoner Prime - full 15 damage in one spot, moderate velocity buff, and strong cooldown buff, since it can only carry one PPC.

Adder Prime - 13/1/1 damage + strong velocity buff. Heat reduction buff when two PPCs are used(if only one is used, this quirk does not appear).

Warhawk Prime - 12/1.5/1.5 damage + strong heat reduction buff - make every two PPCs count as one, or something. So you'd need to mount either 2 or 4 to really benefit - 1 alone does nothing for heat reduction, and mounting three only eliminates the heat for one of them.

With lower quirk values if the relevant omnipods are matched with non-Prime ones. And the option to keep lower arm actuators on all of the above(Gargoyles could use this too...).

Edited by Bloodweaver, 14 March 2015 - 10:14 PM.

[LordKnightFandragon]

Bloodweaver, on 14 March 2015 - 09:57 PM, said:

15/15 may be a bit much, especially if it's combined with heat reduction quirks and (what I would really like to see for these three variants) arm mobility quirks. Even 12/1.5/1.5 or 13/1/1 would be enough to make a significant difference.

I'd like to see the following quirks when all omnipods are of the same variant:

Summoner Prime - full 15 damage in one spot, moderate velocity buff, and strong cooldown buff, since it can only carry one PPC.

Adder Prime - 13/1/1 damage + strong velocity buff. Heat reduction buff when two PPCs are used(if only one is used, this quirk does not appear).

Warhawk Prime - 12/1.5/1.5 damage + strong heat reduction buff - make every two PPCs count as one, or something. So you'd need to mount either 2 or 4 to really benefit - 1 alone does nothing for heat reduction, and mounting three only eliminates the heat for one of them.

With lower quirk values if the relevant omnipods are matched with non-Prime ones. And the option to keep lower arm actuators on all of the above(Gargoyles could use this too...).

WHK needs velocity buffs to, the velocity on those ERPPCs...its terrible lol. 1000ms? I can only imagine the IS PPC of 900.....yikes.

[Bloodweaver]

LordKnightFandragon, on 15 March 2015 - 01:10 PM, said:

WHK needs velocity buffs to, the velocity on those ERPPCs...its terrible lol. 1000ms? I can only imagine the IS PPC of 900.....yikes.

I think the velocity would become less significant once heat stops being such a huge issue. You'd have four cERPPCs as opposed to one or two. That alone should offset the velocity disadvantage quite a bit. And with strong heat reduction quirks, you would be able to actually use all four of them to full effect, allowing you to be more "suppressive fire" than "sniper" (as with the Adder quirks) or "brawler/dueller" (as with the Summoner's). In this way each of those variants fulfills a different role, but they're all still cERPPC-centric.

It also gives them specific role advantages to differentiate them from the other (and, often, generally superior 'mechs) in their respective weight classes. Among the Clan assaults, for example - Dairy Whales would continue to fill the mega-DeathStar-OP-murderhouse-ultrafirepower role, Warhawks could fill a support and/or battle-longevity role(due to heat quirks), and this leaves an open spot for agility and tanking for which Gargoyles could be quirked, finally giving them a place as well(trying to quirk Gargoyle firepower is kind of dumb - instead give it some good armor/internal structure buffs, and excellent agility buffs).

Edited by Bloodweaver, 15 March 2015 - 01:57 PM.

[Josef Koba]

I've had a tremendous amount of success in my Warhawks. It's one of my most reliable performers, so I'm a fan. However, I'd be hard pressed to pick between the DW and the Hawk if I had to. In my opinion, they're both pretty solid keeping in mind their respective strengths and limitations. They're perhaps not interchangeable, it should be said, but both are good to go. Can't go wrong with either, just depends on what you want to do with it. The other folks here have given some sound guidance; just wanted to give my support for the seemingly under-appreciated Warhawk.

[Hit the Deck]

Bloodweaver, on 15 March 2015 - 01:55 PM, said:

..., and this leaves an open spot for agility and tanking for which Gargoyles could be quirked, finally giving them a place as well(trying to quirk Gargoyle firepower is kind of dumb - instead give it some good armor/internal structure buffs, and excellent agility buffs).

B..b..but we will get the Executioner.

[NUJRSYDEVIL]

It didn't take long for everyone to figure out that the Gargoyle is useless. I'm very surprised when I see it even in pug drops.

The Executioner will most likely make it extinct once and for all.