83 replies to this topic

[waterfowl]

Right now I'm getting 2 failures for every success. And it's not because I'm bad, it's because I don't play to kill steal. Right now you're rewarding people who play like idiots, who don't play to win, with free stuff. And you're punishing people who don't play like idiots, who try to win the match rather than kill steal, by withholding free stuff. Unless I pilot some stupid high burst damage mech that I hate driving and then fight my own team for kills, I won't get to 50 within 3 days. It will take upwards of 150 games. Almost 13 hours if I spend 5 minutes in each game (lol). Over 3 days.

This is unacceptable and it destroys the quality of the game for the duration of the event. I think we can all agree that everyone has been playing like an idiot for every single tournament with kill requirements. Moreover it also fatigues players who grind it out, making them not want to play for a month. You could argue that the event is optional, but a free mech & bay will make it appear non optional to most people.

REPLACE THE KILL REQUIREMENT WITH A POINT SYSTEM! IT'S NOT OKAY TO MAKE YOUR OWN TEAM A BIGGER OBSTACLE THAN THE OTHER TEAM! IT'S NOT OKAY TO SHOEHORN EVERYONE INTO STUPID MECHS LOADOUTS!

[Soy]

Ever stop to think that your struggle is PGI's opportunity to study data and metrics of why you're struggling?

And that could potentially have good impact down the line in terms of netcoding, client optimization, map design, weapon balance, matchmaker, Elo, etc?

This is what the original tournaments were for. Stress testing and brute force encouraging more guinea pigs/numbers.

Edited by Soy, 28 February 2015 - 12:44 PM.

[FupDup]

I don't like the "all or nothing" style where a match either counts or it doesn't count. Instead, I think they should have a more granular system where each individual activity by itself gives you a point, and then when you reach X points you unlock a challenge tier. Kills, assists, wins, survival, and maybe other things would be potential conditions.

Somebody should be able to finish the event even if they only perform in one of those areas, but obviously someone who does well in every area will complete the event a lot faster.

[Beld]

1 Kill 1 Assist, you're hardly being asked to carry the weight of the world on your shoulders, and you know what, you don't have to do it, you can play exactly the same as any other day and ignore the event.

[Cyborne Elemental]

I like a point system too, but one build on assists and raw damage, not so much wins or kills.

Yeah, its derpy, but it creates a much more relaxed event when everyone isn't out to press the "FULL RE-TARD" button and go ballistic on everyone, including their teamates.

When everyone is going FULL RE-TARD, I'm forced into doing it as well, problem is, I'm really good at playing like **** now thanks to the level of DERP in the pub que, where otherwise I might actually try, during events like this I just kinda.. give up.

[Impossible Wasabi]

Welcome to MWO, enjoy your stay.

Challenges, when the few good matches one can play, are rapidly replaced with a series of extended patience testers.

Edited by The True Space Pope, 28 February 2015 - 12:57 PM.

[waterfowl]

Beld, on 28 February 2015 - 12:54 PM, said:

1 Kill 1 Assist, you're hardly being asked to carry the weight of the world on your shoulders, and you know what, you don't have to do it, you can play exactly the same as any other day and ignore the event.

jesus christ did you even read what I said? I covered everything you just blathered. Let me reiterate for you.

1. Everyone is playing like an idiot to get a kill so you can't ignore it
2. Getting kills in an ECM light is a rare occurance especially when half the field is dual gauss or LRM60
3. Hard to get a kill in stomps that occur in higher proportions during events
4. There are far better point systems they could use, that they have used in the past, that encourage cooperative play
5. The idea of fighting your own teammates to get kills destroys the team aspect of the game

Edited by waterfowl, 28 February 2015 - 01:00 PM.

[Roadkill]

FupDup, on 28 February 2015 - 12:44 PM, said:

I think they should have a more granular system where each individual activity by itself gives you a point, and then when you reach X points you unlock a challenge tier. Kills, assists, wins, survival, and maybe other things would be potential conditions.

You mean, like, maybe just add up the match score you receive in each match?

Nah, that'd make too much sense.

[ArchMage Sparrowhawk]

Beld, on 28 February 2015 - 12:54 PM, said:

1 Kill 1 Assist, you're hardly being asked to carry the weight of the world on your shoulders, and you know what, you don't have to do it, you can play exactly the same as any other day and ignore the event.

problem with that is it makes people even more mercenary than usual. My back gets lit up normally, but this weekend, standing near your enemy target with your teammates behind you is a suicidal action.

I can get one kill and one assist, but that doesn't necessarily mean I'm playing well, or defensive, or helping my team win at all. And when most of the people on the team are doing just that, it's funny that one side always seems to roll the other. it's nice when you're with the tide, but not so nice when you're under it.

[Sug]

It's definitely not an easy thing to balance. Without needing the win condition I've seen people get their kill/assist and then suicide. And needing the Win can be frustrating in itself. Can't have an assist give you a point cause then we'd see more people rushing and suiciding. Same thing results from having a set number of matches to play.

I've liked the events where we get those random rewards based on a scoring formula or where the whole playerbase contributes to setting the % of the sale price of some items.

[Wrathful Scythe]

I don't know why everyone needs to get everything? It's an Adder for gods sake. While I would favor a System where I need to get 50 kills/assists instead of 50 matches with certain requirements but I couldn't care less about the adder or the consumeables.

Just don't play on the weekends. It's as easy as that. If those 4-5 teammates, which follow that panther to the edge of the map, annoy you that much: Find a group of friends or avoid the game.

[Alistair Winter]

FupDup, on 28 February 2015 - 12:44 PM, said:

I don't like the "all or nothing" style where a match either counts or it doesn't count. Instead, I think they should have a more granular system where each individual activity by itself gives you a point, and then when you reach X points you unlock a challenge tier. Kills, assists, wins, survival, and maybe other things would be potential conditions.

Somebody should be able to finish the event even if they only perform in one of those areas, but obviously someone who does well in every area will complete the event a lot faster.

Yeah, I saw someone else suggest this. He was very eloquent, had some great ideas. He was of slender, but muscular build, with rugged, masculine beauty and a well-trimmed beard. And he had many amusing anecdotes and popular forum threads. A Norwegian, I think. I forget his name.

Something like
Win: 30 points
Survival: 10 points (though 20 would be my personal preference)
Kill: 10 points
Assist: 10 points
Conquest base cap assist: 5 points
Conquest solo base cap: 10 points

Personally, I'd also like to see 3 points for destroying a turret in Assault mode. For two reasons: First of all, I don't like the fact that Assault is basically Skirmish 90% of the time. Second of all, I'd like to see challenges that actually have an impact on how the game is played, for the sake of variety. Rewards for destroying turrets would make base capping a bigger threat on both sides and hopefully result in teams spreading out a bit more. Sure, some light mechs would play like fools and leave their team behind to farm turrets. But 3 points would be a good compromise, I think.

[Sug]

Roadkill, on 28 February 2015 - 01:00 PM, said:

You mean, like, maybe just add up the match score you receive in each match?

Nah, that'd make too much sense.

Still kinda punishes the new players. They have to make it less grindy. Keep the tiered rewards, like the 10, 20, 30, etc points, but make the event accessible to everyone while rewarding the better players.


Get a point for playing a match, winning, getting a kill, surviving, and getting an assist. So you can earn 5 points each match. Better players will be able to blow through it very quickly and feel rewarded and the less skilled players won't walk away empty handed.

The point of the event is to be fun. More fun ---> More players ---> Moar $ for PGI.

A grind turns off the new players, and the established whales would probably rather have an actual tournament with some unique prizes rather than earn a light mech through grinding.

Edited by Sug, 01 March 2015 - 07:49 AM.

[His Holiness Pope Buster]

It doesn't fail. Every single event someone complains about it. I think the event is fine. I like that PGI changes the requirements from event to event. There will always be players who exhibit 'team' play and those who don't.

[Shalune]

Beld, on 28 February 2015 - 12:54 PM, said:

1 Kill 1 Assist, you're hardly being asked to carry the weight of the world on your shoulders, and you know what, you don't have to do it, you can play exactly the same as any other day and ignore the event.

Assists are a gimme, but kills are very build dependent. Unless you're taking something with a high pinpoint (or close enough a la 5SS) alpha getting a kill in any given game is pretty unpredictable. On top of this there's only so many kills to go around. Even if you win by kills one guy getting 2 means at least someone else got 0.

The issue people are raising is that even for a good player with relatively lethal mechs you're talking about getting 1 point every other game, with the only prizes of note past the premium time being at 50-80.

((50->80) x 2) x ~7 minute games ~= 700->1120 minutes ~= 11.6 -> 18.6 hours not counting queue times.

That's a daunting amount of time to present players with and only scales up for people playing support roles or who aren't as good at the game. Given the relative lack of interesting rewards leading up to the Adder it's a huge damper on motivation to participate at all.

[Dale Grible]

I agree with the OP. At least they took out the survive requirement. The problem with 1 kill 1 assist is say you deal most damage on 3 mechs but some lone partystarter boating 6ml comes up and alphas the mech u utterly destroyed but he gets the kill. Happens to everyone. I have plenty of 500 dmg matches only 7 assists. No kills.

I am an advocate of 2 columns on the match end screen. 1 for most dmg dealt such as 2 meaning 2 mechs you faced u dealt the most dmg to. The other is team dmg dealt i.e. how much dmg u dealt to your own team. The back shooting by your own team to get that kill is ridiculous.

1 last idea. Dmg dealt divided by say 300 or 400 = possibly 1 kill. If u have a 600 dmg match, u more than pulled your weight and thus should be rewarded. 600 divided by 300 equals 2 kills.

[Event Horizon]

I agree this challenge in particular has caused players to only care about kills and not about actually winning the match. This makes it very difficult to grind a mech. Everyone just runs after any easy kill with total disregard for anything else. Players are even going so far as to shoot their own teammates in the way of a shot just to get a kill.

Edited by Eugenics, 28 February 2015 - 01:19 PM.

[Novawrecker]

waterfowl, on 28 February 2015 - 12:42 PM, said:

... it's because I don't play to kill steal ...

Neither does anyone else. Last I checked, there is no "Kill stealing". This was the team based game MWO, not any single player games of a platform like DS Pokemon

[Abivard]

You can't fix stupid, ergo, you can't fix PGI.

[C E Dwyer]

its an event..doesn't really matter what style it takes people will bomb in it or not