Jump to content

A Nova Workshop


190 replies to this topic

#41 Ultimax

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Ace Of Spades
  • Ace Of Spades
  • 6,979 posts

Posted 09 March 2015 - 04:08 PM

View PostSoy, on 09 March 2015 - 03:56 PM, said:


I don't. I figure I don't need to crit seek, just need to keep TTK high and cooldown as quick as possible. So straight cDHS (and armor).

That's just how I roll though.

Mcgral was speaking the other day about the TC1 for this mech and I can see reasons for even using cAP if wanting to look at paperdoll is something you're keen on. I typically just try and memorize everything on the fly and not go by paperdoll.



More than just the crit seeking, I like the faster paper doll read out.

Active probe is a good alternative though with faster read out.

#42 Mcgral18

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • CS 2019 Top 8 Qualifier
  • CS 2019 Top 8 Qualifier
  • 17,987 posts
  • LocationSnow

Posted 09 March 2015 - 04:12 PM

View PostSoy, on 09 March 2015 - 04:04 PM, said:


- Cool, thanks for dropping in! :)

- Apparently you're a top Nova pilot, so I wouldn't expect you to learn anything at all. It's not supposed to be patronizing, it's supposed to be tongue-in-cheek by the way (especially the first part). :P

- The last half includes a part where I get my arms blown off and am reserved to acting like a complete moron. Cuz that's what happens when you play against great shots or try and take a bad position and force it.

- I tried to check your smurfy's but it wasn't working for some reason? One even gave a "502 bad gateway" or something. Am I doing something wrong?

- Yeah, being seen ruins everything. xD

- It could be designed smaller, but, what can we do about it now ya know? *looks at PGI*

- There are definitely worse robots out there. You say it can be salvagable; how so? You talkin quirks??? Reworking the scaling on Clan meds/hevs? Wat.

- Hell yeah it's the best glass cannon! Definitely feast or famine both in results and sometimes fun as well. xD

Thanks for actually critiquing. ;)


Quirks are probably the most logical thing; easing Clam restrictions being the other. One is far more likely than the other.

Other things are the state of MGs. Nova can carry 5, although the 5% less heat far exceeds the value of the 5th MG. They've taken a 25% overall nerf in DPS since last year, between the 20% damage nerf and 15% crit nerf.

Otherwise, structure, armour, or I suppose acceleration.



I did finish it, and a few surprising things. A quad PPC stalker....What year is it!?

And no coolshots...you insane person.

View PostFupDup, on 09 March 2015 - 04:07 PM, said:

Mist Lynx?


Fridge as well. Mr Gargles. Adder.

#43 Deathlike

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Littlest Helper
  • Littlest Helper
  • 29,240 posts
  • Location#NOToTaterBalance #BadBalanceOverlordIsBad

Posted 09 March 2015 - 04:16 PM

TBH, you have to be an excellent pilot to even make the Nova seem decent. That is the tragedy. It certainly needs something to get over the hump.

The thing is, I occasionally think of it as the Trebuchet-5J. Unless you go full lurms with the Trebuchets in general... it is fortunate that the Nova is better than the Trebuchet.

It's a freaking low bar to be set... and just recently the Trebuchet got internal structure buffs from the arms. Nova? Just hug thee Nova.

#44 Soy

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 3,689 posts
  • Locationtrue Lord system

Posted 09 March 2015 - 04:18 PM

View PostMcgral18, on 09 March 2015 - 04:12 PM, said:

Quirks are probably the most logical thing; easing Clam restrictions being the other. One is far more likely than the other.

Other things are the state of MGs. Nova can carry 5, although the 5% less heat far exceeds the value of the 5th MG. They've taken a 25% overall nerf in DPS since last year, between the 20% damage nerf and 15% crit nerf.

Otherwise, structure, armour, or I suppose acceleration.

I did finish it, and a few surprising things. A quad PPC stalker....What year is it!?

And no coolshots...you insane person.


I look at MGs as nothing but more fragility (on the Nova). That's why I cut them out of my equation for my builds...

I think the logic behind them paired with too many MLs is silly... if you're doing full duration stares with MLs, that's a medium/long type of position and approach right... so were do the MGs come into the equation on that? Maybe if you're running 8 MLs or so I can see the synergy being better. But as it stands I think they're silly for pairing with 10+...

-

Coolshots are for weak newbs! xD I'm not a fan of consumables, you'll never see me crutch those. I have thought about running 2x UAV just to decoy enemy's views at it for a split second in order to find openings or move around rocks/etc and staying unchecked. ;)

-

Quirks........ yeah................. bah, this is why I decided last night to master the 3rd Nova, we'll see what happens... zzz -.-

Edited by Soy, 09 March 2015 - 04:20 PM.


#45 Deathlike

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Littlest Helper
  • Littlest Helper
  • 29,240 posts
  • Location#NOToTaterBalance #BadBalanceOverlordIsBad

Posted 09 March 2015 - 04:32 PM

View PostSoy, on 09 March 2015 - 04:18 PM, said:

Quirks........ yeah................. bah, this is why I decided last night to master the 3rd Nova, we'll see what happens... zzz -.-


You might as well get it done ASAP. The Ice Fridge... I meant Ferret is getting quirks. Maybe next time.

#46 Soy

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 3,689 posts
  • Locationtrue Lord system

Posted 09 March 2015 - 05:15 PM

Well, at least in 3 hours the only person to present a critical argument against the mech, is ironically one of the best pilots of it?

I feel satisfied about the mech's capability, it's weaknesses, and the potential quirk passes it might see. I just hope the quirk passes don't pidgeonhole the mech into using specific ****... boo. -.-

#47 Deathlike

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Littlest Helper
  • Littlest Helper
  • 29,240 posts
  • Location#NOToTaterBalance #BadBalanceOverlordIsBad

Posted 09 March 2015 - 05:34 PM

View PostSoy, on 09 March 2015 - 05:15 PM, said:

Well, at least in 3 hours the only person to present a critical argument against the mech, is ironically one of the best pilots of it?


He's saying exactly what we all acknowledge as a problem with the mech. I mean, what do you want with the brutal honest truth?

Quote

I feel satisfied about the mech's capability, it's weaknesses, and the potential quirk passes it might see. I just hope the quirk passes don't pidgeonhole the mech into using specific ****... boo. -.-


Well, there's a chance some of them will be pigeonholed (Nova-A being a pure ERPPC boat), but it's likely to be more generalized quirks for heat, structure, and torso twisting.

Although, I'll be amused when the LRM Nova becomes available.

#48 RedDevil

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • The Slayer
  • The Slayer
  • 702 posts

Posted 09 March 2015 - 05:34 PM

Well it currently has -10% heat for all energy weapons, so besides hitboxes, what more would it really need? Cooldown would just make it overheat faster. That leaves range increases, or structure or mobility.

I would like structure personally.

#49 Zordicron

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Overlord
  • Overlord
  • 2,547 posts

Posted 09 March 2015 - 05:41 PM

View PostSoy, on 09 March 2015 - 03:51 PM, said:


..? :blink:



You will have to give me more than a ? if you would like a response. I am not sure what you are questioning or confused about.

#50 Soy

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 3,689 posts
  • Locationtrue Lord system

Posted 09 March 2015 - 05:43 PM

View PostDeathlike, on 09 March 2015 - 05:34 PM, said:


He's saying exactly what we all acknowledge as a problem with the mech. I mean, what do you want with the brutal honest truth?



Well, there's a chance some of them will be pigeonholed (Nova-A being a pure ERPPC boat), but it's likely to be more generalized quirks for heat, structure, and torso twisting.

Although, I'll be amused when the LRM Nova becomes available.


I can't deny that I do indeed put more emphasis into the words of players who are of a higher standard. Of course this also means they get more riposte in a serious discussion, but in the case of Mcgral I acquiesce to everything he stated. I also agreed with several other people who posted it in a clear and concise manner as well previously in the thread. :)

As far as LRM Novas-



View PostEldagore, on 09 March 2015 - 05:41 PM, said:

You will have to give me more than a ? if you would like a response. I am not sure what you are questioning or confused about.


I mean... you talked about poptarting not working, it works great on the Nova, better than any other Clan mech. Currently.

Edited by Soy, 09 March 2015 - 05:52 PM.


#51 Quicksilver Aberration

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • The Nightmare
  • The Nightmare
  • 11,659 posts
  • LocationKansas City, MO

Posted 09 March 2015 - 06:09 PM

View PostDeathlike, on 09 March 2015 - 05:34 PM, said:

Although, I'll be amused when the LRM Nova becomes available.

You left out the best part. An LRM20 backed up by...................an LBX5, that's it. 2 tons of ammo for both weapons and that is all it has.

#52 Mcgral18

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • CS 2019 Top 8 Qualifier
  • CS 2019 Top 8 Qualifier
  • 17,987 posts
  • LocationSnow

Posted 09 March 2015 - 06:35 PM

View PostDeathlike, on 09 March 2015 - 05:34 PM, said:

Although, I'll be amused when the LRM Nova becomes available.

View PostSoy, on 09 March 2015 - 05:43 PM, said:

As far as LRM Novas-


Missiles?
Posted Image

With the magic of Copy Paste, you have have MISSILES!
Posted Image

#53 Soy

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 3,689 posts
  • Locationtrue Lord system

Posted 09 March 2015 - 06:36 PM

View PostWM Quicksilver, on 09 March 2015 - 06:09 PM, said:

You left out the best part. An LRM20 backed up by...................an LBX5, that's it. 2 tons of ammo for both weapons and that is all it has.


Posted Image

#54 SkyHammyr

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Survivor
  • Survivor
  • 462 posts

Posted 09 March 2015 - 06:44 PM

i love how that Ember just stood there and took it at 4:30,,,
I wish more light pilots did that for me.

#55 Soy

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 3,689 posts
  • Locationtrue Lord system

Posted 09 March 2015 - 06:48 PM

View PostSkyHammr, on 09 March 2015 - 06:44 PM, said:

i love how that Ember just stood there and took it at 4:30,,,
I wish more light pilots did that for me.


Nova is the type of mech that can punish players for making bad moves, very quickly. Basically instantly sometimes.

Similar to it being punished for making bad moves itself, also very quickly.

Definitely feast or famine...

Edited by Soy, 09 March 2015 - 06:49 PM.


#56 Zordicron

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Overlord
  • Overlord
  • 2,547 posts

Posted 09 March 2015 - 07:43 PM

View PostSoy, on 09 March 2015 - 05:43 PM, said:


I mean... you talked about poptarting not working, it works great on the Nova, better than any other Clan mech. Currently.


I guess, but that doesnt mean it actually works. I don't bother, as when I see other players trying to I promptly give them a faceful of laser fire that far surpasses what they try to dish out. The Nova has to expose over the top of it's cover farther than what I consider passable for decent poptart function.

In pug land mind you. Coordinated play, I dunno, maybe it would work because, well, coordinated. In pug land, any decent player will paste you well before you are back into cover.

maybe JJ buffs would make the Nova into too good a poptart, i dunno. My gut feeling is, prolly not. I feel making JJ work for the Nova, how they used to, would help with vertical escapes, as it isnt quick enough to escape otherwise, and is a big target for it's tonnage. being able to quickly go skyward over a brawler's line of fire would at least buy it some time when it gets cornered. As it is, the JJ accelerate upward too slowly at first, so the brawler mech just gets a good clean shot on your legs most of the time. Better than CT I guess, but i would prefer better JJ. It would also allow the Nova to reach higher platforms more easily.


Basically, i think it needs that advantage to give it some uniqueness. I am also looking at this as all the mechs, not just clans. In pug land, that matters more than CW, because there is not just "Nova or crows"(or the fridge) but Nova or ALL ELSE. And vs all else, IMO, is where it shows its limitations. Other mediums can outperform it's agility, and defenses, and still have enough firepower to not be overshadowed by the Nova in that regard. The "2 out of 3, speed, firepower, defense" well the Nova has 1. In regards to just clans- there is no comparison to a crow, or even the Fridge. the 3 mechs are just, different. Like comparing a Cicada, a BJ, and a Griffin. They just ain't the same Pa!

When comparing the Nova to all the mediums in game, I do not think it warrants the "it suxxxx!!' it has gotten. But it isn't near the top either. it is profoundly average, because the strength of clan lasers- with a caveat of an ability to do amazing dmg, but unreliable at that. Baseline, in pugland, IMO it does better than a 1/3 of the mediums or so, with ability to occasionally do outstanding performance. With some help, That baseline would be raised and put it solidly in the middle of the pack, with player ability able to push it higher. And that's where I want to see it. We don't need another EZ mode Crow medium.

In the end, my opinion on quirks is formed based on it's current performance, while still wanting to try to keep some kind of resemblance to it's roots. if we make it super agile to give it speed and firepower, it loses its roots. IMO, giving it stout ST would reflect on the idea it didnt have any torso twist so it was a little more stout because of simplicity- at least i could buy that as a lore idea. In any case, I do not want to see quirks that copypasta the Nova into a Crow with a different shape.

#57 Soy

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 3,689 posts
  • Locationtrue Lord system

Posted 09 March 2015 - 07:48 PM

View PostEldagore, on 09 March 2015 - 07:43 PM, said:


I guess, but that doesnt mean it actually works. I don't bother, as when I see other players trying to I promptly give them a faceful of laser fire that far surpasses what they try to dish out. The Nova has to expose over the top of it's cover farther than what I consider passable for decent poptart function.

In pug land mind you. Coordinated play, I dunno, maybe it would work because, well, coordinated. In pug land, any decent player will paste you well before you are back into cover.

maybe JJ buffs would make the Nova into too good a poptart, i dunno. My gut feeling is, prolly not. I feel making JJ work for the Nova, how they used to, would help with vertical escapes, as it isnt quick enough to escape otherwise, and is a big target for it's tonnage. being able to quickly go skyward over a brawler's line of fire would at least buy it some time when it gets cornered. As it is, the JJ accelerate upward too slowly at first, so the brawler mech just gets a good clean shot on your legs most of the time. Better than CT I guess, but i would prefer better JJ. It would also allow the Nova to reach higher platforms more easily.


Basically, i think it needs that advantage to give it some uniqueness. I am also looking at this as all the mechs, not just clans. In pug land, that matters more than CW, because there is not just "Nova or crows"(or the fridge) but Nova or ALL ELSE. And vs all else, IMO, is where it shows its limitations. Other mediums can outperform it's agility, and defenses, and still have enough firepower to not be overshadowed by the Nova in that regard. The "2 out of 3, speed, firepower, defense" well the Nova has 1. In regards to just clans- there is no comparison to a crow, or even the Fridge. the 3 mechs are just, different. Like comparing a Cicada, a BJ, and a Griffin. They just ain't the same Pa!

When comparing the Nova to all the mediums in game, I do not think it warrants the "it suxxxx!!' it has gotten. But it isn't near the top either. it is profoundly average, because the strength of clan lasers- with a caveat of an ability to do amazing dmg, but unreliable at that. Baseline, in pugland, IMO it does better than a 1/3 of the mediums or so, with ability to occasionally do outstanding performance. With some help, That baseline would be raised and put it solidly in the middle of the pack, with player ability able to push it higher. And that's where I want to see it. We don't need another EZ mode Crow medium.

In the end, my opinion on quirks is formed based on it's current performance, while still wanting to try to keep some kind of resemblance to it's roots. if we make it super agile to give it speed and firepower, it loses its roots. IMO, giving it stout ST would reflect on the idea it didnt have any torso twist so it was a little more stout because of simplicity- at least i could buy that as a lore idea. In any case, I do not want to see quirks that copypasta the Nova into a Crow with a different shape.


How do you expect to surpass a potential 90 dmg tart? =/ That's what makes the poptarting a threat. It's basically jump brawling from behind cover repeatedly. If you think you can clay pidgeon something shooting 90 at you, good luck with it, but both are gonna be puttin a hurt on. Now would I recommend trading with a guy just looking up? **** no. xD

Just sayin, this mech can go left-right-left within a tart and that's not something to just 'shoot out of the sky'. Vast majority of people back up from it. Now if they are 300m, not so much.

I showed tons of poptarting footage in the video, a lot of more coring comes from it than most would believe.

This mech isn't really one for 12 mans per se, maybe 4 mans or dueling, surely a destroyer in something like that...

If you don't think the Nova is already a good poptart, and you watched the vid, I dunno what else to say. It's legit at it. Is it the same type of sniping as the old poptart met? No, it's more of a jump brawl thing.

The reason it's poptarting and not just outright jump brawling a lot of the time is because of the fragility of the mech to begin with, so.

You don't think the Nova has good JJs? Really? O.o

#58 Soy

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 3,689 posts
  • Locationtrue Lord system

Posted 10 March 2015 - 01:04 AM

Ran this mech tonight for a few hours in public drop tonight with a group of other good players, I died twice? Total?

Averaged about 2 kills per round I think. Nowhere near the top damage ever, though. Mostly opening ninja kills and mop-up duty at the end.

I really think it's fringe competitive, gonna work on it still some... still tarting faces off just not as often gotta pick the timing when it's a squad posted up looking around for ya to jump up.

Edited by Soy, 10 March 2015 - 01:06 AM.


#59 Paigan

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • The Blazing
  • The Blazing
  • 2,789 posts

Posted 10 March 2015 - 01:12 AM

View PostSoy, on 09 March 2015 - 02:20 PM, said:

[...]

[...]

The noise the apes make in this video is hardly bearable even at lowest possible volume.
That's where my motivation to spend time in this thread ended.

#60 Soy

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 3,689 posts
  • Locationtrue Lord system

Posted 10 March 2015 - 01:17 AM

^ That's the derp firewall at the beginning; glad it works! :)





6 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 6 guests, 0 anonymous users