475 replies to this topic

[Gumon Choji]

Low ping problem. Enemy high ping weapon duration not important.

For some odd reason I have noticed that the lower game ping I have (30s) increases the damage I take. This is because as a light player one hit is the end and sometimes high ping players phase through me and then shoot. My shots miss with missiles and small pulse lasers. then they connect with a clan er large for total damage. This is not the case with low ping players they hit but in swaths. But high ping players when they hit it is for everything. Then they are like ghosts and I am poping around until the server decides where I am. When playing with a worse ping then 30 I do not get this issue. Targeting locations can change but fewer phase jumps.

Higher ping problem. Snip and mech projections.
Above 70 ping sniping is substantially more difficult. This is due to the enemy changing based on predicted course. But this is normal.

[Muffinator]

I'm in Australia and have had rock solid 260s ping since day 1 of MWO

I very occasionally (once every few matches) rubber band slightly, usually when there's lots going on. I find lasers slightly less effective than I would have expected which I think means I'm not leading targets enough. I have no problems with projectile weapons so I assume I've learned to compensate enough extra when leading targets.

[Mondeza]

Well I am usually at 230 - 280 and hit reg on the lower ping players is horrid. I usually play with Lasers as it seems to be better.

At anything above 250 I can actually see my UAC/5 going through mechs and exploding on the wall behind them.

I would love to try below 200 but that has never happened yet. I can say that above 300 is tough and playing at 260 with people having a sub 100 is also tough as shots that hit on your screen don't register.

[DaZur]

Sub 50 ping... (Was sub 20 before switching from Time Warner to AT&T)

As such "my" game-play affecting ping is not mine but the ping of others....

Summary:

• Sub 100 ping - No noticeable negative play issues.
  
• 100 to 200 - Applied damage seems to spotty, particularity when issued in alpha.
  
• 200 to 300+ - Rubber-banding and very iffy damage application.

It seems to affect it globally... In short, matches with multiple 200/300+ players seems to affect "all" players and not just those giving and or receiving damage.

Edited by DaZur, 23 March 2015 - 11:43 AM.

[xWiredx]

My normal ping is in the 30-40ms range. It seems like things are mostly fine and my ping never really deviates from that range (sometimes I'll see like 27 or 42 or 45, but these are blips, stddev is probably VERY tiny). In my experience, players with pings > ($mine + ($mine x 2)) (or roughly pings beyond 100-120ms) have pretty spotty hit reg.

Also, as an aside, I wrote a couple of network performance-measuring scripts in perl when I was working on optimizing squid proxies. Think I measured speed, ping times (inc stddev), jitter, and a couple other things. If you want them, let me know.

[Merc Montego]

My ping is usually under 50ms. I have had very rare spikes of up to 100ms. The only time I ever see any issues I can subjectively tie to ping is when my target has a ping roughly 70-75ms or more higher than me. I seem take a lot of damage at lower pings but can't dish it out when I'm fighting anyone in the 120+ range.

[Groove Crusader Blue]

Well you see now playing this game in the magical place that is Australia, I play with roughly 200-230 ping. It hurts. Minor rubberbanding is the least of my problems. I hit about half of my shots and do Sweet FA damage. I try to go around it but i really do think it is time you guys got some Asian or Oceanic servers up and running. It would be much obliged. And by the looks of this thread there a lot of aussies playing this game. Im sure they would be thankful for some more servers.

[jay35]

Quote

Actually. Asking us is pretty much irrelevant.
If we have a ping, that ping is pretty much all we know.

Not true for those of us who've experienced significantly different pings and their symptoms in-game.

My ping is usually around 70ms, with no packetloss. At that latency, gameplay is mostly excellent.

But for most of February it was around 120-140ms (with spikes to 160ms and a few over 200ms) for no clear reason, and intermittent packetloss accompanied that nearly-doubled ping rate.

It got better for a couple weeks in March. The packetloss cleared up and latency was back to a steady 70ms.

But now we're back to 120+ms pings and packetloss again since this past weekend.

And it's very noticeable because there are weapon shot packets getting lost so some shots are not registering, occasionally I'll catch a mech warping briefly, and even lasers which are hitscan need to lead the target to a noticeable degree in order to register hits. Also, textchat packets are getting lost as well, which is apparent when you type a message in allchat (or teamchat or lancechat) but when you hit enter, it never posts.

It's unclear whether this issue is with my ISP (as to why they would suddenly start having issues specifically with MWO when my upload and download bandwidth is otherwise pretty excellent, I'm not sure) or MWO's server host or server hardware, I do not know.

Edited by jay35, 23 March 2015 - 11:31 PM.

[James Warren]

Silchas Ruin79, on 13 March 2015 - 04:49 AM, said:

Another Aussie (There's a few of us hint hint). Mine normally sits around 290-300ms. It does make a difference but hard to say how much without trying lower ping, but logically someone with a lower ping sees me before I see them.

Try dropping into the testing grounds - the whole game feels vastly more responsive.

Previously at 270, now at an average of 300.

Usually find lasers highly unreliable - when HSR was first introduced I had no issue hitting targets while moving at high speed. Now I find that laser weapons hardly ever do the amount of damage I'd expect based on what is seen on screen... hard to know if I should be leaded targets or not. This limits 'mech choice considerably for me because only ballistics, PPCs and missiles seem to 'work' properly from my end. Of course being a 'high pinger' makes ducking in and out of cover harder, too because it hampers reaction time by a significant amount.

We get delay on nearly everything. I have to wonder why things like zooming in aren't client side. On a bad day, even zooming in and out is painful. If I drop into the testing grounds it almost feels like I'm zooming before the button is even pressed - the difference is really that noticeable.

[Elizander]

Some days I shoot stuff and it's not there. You learn to just shrug it off.

[Thejuggla]

Most games I played notice a quite a bit difference after 40 ping. Mwo you can't choose what server you connect(since theres only 1 location?) so can't really give an answer fot mwo. Though I get about 100-110 Ping usually in mwo and I'm west coast bc find hit reg to be very inconsistent, sometimes targets melt like lasers through butter other times I'm lucky to turn yellow armor orange.. The servers are canada east? If so ping in mwo is absurdly higher than other games, other games playing on a east server my ping usually 60-80.

[Revis Volek]

Jon Cunningham, on 12 March 2015 - 03:22 PM, said:

Especially for people who have experienced the game at different pings, at what point do you start noticing ping is having an affect on your gameplay?

1-50 ms
50-90 ms
90-140 ms
140-180ms
180-220ms
220-260ms
260-300ms
300-350ms
350-400ms
400+ ms


I have a lot of data from internal tests but I am looking for your experiences. Of course remember that jitter and packet loss fps and many other factors also impact gameplay; I'm just looking for what your subjective experiences are at each range of those pings.

When my ping is fluctuating i actually dont see issues until it rises above 125-140 range. I have never seen it above 250ish and at that point the game is unplayable to me.

But i have seen that when streaming is going on on my network and such i can actually play until i start bouncing to the high end pings like i stated above. Granted this is on my end when i see this but still rather telling because when i start seeing EU and AU pings around 140 i start getting called "Lag Shield Light" or comments about how low my ping and that they cannot shoot me.

David Sumner, on 21 March 2015 - 10:07 PM, said:

Actually. Asking us is pretty much irrelevant.
If we have a ping, that ping is pretty much all we know.

You should have the stats to run some numbers.
That should tell you about likely "enjoyment" levels.
If ping is affecting weapon choice, it's limiting options,
if it's decreasing Elo, W/L, Avg Dmg, time in match, etc, then it's reducing the "fun factor" by making you spend more time "waiting" than "playing"
If it's increasing Matches to level, time to get First Win of the day, etc, it's increasing the "grind" factor.

Avg Ping vs Elo - assuming Elo not broken (see below)
Avg Ping vs W/L - Use Total Matchs vs Losses, not W/L because your web site mech stats prove that Losses are not always captured if you leave the match early, so the ratio is wrong. And this is why I suspect Elo is also wrong. And yes, this was still happening as of the start of March 2015.
Avg Ping vs weapon types
Avg Ping vs KDR
Avg Ping vs Avg Damage
Avg Ping vs Avg time in match
Avg Ping vs Avg Ping of enemy vs W/L
Avg Ping vs # of matches played to get "First Win Of The Day"
Avg Ping vs # of matches per day
Avg Ping in Matches vs Avg Ping in CW
Avg Ping vs # of matches to get a mech to Elite or Mastered
Avg Ping vs Avg XP per match

He did not ask about a single one of those things. He asked when WE as the CLIENTS started noticing issue with the game and game play.

Please RE READ and COMPREHEND.

Edited by DarthRevis, 25 March 2015 - 12:56 PM.

[Jon Cunningham]

David Sumner, on 21 March 2015 - 10:07 PM, said:

Actually. Asking us is pretty much irrelevant.
If we have a ping, that ping is pretty much all we know.

You're not wrong, but what I'm looking for here is subjective opinion.

And the regional data makes doing stats on this a bit hard. Why are some Russian players better than some Canadian players, despite having much higher pings? There's regional shifts that cannot be accounted for from just ping values.

There's only so much I can collect from a cursory overview and I don't have the engineering hours to dedicate to a rigorous analysis. That's one of the reasons I ask. The other reason I ask is from time to time I get very valuable feedback about bad pathing or throttling and I want to keep that conversation open. It's easy to fall into the trap of "the developers aren't listening to my complaints, why even bother complaining," and I'm taking steps to make sure people know I do care, and I am paying attention to them.

[Mark Brandhauber]

Gasp!
normally around 90 to 110, I notice I difference in my game play if my ping hits 180 mainy because I have to adjust my lead, I find that mechs with pings at between 160 and 190 seem to take more damage to kill.

Edited by Mark Brandhauber, 26 March 2015 - 03:29 PM.

[Summon3r]

Avg ping 80-95 if ping ever gets to 150+ i notice all kinds of stuff like delayed targeting and hit reg issues. My ping only ever went high once and that was due to a few very deep rooted viruses.

[White Bear 84]

Jon Cunningham, on 12 March 2015 - 03:22 PM, said:

Especially for people who have experienced the game at different pings, at what point do you start noticing ping is having an affect on your gameplay?

1-50 ms - This is the severe effect crowd. Lights have a massive edge on you, delays in when you see lasers
50-90 ms and the hit registers (e.g. your damaged before you even know your shot).
90-140 ms
140-180ms - These guys are bearable, most a nuisance since they are shooting you.
180-220ms
220-260ms - How I roll. Laser hitreg is bad, ACs'/LRM's fine, SRM's can be sketchy. Have to think fast to counter delay between you and enemy e.g. as above re: registering damage. When in my Raven I actually pull back my shots before the end of the beam duration to avoid enemy fire.. ..of course, because of the ping the lasers are shooting a wall and still registering damage...
260-300ms - These guys are bearable, most a nuisance since they are shooting you.
300-350ms - Easy core mode. These guys are screwed.
350-400ms
400+ ms

As a player with a ping ~ 230-260 (interestingly running steam causes my ping to increase by ~30)

DarthRevis, on 25 March 2015 - 12:36 PM, said:

When my ping is fluctuating i actually dont see issues until it rises above 125-140 range. I have never seen it above 250ish and at that point the game is unplayable to me.

What doesn't kill you only makes you stronger.. ..welcome to Australia

Our Toggers have a range of pings from as low as 100 (closer in EU/NA) all the way up to 450 (Whoop Whoop/Telstra clients lol). 230/260 is playable because its what were used to, you adapt to the way the game runs and counter lag, we have been doing it since beta with threads on leading targets (particularly lights) and timing movements. I dread to think how much carnage we would do do with a ping <100.

Edited by White Bear 84, 26 March 2015 - 03:37 PM.

[Daikyu Kell]

Again from an Australian time zone, constant 270+ ping is not a big deal on enemies packing more hardware than Sarah Connor's coffin i lead by a torso but on lights and fast mediums lead is about 3 lengths.

On Light mechs its incredibly bad, i haqve had some of the following: standing still firing at least 14 large lasers( grouped & single) into the back of an ice ferret that was standing still 400m away and didnt kill it. having to lead a legged spider by 2 lengths, commando running straight at me and i didnt hit a sausage !!! Ping or hit detection???? not to mention mechs skipping all over at times.

[David Sumner]

DarthRevis, on 25 March 2015 - 12:36 PM, said:

When my ping is fluctuating i actually dont see issues until it rises above 125-140 range. I have never seen it above 250ish and at that point the game is unplayable to me.

But i have seen that when streaming is going on on my network and such i can actually play until i start bouncing to the high end pings like i stated above. Granted this is on my end when i see this but still rather telling because when i start seeing EU and AU pings around 140 i start getting called "Lag Shield Light" or comments about how low my ping and that they cannot shoot me.




He did not ask about a single one of those things. He asked when WE as the CLIENTS started noticing issue with the game and game play.

Please RE READ and COMPREHEND.

I did, and I answered it, and then I added some more for suggestions of objective measure to be used against player loss.

[David Sumner]

Jon Cunningham, on 26 March 2015 - 03:10 PM, said:

You're not wrong, but what I'm looking for here is subjective opinion.

And the regional data makes doing stats on this a bit hard. Why are some Russian players better than some Canadian players, despite having much higher pings? There's regional shifts that cannot be accounted for from just ping values.

There's only so much I can collect from a cursory overview and I don't have the engineering hours to dedicate to a rigorous analysis. That's one of the reasons I ask. The other reason I ask is from time to time I get very valuable feedback about bad pathing or throttling and I want to keep that conversation open. It's easy to fall into the trap of "the developers aren't listening to my complaints, why even bother complaining," and I'm taking steps to make sure people know I do care, and I am paying attention to them.

Cool. That I'm glad to hear, even if I have stopped playing for now.

I usually complain when I find people have been putting up with something for 2 years that I can fix in 10 minutes because they never mentioned it.

Reading through this did let me correlate a lot of dreadfully frustrating experience with my ping.

Stuff like "I thought these 2 matches were equally good" and finding in one I did 300 dmg and in the other 900 dmg
Or having someone charge me (alone) and kill me while I pumped 120+LRMs and multiple MPL bursts from 300m and closing, stuff you can see hitting, and only do 38dmg.

Does explain why my W/L looks more like 1:2 than 1:1 these days

Maybe stuff like the Russians is packet loss rather than ping?

I can remember when there was a black hole router somewhere in the NZ to US network.
Every so often you'd get a web site (like say www.microsoft.com) that would suddenly cease to exist for some people. and not "not found" type stuff, just nothing would ever answer back.

[White Bear 84]

David Sumner, on 26 March 2015 - 03:55 PM, said:

Maybe stuff like the Russians is packet loss rather than ping?

Maybe their node exploded?