109 replies to this topic

[Calvin Vakarian]

It sure is Steiner in here...

[Skadi]

Ranek Blackstone, on 30 June 2012 - 07:24 PM, said:

K2's mount dual MGs, so using the hardpoint system and an XL engine, you could probably mount dual torso mounted AC/20s in a K2.

looking at the mechlab pictures it shows it have a total of 4 medium lasers (2 on each side) even though its the K2 varient, but it also has 2 MG's so their still alot of options there.
(Gonna haft to admit though, a catapult with 2 PPC's and 2 AC20's is a scary thought)

Edited by Skadi, 30 June 2012 - 07:27 PM.

[Voss Korgan]

Game needs a BV system desperately.

[Shiinore]

Ranek Blackstone, on 30 June 2012 - 07:18 PM, said:

Stupid uninformed rants about a title he's PAID for.


EDIT, and that Atlas cockpit is pretty big. Bet I can hit that from 700 meters with a guass round.

Does that matter? I've paid for this title too. Am I now entitled to whine and moan about game mechanics I've yet to experience based on my own conscious decision to spend money on a game I've yet to play?

[Cik]

deardiarytodayopwroteapoorlyformattedrageposttonoavail.jpg

[madheuhl]

im not whining im not moaning, im stating a fact. you are all saying exactly what i knew youd say and honestly u can all just stuff it. like that thing from pizza hut. whats it called? doesnt matter. you would have to be horribly horribly bad at this game to lose against anything but an assault while piloting an assault. i know it makes u mad because u dont wanna be in an assault but fact is fact. sorry bros. didnt mean to make you all so mad.

[Ranek Blackstone]

Skadi, on 30 June 2012 - 07:26 PM, said:

looking at the mechlab pictures it shows it have a total of 4 medium lasers (2 on each side) even though its the K2 varient, but it also has 2 MG's so their still alot of options there.
(Gonna haft to admit though, a catapult with 2 PPC's and 2 AC20's is a scary thought)

Weight wouldn't allow it. Cata is only 65 tons, and dual AC/20's is 28 tons before ammo.

EDIT:

Shiinore, on 30 June 2012 - 07:27 PM, said:

Does that matter? I've paid for this title too. Am I now entitled to whine and moan about game mechanics I've yet to experience based on my own conscious decision to spend money on a game I've yet to play?

Most people tend to knock things they DON'T pay for. it's like buying a new car and then complaining about how much it sucks before you even get a chance to sit in it.

Edited by Ranek Blackstone, 30 June 2012 - 07:32 PM.

[Eisenhorne]

In this game, you need line of sight to track an enemy or you can't see him on the radar.

SO, therefore we can know one thing - If you don't have scouts, your not going to be getting reliable information on your enemies position. That right there IMMEDIATELY points to the team with scouts always winning... because they will be able to coordinate and focus fire better.

If you think you can just pop a scout easily, then your pretty wrong. Weapons in this game have a shorter range, combined with ECM scouts being harder to detect, means you won't be able to see them when they can see you. Hence, you'll need your own scouts to combat them.

In capture and control style missions, if you move all your assaults to capture the base, enemy scouts will take yours and you'll lose. If you leave half of your assaults behind and half to go attack, then they just have to coordinate their fire on half your army, and again you lose.


Basically, without information about the position / composition of the enemy force, you WILL LOSE.

[Skadi]

Ranek Blackstone, on 30 June 2012 - 07:30 PM, said:

Weight wouldn't allow it. Cata is only 65 tons, and dual AC/20's is 28 tons before ammo.

im gonna have far too much fun just seeing what i can all fit on a K2 :x

[Akaryu]

i bet my first credit check i get in this game that the op wrote this because a light mech frustrated him endlessly in a match and got sloppy and ended up getting scrapped and the OP got a big head over it.

[River McCain]

I seem to remember killing plenty of larger mechs with my Scat in MW4.

[matux]

@OP What ever mate, pull your head out of your arse, light mechs will rule the battle field, they can make quick strikes and guide team mates while your all big, slow and herp'a'erpen around each other saying things like "HURRRRRR ITS TOO FAST I CAN GET MAH TARGETING""", I cant wait till people start MG'ing you from behind for massive damage and you sit there rageing like a 12 year old on xbox live.

[trycksh0t]

Skadi, on 30 June 2012 - 07:26 PM, said:

looking at the mechlab pictures it shows it have a total of 4 medium lasers (2 on each side) even though its the K2 varient, but it also has 2 MG's so their still alot of options there.
(Gonna haft to admit though, a catapult with 2 PPC's and 2 AC20's is a scary thought)

While you could technically squeeze that in, it's gonna need a lot of weight saving to be even remotely close to viable. Even with an XL engine, running at 64kph it would only have 1.5 tons of armor (standard, can't get FF on there, nor Endo-Steel). Dropping the speed down to Atlas level (54 kph or so), you could squeeze on 5.5 tons of armor. It's doable, but would be the definition of glass cannon.

Edit - Proof that it's doable but stupid.

Catapult K2-WTH

Mass: 65 tons
Tech Base: Inner Sphere
Chassis Config: Biped
Rules Level: Tournament Legal
Era: Succession Wars
Tech Rating/Era Availability: E/X-F-E
Production Year: 3049
Cost: 9,387,675 C-Bills
Battle Value: 1,090

Chassis: Unknown Standard
Power Plant: Unknown 195 Fusion XL Engine
Walking Speed: 32.4 km/h
Maximum Speed: 54.0 km/h
Jump Jets: None
Jump Capacity: 0 meters
Armor: Unknown Standard Armor
Armament:
2 Autocannon/20s
2 PPCs
Manufacturer: Unknown
Primary Factory: Unknown
Communications System: Unknown
Targeting and Tracking System: Unknown

================================================================================
Equipment Type Rating Mass
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Internal Structure: Standard 104 points 6.50
Engine: XL Fusion Engine 195 4.00
Walking MP: 3
Running MP: 5
Jumping MP: 0
Heat Sinks: Double Heat Sink 10(20) 0.00
Heat Sink Locations: 1 LA, 2 RA
Gyro: Standard 2.00
Cockpit: Standard 3.00
Actuators: L: SH+UA R: SH+UA
Armor: Standard Armor AV - 88 5.50

Internal Armor
Structure Factor
Head 3 9
Center Torso 21 13
Center Torso (rear) 4
L/R Torso 15 11
L/R Torso (rear) 3
L/R Arm 10 7
L/R Leg 15 10

================================================================================
Equipment Location Heat Critical Mass
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Autocannon/20 RT/RA 7 9/1 14.00
Autocannon/20 LT/LA 7 9/1 14.00
PPC RA 10 3 7.00
PPC LA 10 3 7.00
@AC/20 (10) CT - 2 2.00
Free Critical Slots: 8

Edited by trycksh0t, 30 June 2012 - 07:35 PM.

[Shiinore]

@OP

If you believe it's true, and if you don't like it, get out.
Devs have already stated their focus on role warfare, and you're obviously too stubborn (or stupid) to believe anything different. This thread is pointless and flamebait.

inb4lock

[John Kerensky]

madheuhl, on 30 June 2012 - 07:09 PM, said:

People seem to think that everyone piloting an assualt mech has had a stroke right before the match and wont be able to turn around and alpha strike you once and watch you die. The fact is that assualt mechs will always destroy everything else they come across. period.

"Obvious troll is obvious", as they say, however, I did want to point out one little thing here. What makes you think you are going to be able to turn at a rate fast enough to keep your bead on the light?

I love all your justifications with previous games, as if any of that actually has bearing on a brand new game being designed around the principles of making all the weight classes viable.

Though to be honest, you do tangentially bring up a point of concern for myself: a full team of well-coordinated assault-class BattleMechs, staggered so they can watch one anothers' six and also pull back to their base if they should need to do so. Especially once we start talking Clan chassis. That is just a *lot* of firepower they are bringing to the game, even if they can not quite use ALL of it at once.

Time shall tell. Until then I will rest in the hope that lights and mediums will have roles on the fields of war.

Edited by John Kerensky, 30 June 2012 - 07:37 PM.

[Joe Mallad]

Skadi, on 30 June 2012 - 07:26 PM, said:

looking at the mechlab pictures it shows it have a total of 4 medium lasers (2 on each side) even though its the K2 varient, but it also has 2 MG's so their still alot of options there.
(Gonna haft to admit though, a catapult with 2 PPC's and 2 AC20's is a scary thought)

that would never happen with the way things are going to work in the game. While you have the hard points to do it, you will not have enough weight and or critical slot space. AC20's alone are heavy as all get out lol. In a catapult, you may be able to get the 2 PPCs and 1 AC20 but you will not have enough room or weight left to carry enough heat sinks to deal with the heat build up and you will have to strip almost all your armor off to free up weight. Thats just asking to be killed in seconds by a few well placed small laser shots lol

You will not see ANY mech be able to have enough armor and mount anything like this without making himself very vulnerable in some way (not enough armor or cant handle the heat from all the big weapons)

[Skadi]

idk tryck, i may just do it if i get insanely bored and feel like being stupid but yes, thank you for the proof.

Edited by Skadi, 30 June 2012 - 07:38 PM.

[Tincan Nightmare]

I really hope that all weight classes are useful in the game, and that we see a variety of them in every fight, but light mechs should not turn into some assault class hunter killers. Yes, it should be possible for a light mech pilot to beat an assault mech, but it should be fairly rare. If not they better change the price tag on those mechs, because why would you pay 16 million c-bills for an Atlas just so a 3 million Commando or Jenner can own you in every match. I think most of the heat from the OP comes from all the posts around the forum of peolpe explaining how easy it will be to just run up behind an assault mech in a Jenner or Raven and kill it. This should be something extremely dangerous for the light mech pilot to even attempt, and success should be rare enough that actually doing it would be some huge bragging rights. Role warfare means performing a role, and for light mechs that should be scouting and harrassing tactics. In fact watch the light mech breakdown video again, they explain how experience is gained for more than just blowing things up but also for finding the enemy and relaying that info back to your team, emphasising the role of light mechs.

[TyrialRetribution]

alot of good points so far. figured since the op, issued a challenge to do any of this in older games id meet it. first of the majority of my experience was with mw4, vengeance, black night and mercs.
in merc my mech of choice for the solaris champs was a black knight heavy mech with 3 er ppcs and a clan light guass plus a few other bits, and yes i could SLAUGHTER with it, often getting 10+ of the 15 possible kills.
my friend and i loved to go the 2 of us in atlas and dashi vs 3 teams of 4. we got to the point where we could win vs assult 75% of the time, the fight we never won however was making them all ravens.
finally some non personal experience, if you go to the video section and watch the breakdown videos on each of the 4 classes one of them (i dont recall which) shows a point where an atlas shoots a jenner or a huntchback with a full barrage and the indicated health display for the hit mech shows some damage but is still very able to take many more such hits, supporting the arguments and the statements of the devs that things have been drastically re balanced from classic games.

i will admit that this is something i have still had some concern over and is part of the reason i haven't preordered yet (as well as not having funds), but i am very optimistic that the devs have delivered as promised here.

[wanderer]

madheuhl, on 30 June 2012 - 07:09 PM, said:

Im sorry if this upsets all you people out there that are trying to find justification to pilot heavies and mediums but you will always lose to assualts. End of story.

Even from the leaked and dev-released video I can tell you this.

You have the worst case of Steiner-itis I have ever seen, and the first time you find yourself laying there with your Atlas leaking smoke from it's shattered head and a backside that looks like a proctologist went at you with a belt sander....I will feel your pained rage-scream from across the very Internets itself as your theory is violently, gruesomely and thoroughly disproven.

And then I will go find something else to dump a dozen SRM's in as my Commando goes zipping along with a trolololololol.