268 replies to this topic

[Tennex]

kapusta11, on 15 March 2015 - 07:51 AM, said:

PGI community manager:
Hey Russ, people are not happy again, they're crying about Grasshopper mech being too tall while Zeus being the size of a heavy, are we going to do something about it?
Russ:
Holy shіt, you're right that Zeus mech is too small!

Ah Classic.

Should be added to one of the ones runnin away

Zeus isnt really that big tho

[Burktross]

Escef, on 15 March 2015 - 08:39 AM, said:

Did you see the same picture I saw?

Was right about to add an addendum. Neither of us were right.
More so 1 head

Edited by Burktross, 15 March 2015 - 08:44 AM.

[TercieI]

k05h3lk1n, on 15 March 2015 - 08:18 AM, said:

PGI should think about creating a DOA and Mech complaints subforum considering the vast amounts of threads created for this reason.

What would be left of General Discussion? Just a thousand LRM whines?

[Bishop Steiner]

Terciel1976, on 15 March 2015 - 08:45 AM, said:

What would be left of General Discussion? Just a thousand LRM whines?

those should be reassigned to K-town

[El Bandito]

Alienized, on 15 March 2015 - 08:10 AM, said:

so i just fought a huginn and a PB with my quickdraw. 2 vs 1. i killed them both, i lost both arms, rear center armor, left side torso armor.
they done 189 and 203 damage.
i survived the complete battle with no armor left, one side torso cherry red and 600+ damage.
XL engine, 4 jump jets.
trust me, that size can be a huge advantage if you are mobile enough and skilled enough for it.
the thing is people cry out loud before they use the mechs potential.

then i had a battle with my victor today. xl 350 engine, max JJ. 21% alive, 2 kills.

just stop screaming that mechs are crap if you cant play them. i am tempted to do alot of videos with the qkd-5k and the victor-9s just to show you how its done with such *crappy oversized* mechs.
the awesome is the best proof on how wrong you are with *tall mechs are crap, they need to be cut down*
i barely ever see one altho its by far the smallest assault currently.

quit the fkin crying. like seriously.

The point is mechs are sometimes unfairly large sized, and no matter how well you do with it, you could have done better if it was smaller sized. The fact PGI's modeling team goofs up badly this late into development is serious cause for concern.

Edited by El Bandito, 15 March 2015 - 09:13 AM.

[Escef]

Burktross, on 15 March 2015 - 08:42 AM, said:

Was right about to add an addendum. Neither of us were right.
MMore so 1 head

Wow, that's some deceptive imagry right there. Firstly, you measure the width of the shoulders and not the torsos, secondly the Grasshopper image is obviously shifted slightly upward from the Cataphract (note how the backgrounds don't line up).

Yeah, I mean, of course it's going to support you when the image is obviously rigged to favor your argument.

[Bishop Steiner]

Escef, on 15 March 2015 - 08:49 AM, said:

Wow, that's some deceptive imagry right there. Firstly, you measure the width of the shoulders and not the torsos, secondly the Grasshopper image is obviously shifted slightly upward from the Cataphract (note how the backgrounds don't line up).

Yeah, I mean, of course it's going to support you when the image is obviously rigged to favor your argument.

one issue with trying this at all...without the hitboxes we don't know for sure where the torsos start and the arms end.

[Alienized]

El Bandito, on 15 March 2015 - 08:47 AM, said:

The point is mechs are sometimes unfairly large sized, and no matter how well you do with it, you could have done better if it was smaller sized.

nope. you could not. the designs are based on lore and TRO informations. they simply are like that wether you like it or not. all we can do is makign the best out of them.

[FupDup]

Alienized, on 15 March 2015 - 08:53 AM, said:

nope. you could not. the designs are based on lore and TRO informations. they simply are like that wether you like it or not. all we can do is makign the best out of them.

Those designs were made for a turn-based board game where a target's size was irrelevant, and all that mattered was rolling the dice the right way.

If you made a Tabletop miniature the size of a Lego minifigure, and another miniature the size of a salt shaker, there would be zero difference in their combat performance. Both would have equal chances of being hit by enemy fire, because TT doesn't care about target sizes.


In a real-time first-person game where we aim manually, target sizes matter a lot, so it's pretty silly to regard those documents as some kind of bible for how mechs should be sized in this game.

Edited by FupDup, 15 March 2015 - 09:00 AM.

[Alienized]

FupDup, on 15 March 2015 - 08:58 AM, said:

Those designs were made for a turn-based board game where a target's size was irrelevant, and all that mattered was rolling the dice the right way.

If you made a Tabletop miniature the size of a Lego minifigure, and another miniature the size of a salt shaker, there would be zero difference in their combat performance. Both would have equal chances of being hit by enemy fire, because TT doesn't care about target sizes.


In a real-time first-person game where we aim manually, target sizes matter a lot, so it's pretty silly to regard those documents as some kind of bible for how mechs should be sized in this game.

they were designed to be on the battlefield. as real as it can be in fantasy books placed in the future. nothing to do with dice rolling.

[Armorine]

I like the size and can't wait to get mine. I feel PGI did an awesome job bringing the grasshopper and Zeus to life. Quite your complaining till they're out and you see how they perform. I have a feeling the grasshoppers gonna be awesome

[Vassago Rain]

You guys paid knowing this was gonna happen.

Maybe you should stop buying stuff until they have models and scaling pictures.

[TercieI]

Bishop Steiner, on 15 March 2015 - 08:47 AM, said:

those should be reassigned to K-town

On that we agree.

[Mikros04]

Armorine, on 15 March 2015 - 09:02 AM, said:

I like the size and can't wait to get mine. I feel PGI did an awesome job bringing the grasshopper and Zeus to life. Quite your complaining till they're out and you see how they perform. I have a feeling the grasshoppers gonna be awesome

I think it could end up being considered as the best IS heavy for laservomit.

[Burktross]

Escef, on 15 March 2015 - 08:49 AM, said:

Wow, that's some deceptive imagry right there. Firstly, you measure the width of the shoulders and not the torsos, secondly the Grasshopper image is obviously shifted slightly upward from the Cataphract (note how the backgrounds don't line up).

Yeah, I mean, of course it's going to support you when the image is obviously rigged to favor your argument.

It was more of a hasty slapon, considering I don't have paint.net on this computer yet, but if you desire, I will remake it.
Also note that the original image is from this thread.
I measured to shoulders, because I'm trying to emphasize silhouettes, not hitboxes.


Lord knows what paint was smoking with the dimensions, but here's something that took more than 30 seconds.

So, approximately 80% of a head taller

Edited by Burktross, 15 March 2015 - 09:13 AM.

[Armorine]

Mikros04, on 15 March 2015 - 09:10 AM, said:

I think it could end up being considered as the best IS heavy for laservomit.

Shhhhhhh most of the people here haven't figured that out yet!

[Escef]

Burktross, on 15 March 2015 - 09:10 AM, said:

I measured to shoulders, because I'm trying to emphasize silhouettes, not hitboxes.

And you are still using the same unfairly biased picture, so your measurements mean NOTHING. The only thing this proves is that you don't care about making an honest argument.

[Burktross]

Escef, on 15 March 2015 - 09:14 AM, said:

And you are still using the same unfairly biased picture, so your measurements mean NOTHING. The only thing this proves is that you don't care about making an honest argument.

I honestly don't notice anything substantially different between the two. All of this is rough estimation, so unless you find me a better source, this is all we have. I implore you to diagram the problems in the source image and notify El Bandito, if its so big of an issue.

[Escef]

Burktross, on 15 March 2015 - 09:17 AM, said:

I honestly don't notice anything substantially different between the two

I wager Bandito knows. And if you don't care, and he doesn't care, pointing them out won't get you to fix them.

[LordBraxton]

Bishop, I appreciate your desire to be optimistic, but I don't want this thread to be focused on game balance alone. With the laser meta, quirks, and a solid build, the grasshopper may still become one of the best IS heavies. That is not my concern. The scaling looks ridiculous with these last two mechs from the resistence package. It is poor consistency and quality control. Or perhaps... consistently terrible quality control...

Vassago Rain, on 15 March 2015 - 09:07 AM, said:

You guys paid knowing this was gonna happen.

Maybe you should stop buying stuff until they have models and scaling pictures.

I paid money and I still agree with Vass