76 replies to this topic

[Fate 6]

reddevil, on 16 March 2015 - 08:48 PM, said:

You missed the rest of the conversation where they said it will be fixed by Wednesday :/

That's basically what they said about the Gargoyle too. We're still waiting.

[Karl Streiger]

The full Story is more interesting.
If the hight of a mech is the reason for the movement archetyp, then there is a flaw as big as a overlord in the logilogic.

Chicken Walker should get a movement penalty when climbing hills. The King Crab or Stalker rushing over hills while Victor & Co gets stuck is wrong.
Prove: Mechwarrior 2 Pilot Handbook - capitel about Terrain.
Its also found in Operation Excalibur - when lori fights in the real GrayDeath Shadowhawk vs 2 Stalkers

[Bishop Steiner]

Fate 6, on 16 March 2015 - 10:00 PM, said:

That's basically what they said about the Gargoyle too. We're still waiting.

pretty sure they never gave a date for the hotfix on the Gargoyle.

Also, as of last week, Russ had never said they were fixing it, but that they were debating it. With Wednesday's hotfix, the Gargles is a probable candidate, finally, too.

[Fate 6]

Bishop Steiner, on 16 March 2015 - 10:08 PM, said:

pretty sure they never gave a date for the hotfix on the Gargoyle.

Also, as of last week, Russ had never said they were fixing it, but that they were debating it. With Wednesday's hotfix, the Gargles is a probable candidate, finally, too.

The Gargoyle's movement type was a "bug" though, and while they are taking their sweet time fixing it why would they release and then hotfix the Grasshopper? It's really a show of their QA failures that they would let it be coded as "huge" and then decide to change it so late in development that it can't even make the patch. And yes, they never gave a date on the Gargoyle but it seemed suggested that it would be a HOTFIX instead of tacked on to some patch multiple months later. And even then it still hasn't made it into a patch.

[Impyrium]

Karl Streiger, on 16 March 2015 - 10:05 PM, said:

The full Story is more interesting.
If the hight of a mech is the reason for the movement archetyp, then there is a flaw as big as a overlord in the logilogic.

Chicken Walker should get a movement penalty when climbing hills. The King Crab or Stalker rushing over hills while Victor & Co gets stuck is wrong.
Prove: Mechwarrior 2 Pilot Handbook - capitel about Terrain.
Its also found in Operation Excalibur - when lori fights in the real GrayDeath Shadowhawk vs 2 Stalkers

This. It's clearly a very simple system they're working with at the moment and MechWarrior and BattleTech has so much more depth they could delve into to make things more varied and interesting, if not just more configurable.

[Anjian]

OMG, did I just buy a lemon?

[El Bandito]

70 ton mech labeled as HUGE. Now I have seen how far PGI's mistakes can compound on top of each other.

Edited by El Bandito, 16 March 2015 - 10:37 PM.

[DasSibby]

Yay! Bishop to the rescue! DOWN WITH THE BLACK KNIGHTS! Up with stompy mechs!

[1453 R]

Hey, Bishop. Since Russ actually seems to listen to you, mebbe see if the Quickdraw can be added to the Hotfix list, too? As it stands right now the QKD is as agile on hills as Stalkers and King Crabs. If this is patently unacceptable to anyone else, mebbe we should see if they can fix those poor things, too.

[Karl Streiger]

Well problem with blk
black knights is you can't defeat them even without legs and arms they fight on.

Well lets see it from the positive: its obvious that the old simple mwo rule for volume / density + art can result in curious things like this Hopper with Huge - and King Crab with Big - but nobody did really complain about the KGC Because it was positiv stuff.

Oh yes the positive - see it as chance for a change. Maybe they can add some additional attributes like full modeled hands for better mobility - a mech with real arms may use them to keep balance when turning on a dime.
Well it happens seldom but after they invented a reduced Ultra Jam Chance Quirk - they should be able to quirk, tweak or modify any value they want - we have only to convince them about the urgency.

So please stopp infighting

[Escef]

Anjian, on 16 March 2015 - 10:30 PM, said:

OMG, did I just buy a lemon?

Yes, but the hotfix should turn it into an orange.

[Karl Streiger]

Escef, on 16 March 2015 - 11:02 PM, said:

Yes, but the hotfix should turn it into an orange.

Does it matter as long as i can can got a bottle of tequila - i don't care if lemon or orange

Edited by Karl Streiger, 16 March 2015 - 11:14 PM.

[Tarzilman]

Imho the problem concerns the Quickdraw more than the Grashopper. The GRH is pretty slim for its height.
But when PGI can fix the scale problem of actual mechs so fast, why couldn't they do so with the Awesome and/or Quickdraw? Whats the difference?
Also, does anybody have some pics of the Awesome to compare it with the Zeus? The AWS urgently needs some love, not only regarding its visual shortcomings in the mechlab.

Edited by Tarzilman, 16 March 2015 - 11:31 PM.

[Onmyoudo]

My problem with this is more that it took Bishop asking Russ, and Russ finding out, for this to be made known. This means that in PGI there are people who were perfectly happy to design a Banshee-sized 70 ton heavy previously known for agility and give it the worst movement archetype without ever thinking "man, maybe we're doing this wrong".

[El Bandito]

Tarzilman, on 16 March 2015 - 11:28 PM, said:

Also, does anybody have some pics of the Awesome to compare it with the Zeus? The AWS urgently needs some love, not only regarding its visual shortcomings in the mechlab.

I deliver. Awesome shorter, wider, fatter, and has lower hardpoints.

Edited by El Bandito, 17 March 2015 - 12:56 AM.

[Tarzilman]

El Bandito, on 17 March 2015 - 12:51 AM, said:

I deliver.

Thanks a lot Bandito! Nice to see them fatties next to each other.
I think I see what PGI did there and I hope the Awesome will soon receive a comoletely overhaul!

[Insects]

Glad to see Russ describe it as unaceptable.
Perhaps this realization will get him to pull his head out of the sand and notice there is some other lazy sloppy work and poor QA going on too.
Time to kick ass and chew bubblegum, let's hope he has run out of gum.

[Karl Streiger]

Tarzilman, on 17 March 2015 - 12:58 AM, said:

Thanks a lot Bandito! Nice to see them fatties next to each other.
I think I see what PGI did there and I hope the Awesome will soon receive a comoletely overhaul!

A look from the side - would be interesting - i think the volume/density is the same- but the Zeus got all the volume in the round shoulders....round things are great for getting volume - thats why the UrbanMech will be a dwarf in comparison with the Locust

[Joseph Mallan]

Vassago Rain, on 16 March 2015 - 08:32 PM, said:

Well, guys, what say you?

I say that is pretty damn stupid. Large yes... Huge? Really???

[Insects]

Joseph Mallan, on 17 March 2015 - 01:19 AM, said:

I say that is pretty damn stupid. Large yes... Huge? Really???

Its all because the height wouldn't fit into the Large collision box so they just slapped the Huge box onto it.
Which box it has is used to determine its movement.

So now that Russ has discovered the issue for himself people are being made to fix it ASAP and split the movement characteristics from collision box.
Which is how it should have always been, someone has just been lazy and taken shortcuts until this discovery.