76 replies to this topic

[Tarzilman]

Karl Streiger, on 17 March 2015 - 01:19 AM, said:

A look from the side - would be interesting - i think the volume/density is the same- but the Zeus got all the volume in the round shoulders....round things are great for getting volume (...)

Perhaps you're right. When you compare the profile of both I'm sure you'll see that the Zeus is obviously slimmer than the Awesome. Maybe the round shoulders of the Zeus hide some volume, but the Awesome also got its big missile tubes, at least some variants, and a very deep/broad chest in general. In the end that makes the Awesome easier to hit from the side and I think the Zeus will have an advantage (not only) there.

Edited by Tarzilman, 17 March 2015 - 08:08 AM.

[Joseph Mallan]

Doesn't PGI have an Editor or Checker or anything like that? Huge should be 85 tons and up!

[Karl Streiger]

Joseph Mallan, on 17 March 2015 - 01:36 AM, said:

Doesn't PGI have an Editor or Checker or anything like that? Huge should be 85 tons and up!

automatic calculation - not about mass - and as said they should include full featured arms as positive and chicken legs as negativ aspects

considering the numbers of Mechs - i don't think a "automatical" caluclation is necessary - turn/twist/hill climb ratings and else should be placed manual.
So intstead of chanigng the Mech or the formula - it would be "simpler" to use the Quirk Systems to "Buff" the hopper and Gargoyle - nerf Stalker, KingCrab, Warhawk, DireWolf
(would be the next problem - the Executioner may get a worser movement profile as the Dire Wolf)

[Sjorpha]

I wonder if this hotfix spells a nerf for the king crab...

I how not, but I do hope the Victor will get a fix this way too.

[NextGame]

It should never have been scaled how it has to begin with. I've yet to see some reasonable justification for mech scaling overall in this game other than some macguffin about material density, which doesnt really have merit in a pvp game.

Edited by NextGame, 17 March 2015 - 03:03 AM.

[Haakon Magnusson]

Onmyoudo, on 16 March 2015 - 11:56 PM, said:

My problem with this is more that it took Bishop asking Russ, and Russ finding out, for this to be made known. This means that in PGI there are people who were perfectly happy to design a Banshee-sized 70 ton heavy previously known for agility and give it the worst movement archetype without ever thinking "man, maybe we're doing this wrong".

Agreed... and while they fix the movement type, the mech is still HUGE. I wonder why I buy these packages... charity doesn't cover it anymore

[Navid A1]

So... they can hotfix the grasshopper...but when its Mr. gargles its a big no no.. because size - because hitboxes - because global catastrophe.

[Joseph Mallan]

Karl Streiger, on 17 March 2015 - 01:48 AM, said:

automatic calculation - not about mass - and as said they should include full featured arms as positive and chicken legs as negativ aspects

considering the numbers of Mechs - i don't think a "automatical" caluclation is necessary - turn/twist/hill climb ratings and else should be placed manual.
So intstead of chanigng the Mech or the formula - it would be "simpler" to use the Quirk Systems to "Buff" the hopper and Gargoyle - nerf Stalker, KingCrab, Warhawk, DireWolf
(would be the next problem - the Executioner may get a worser movement profile as the Dire Wolf)

True and not true. As a "Big" man I am fairly nimble, but no matter how you slice it, I'm still "big" As opposed to someone who is "Huge".

A Gargoyle is big, A Stalker is really big(Huge) King Crabs, Warhawk, Dire Wolf all Huge, and should react accordingly.

[Novawrecker]

Quote

All this bitching about mech's size ...

And people are ignoring that this issue is getting addressed the very next day ... why?



Sheesh

[Widowmaker1981]

Haakon Magnusson, on 17 March 2015 - 03:22 AM, said:

Agreed... and while they fix the movement type, the mech is still HUGE. I wonder why I buy these packages... charity doesn't cover it anymore

Being tall is not really a disadvantage, being fat is. When you miss a mech, is it above it, or is it to the side? willing to bet 90%+ of misses miss in the horizontal, not vertical plane. Tall mechs with high hardpoints actually have a huge advantage of being able to stand behind friendlies and shoot over them (BNC-3M can stand behind and shoot over about 75% of mechs in the game)

[Joseph Mallan]

Novawrecker, on 17 March 2015 - 03:44 AM, said:

[Mcgral18]

armyunit, on 16 March 2015 - 08:46 PM, said:

Do you guys not know that PGI aims to release a hotfix on Wednesday that will fix this issue?

You mean....there's a chance the 80 ton Mr Gargles could be just as agile as the 100 ton King Crab?

Hurray!

[Bishop Steiner]

Mcgral18, on 17 March 2015 - 06:18 AM, said:

You mean....there's a chance the 80 ton Mr Gargles could be just as agile as the 100 ton King Crab?

Hurray!

hey, as long as it doesn't get hung on every pebble, then that 35 kph speed advantage can actually shine.

As opposed to now, where it only outruns the KCG on the shiny smooth showroom floor.

1453 R, on 16 March 2015 - 10:56 PM, said:

Hey, Bishop. Since Russ actually seems to listen to you, mebbe see if the Quickdraw can be added to the Hotfix list, too? As it stands right now the QKD is as agile on hills as Stalkers and King Crabs. If this is patently unacceptable to anyone else, mebbe we should see if they can fix those poor things, too.

I can ask, no promises, but do think it should be moving with the GRFs and SHDs.

Edited by Bishop Steiner, 17 March 2015 - 06:21 AM.

[mogs01gt]

PGI really needs to have more focus on QA testing. Some of their "engineer's" decisions are odd to say the least.

Edited by mogs01gt, 17 March 2015 - 07:02 AM.

[Bishop Steiner]

Anjian, on 16 March 2015 - 10:30 PM, said:

OMG, did I just buy a lemon?

for approximately 24 hours, possibly. If hotfix stays on schedule, the reduced movement profile fix combined with JJs and shoulder hardpoints should actually make it rather solid.

[Bishop Steiner]

Onmyoudo, on 16 March 2015 - 11:56 PM, said:

My problem with this is more that it took Bishop asking Russ, and Russ finding out, for this to be made known. This means that in PGI there are people who were perfectly happy to design a Banshee-sized 70 ton heavy previously known for agility and give it the worst movement archetype without ever thinking "man, maybe we're doing this wrong".

Yeah, been something I have been on Russ about since we got a Gargoyle that apparently uses a walker, since King Crabs and Stalkers outrun it in any harsh terrain. But even on the forums, been plenty of grognards who don't get that a 80 ton mech based on mobility that is woefully outgunned and outclassed by a 75 ton mech...should really be able to at least USE that mobility.

Even with this, I feel they still need access to endo if you ever want to see anything beside laser vomit (though I acknowledge most folks will just add DHS for more vomit power)

Karl Streiger, on 17 March 2015 - 01:19 AM, said:

A look from the side - would be interesting - i think the volume/density is the same- but the Zeus got all the volume in the round shoulders....round things are great for getting volume - thats why the UrbanMech will be a dwarf in comparison with the Locust

willing to bet that like the HBK, the Zeus probably is a bit more barrel shaped in the torso than the AWS or VTR.

Joseph Mallan, on 17 March 2015 - 01:36 AM, said:

Doesn't PGI have an Editor or Checker or anything like that? Huge should be 85 tons and up!

I could use the job.

Karl Streiger, on 17 March 2015 - 01:48 AM, said:

automatic calculation - not about mass - and as said they should include full featured arms as positive and chicken legs as negativ aspects

considering the numbers of Mechs - i don't think a "automatical" caluclation is necessary - turn/twist/hill climb ratings and else should be placed manual.
So intstead of chanigng the Mech or the formula - it would be "simpler" to use the Quirk Systems to "Buff" the hopper and Gargoyle - nerf Stalker, KingCrab, Warhawk, DireWolf
(would be the next problem - the Executioner may get a worser movement profile as the Dire Wolf)

I'd be happy to simply start with someone hovering over the modelers and forcing consistency in scaling, first, then, the need for the rest is mitigated somewhat.

Navid A1, on 17 March 2015 - 03:27 AM, said:

So... they can hotfix the grasshopper...but when its Mr. gargles its a big no no.. because size - because hitboxes - because global catastrophe.

Um, no. Now that they are addressing collision and movement capsules as separate, it means mr Gargle,s mr Victor and mr Quickdraw all have potential to see buffs, too. Whether or not they will, at least, yet, is a question that remains to be seen.

mogs01gt, on 17 March 2015 - 06:26 AM, said:

PGI really needs to have more focus on QA testing. Some of their "engineers" decisions are odd to say the least.

can't argue that. I think they do try, but perhaps need someone who simply is there to oversee these things, and doesn't get distracted by other duties?

[STEF_]

Still, I find weird that a heavy mech has been "incapsulated" in a HUGE box/capsule.

Good that pgi can admit thier own mistake about huge movements.... BUT they never solve the weird thing: hopper too way tall, and we'll never know why they've thought to do it in this weird manner.


"Too much "weird" in this post, Stefka! .... maybe...are you still thinking about those clan quirks?"

[Logan Hawke]

Actually... that's not a bad idea, Bishop. You're certainly, I guess the polite term would be dedicated, enough to keep chipping away at every problem you see until it gets fixed. Plus you do tend to see problems without taking those problems and shoving them up your ass until you end up with hemorrhoids like some people do.

I wonder if there is any way to pressure PGI into employing Bishop as a quality control/obsessive fan(atic)?
Especially since it doesn't sound like Russ has anyone doing so already.

Edited by Logan Hawke, 17 March 2015 - 06:56 AM.

[STEF_]

Logan Hawke, on 17 March 2015 - 06:48 AM, said:

Actually... that's not a bad idea, Bishop. You're certainly, I guess the polite term would be dedicated, enough to keep chipping away at every problem you see until it gets fixed. Plus you do tend to see problems without taking those problems and shoving them up your ass until you end up with hemorrhoids like some people do.

I wonder if there is any way to pressure PGI into employing Bishop as a quality control/obsessive fan(atic)?
Especially since it doesn't sound like Russ has anyone doing so already.

Totally agree.
Already proposed Bishop for his great designs.

AND ABOVE ALL, we'll have a pgi employee that is playing this game!

'cause after the hopper's affair and those weird clan quirks, I highly doubt the actual employees are playing thier own game right now....

[mogs01gt]

Bishop Steiner, on 17 March 2015 - 06:37 AM, said:

can't argue that. I think they do try, but perhaps need someone who simply is there to oversee these things, and doesn't get distracted by other duties?

The problem with QA people or groups, is that they arent giving the authority to say, "this is wrong, fix it". Im talking from my experiences in IT. Typically others find the faults acceptable and allow it to go to the public.

If you have played LoL over the years, you can see how much focus they put on QA when it comes to the physical appearance of their products. Balancing typically comes after which I agree with somewhat. You have to get the models and how those models interact with the environment done first. Balancing is mere numbers, physical appearance is not.

Edited by mogs01gt, 17 March 2015 - 07:07 AM.