220 replies to this topic

[TheArisen]

Does the bump (pun) to 2K mean the file size is going to expand?

[Lordred]

It will be a small expansion to the install size of the game.


What will happen with a universally 2k res texture base:

1: Install footprint expansion: The avg difference between a mech with 1k res textures, and a mech with 2k res is ~6.6mb per mech
My best estimation is as worst, we will see a 1GB expansion of the game base install.
2: Very High Settings users will experience additional load. ~This is HIGHLY system dependent.
3: Low end users will not be effected, as all texture files include all lower resolution files built in, as we currently have.

Edited by Lordred, 27 February 2016 - 07:54 AM.

[Edustaja]

I your chart Warhawk is listed as Warhammer.

[Lordred]

Edustaja, on 27 February 2016 - 09:06 AM, said:

I your chart Warhawk is listed as Warhammer.

heh, no longer relevant, we won.

[Ghogiel]

Lordred, on 27 February 2016 - 07:38 AM, said:

It will be a small expansion to the install size of the game.


What will happen with a universally 2k res texture base:

1: Install footprint expansion: The avg difference between a mech with 1k res textures, and a mech with 2k res is ~6.6mb per mech
My best estimation is as worst, we will see a 1GB expansion of the game base install.
2: Very High Settings users will experience additional load. ~This is HIGHLY system dependent.
3: Low end users will not be effected, as all texture files include all lower resolution files built in, as we currently have.

Is that how they are going to handle it? That would be a tad unexpected. And if they do do it like that, 1 would be incorrect. In that case you need to add the full size of the 2k textures in addition to the install not the difference between differing sets.

In the case they do it like how I would expect, simply making the textures bigger, 3, wouldn't be correct, as you still need to load the full 2k into mem before your settings use the correct res mipmap. Or you mean Load would be affected but Draw shouldn't be?

[Lordred]

With proper use of the system CVARs low end users will not be effected in the least. The game does not need to load the full texture file to address the proper mipmap. All of that information is in the .DDS files, the game simply looks at which set it is allowed to access up to.

As for my assessment on total size difference, I am pretty confidant in that.

[Tarogato]

Hurrah for Lordred, Hurrah! =D

[Ghogiel]

Lordred, on 27 February 2016 - 11:47 AM, said:

With proper use of the system CVARs low end users will not be effected in the least. The game does not need to load the full texture file to address the proper mipmap. All of that information is in the .DDS files, the game simply looks at which set it is allowed to access up to.

As for my assessment on total size difference, I am pretty confidant in that.

The dds will be loaded in mem to pull mipmap. Additional load. The fillrate and frame draw timings is what you are saying will be unaffected. Loading certainly will be.

Your assessment of additional texture size seems pretty far off. Mechs have dif spec/gloss and normal, assuming that the rgbs and variant sets aren't even touched, dif spec/gloss and 3dc normal at 1024 is going to be just like 3.2mb. You need to quadruple that to over 12mb for a set of 2048s. More if the the RGBs are also bumped. And more again if the variant sets are changed.

[Lordred]

Ghogiel, on 27 February 2016 - 01:35 PM, said:

Your assessment of additional texture size seems pretty far off. Mechs have dif spec/gloss and normal, assuming that the rgbs and variant sets aren't even touched, dif spec/gloss and 3dc normal at 1024 is going to be just like 3.2mb. You need to quadruple that to over 12mb for a set of 2048s. More if the the RGBs are also bumped. And more again if the variant sets are changed.

My assesment is based on the 6 required texture .DDS files, currently nearly all mechs use a 1k/1k/2k(x2) while mechs like the Mauler use 2k/2k/2k(x2) The normal map for all mechs is already 2k.

So, based on the uncompressed file sizes, it would be a difference of 12mb per mech per base camo. non base camos only introduce a new RGB.DDS. (exceptions for a SPC map on a few camo patterns)

The files however are not stored uncompressed.

Edited by Lordred, 27 February 2016 - 02:12 PM.

[Ghogiel]

Lordred, on 27 February 2016 - 02:11 PM, said:

My assesment is based on the 6 required texture .DDS files, currently nearly all mechs use a 1k/1k/2k(x2) while mechs like the Mauler use 2k/2k/2k(x2) The normal map for all mechs is already 2k.

So, based on the uncompressed file sizes, it would be a difference of 12mb per mech per base camo. non base camos only introduce a new RGB.DDS. (exceptions for a SPC map on a few camo patterns)

The files however are not stored uncompressed.

Base camo is also an RGB. The shader just swaps it out for the other camospec.

If you were only counting the stored HDD footprint and not the extra mem on load, bringing up compressed would make sense, but you would have been forgeting the fact that nearly every mech has like what 12-15 or so RBGs for the camo specs and aren't just the base set of textures, that alone is going to account for more than 6mb increase on HDD,

But if you are saying the mem load is only 6megs because of pak files, the game engine unpacks textures at run time to load makes the point about pak compression moot.

[Lordred]

Come march 15th, we will see if there is, and how much of an impact there is.

[LordNothing]

when i was making models for the various mods i made, i started at 8k and scaled down. you would loose some of the micro detail but if you evenly distribute the macro and micro details you still have nice textures for down sampling. then you could hand out high res textures to all those with monster rigs.

Edited by LordNothing, 27 February 2016 - 11:51 PM.

[Malleus011]

Brilliant!!!

[Andi Nagasia]

Congrats @Lordred,

[NeoCodex]

Looking at these spreadsheets, now I know why Rasalhague camo is my most used on the newer mechs released, it's one of the few that is full 2K and just this makes the whole thing look so much better, I don't really care what the camo design really is anymore, as long as the textures are smooth as on Rasalhague. Also the that pastel filter on it is a nice addition too, makes look color more toned down and less plastic, so it really makes it my go-to camo for most of the Mechs that support it just because of the higher quality textures and shader.

Can't wait to see this update live. We don't know if they are buffing everything to 2K for green status, do we? Considering how much better everything looks with triple 2K, this could be a huge, huge deal. I'm actually really surprised how they pulled this off on such a short notice and a bit skeptical it's the full upgrade for all the camo variants, that seems a lot of work..

Anyway thanks Lordred for pushing this forward, we probably would never get this if not for this thread and your work. Let's hope for the best on the update day.

Edited by NeoCodex, 29 February 2016 - 12:53 AM.

[MrMadguy]

What I have a fear about - is that game already requires 1.5GB video memory. Won't it exceed my 2GB with new textures? But what I hope for - is that they'll fix broken camos on recently released 'Mechs during this texture normalization pass.

[Lordred]

Whats your video resolution?

[Haakon Magnusson]

This is awesome gem in the town hall, unless of course someone with a potato and twitter manages to kill it. Luckily they have been insinuating to even higher res packages
I welcome the visuals back to 2010's ... yay! (Not quite latter half of 2010's in sight tho)

[Paigan]

[Night Thastus]

No Warhawk? :C