68 replies to this topic

[Tsula]

feor, on 28 November 2011 - 05:23 PM, said:

As an proud Ice Hellion I say....

Good luck, have fun. I'll be over here, somewhere. In a corner, maybe. Pouting a little. No, no, I'm ok, I've just got something in my eye, that's all.

Your time will come, In the spring of 3071 the Ice Hellions attempted a major foray into the Inner Sphere, attacking the coreward end of the Jade Falcon OZ with almost their entire touman. Know both as Operation "Ice Storm" and (to the Falcons) the 'Hellion Tantrum', fighting was fierce, with the Hells Horses entering the conflict on the side of the Falcons during the latter half of the war to turn the tide finally against the Hellions. The Ice Hellions were shattered, withdrawing with only 3 Clusters of Beta Galaxy remaining of their invasion force. Subsequently they are known to have been active in the Deep Periphery, launching piratical resource raids upon the Ghost Bear Dominion.

[feor]

Yes, cause the fact that I don't get to invade now only to have my entire military functionally annihilated in a couple decades makes me feel so much better.

It's a shame too, can you imagine if we got some of that sweet sweet Inner Sphere Isorla? Savannah Masters for Everybody!

[VoodooLou Kerensky]

As a member of Clan Black Sheep I have to tell you that the Clans are already in the Inner Sphere and we've been busy womanizing and drinking.
I would post some lines from the Forgetness but I forgot them.
Savarishi you Surat Stravags!

[Dihm]

feor, on 28 November 2011 - 07:09 PM, said:

Yes, cause the fact that I don't get to invade now only to have my entire military functionally annihilated in a couple decades makes me feel so much better.

It's a shame too, can you imagine if we got some of that sweet sweet Inner Sphere Isorla? Savannah Masters for Everybody!

Come join the FRR, you'll fit right in!

[Amarus Cameron]

tsula, on 28 November 2011 - 02:04 PM, said:

Blame the Smoke Jauguar by the name of Leo Showers for that one. He created the initial invasion corridors. And one pilot from the Free Rasalhague Republic stopped the invasion for a year.

That is because of our laws, not the martial prowess that they showed. Though it was honorable that her final act be one of a warrior.

Also as for your above comment, if you did not already know Trent was considered Dezgra and removed and thought killed by Smoke Jaguar forces, only through the underhanded machinations of Comstar did he survive. Watch your tongue, the honor of the Jaguar runs deep and we, nor I, will be spoken to in such a manner. As for another mark we were not annihilated, the Crusader clans lost the trial of refusal also one factory was destroyed on Huntress as well as the looting and pillaging of Lootera (among the crimes against Humanity perpetrated there I will not speak) other than that and the loss of the invasion corridor, the Clan still had active military forces on many other worlds that would not be absorbed or give their ground. While the Inner Sphere was set and content with just one world, we of that Jaguar had many.

(do not quote to me the comments in source books that say "And the other clan claimed their [the Jaguar's] other territories quickly" because that is thin at best, most of our unit bid their time within Strana Mechty after the fall, waiting for the Grand Council's decision as was argued for years. No Inner Sphere operation can kill a clan, only the Clans may determine the death of a clan, as such we were never called as one. though arguments by lesser clans said so, others took to our cause and argued from a higher moral calling. The Inner Sphere cannot kill a clan, that is all, and that is fact)

Edited by Amarus Cameron, 29 November 2011 - 06:37 AM.

[feor]

The Inner Sphere did not kill your Clan. They did, however, destroy nearly your entire touman. Meaning that when another clan showed up to lay claim to your territories and equipment, no forces stood to their defense, or paltry freeborns who could not hope to mount a meaningful trial.

The last active military forces of the Jaguars were destroyed during the Great Refusal when the final binary of their forces (9 mechs and a point of elementals) were crushed by the 10th Lyran Guards. While the Clan might still have lived at that point their holdings were seized by other clans essentially without resistance as there were no warriors to stand with them.

Apparently a few of your kinsmen, missed during the final days of the fighting, perhaps wounded and unable to do battle, were transplanted to the Inner Sphere where they joined the Republic of the Sphere.

Quote

Watch your tongue, the honor of the Jaguar runs deep

I'll say, they setup a convenient demonstration on Edo, there's a crater that shows exactly how deep their honor runs.

[CoffiNail]

feor, on 29 November 2011 - 01:23 PM, said:

I'll say, they setup a convenient demonstration on Edo, there's a crater that shows exactly how deep their honor runs.

I love how this is always brought up... I am done with your silly rendition of clan law that pales in comparison to the Succession wars trillions of lives. Capellan Confederation's scorched earth campaigns or Kurita's Kentares massacre, to name a few. It was one city that was taken out, AND the best thing everyone seems to ignore even ilKhan Showers thought it was a waste and the star colonel who issued to waste was sent back to the homeworlds.

[Gremlich Johns]

Sob!

At the time of the invasion, CBS was a homeworlds clan.

Mongo sad.....

[Seth]

Amarus Cameron, on 29 November 2011 - 06:36 AM, said:

As for another mark we were not annihilated, the Crusader clans lost the trial of refusal also one factory was destroyed on Huntress as well as the looting and pillaging of Lootera (among the crimes against Humanity perpetrated there I will not speak) other than that and the loss of the invasion corridor, the Clan still had active military forces on many other worlds that would not be absorbed or give their ground. While the Inner Sphere was set and content with just one world, we of that Jaguar had many.

I can't tell if you're being serious or if you're trying to reimagine the end of CSJ out of a sense of patriotism. The Clan was effectively destroyed on Strana Mechty, and you can bet any remaining enclaves were absorbed by other clans. The clans are always looking for signs of weakness and there is no way they would have passed up that kind of opportunity.

[Seth]

Interstingly, there are hints some forces survived though. A wayward warshp, the Osis Pride" was happened upon by Hellion forces and absorbed. And there's always the Fidelis of the Dark Age period.

[Gunman5000]

I always found it amusing how much the Crusader Clans all bickered amongst themselves, all the while a Warden Clan essentially dominated the entire invasion of the Inner Sphere.

[CoffiNail]

Well the whole point of Wolfs progress was to do better then the crusaders to show them up so they pushed to take as many planets as they could so they could treat the population better then the crusader clans would have. Remember Warden Wolves did not want the invasion to take place at all.

[Gunman5000]

Oh yes I remember, and I'm also a big fan of Clan Wolf (the original Warden one, and Wolf-In-Exile for that matter), which is partly why I brought them up. Also if I recall correctly, the invading Crusader Clans did bicker amongst themselves alot which may or may not have impeded their progress. Not sure on that, but thought I read or heard it somewhere. I just find it rather amusing that a Clan that wanted nothing to do with the invasion and would have avoided it if possible managed to beat the Crusader Clans that were all about crushing the Inner Sphere and figured they could basically just waltz through to Terra, and boasted they would get there first before anyone else as well.

[Seth]

Clan Wolf was assigned the easiest invasion corridor give them the least opportunity to win glory and honor for their clan.

[Jack Gallows]

Seth, on 29 November 2011 - 07:59 PM, said:

Clan Wolf was assigned the easiest invasion corridor give them the least opportunity to win glory and honor for their clan.

And yet, multiple times they acquitted themselves as powerful warriors. They won their objective at Tukkayid while other Clans could not. It's also mighty impressive that Phelan was able to take Gunzberg without a fight.

Overall it is pretty funny that the Warden clans were doing better then the Crusaders, but that's kind of the point. Just as the IS showed, the Clans that work best are the ones able of working together or that have more level headed leaders.

[Amarus Cameron]

Jack Gallows, on 30 November 2011 - 05:27 AM, said:

And yet, multiple times they acquitted themselves as powerful warriors. They won their objective at Tukkayid while other Clans could not. It's also mighty impressive that Phelan was able to take Gunzberg without a fight.

Overall it is pretty funny that the Warden clans were doing better then the Crusaders, but that's kind of the point. Just as the IS showed, the Clans that work best are the ones able of working together or that have more level headed leaders.

They won at Tukayyid because they landed absolutely last and had days to analyze the fighting already going on, they had the easiest cities to take, and they took the most supplies and warriors with them. They fought almost exactly how the Inner Sphere fought, they disregarded any clan tradition. True victory is what matters, but if you lose yourself on the way to it what was the point? We came to make the inner sphere better not vice versa, which the Wolves seem to think is the case.

Wardens did not do better than the Crusaders, had they lost against their opponents they would have been laughed all the way back to Strana Mechty, they were going up against untested units that had only existed for at most 20 years. Had the ever lost any battle to the FRR, you would have never heard the end of it. Phelan was able to capture that world, with only himself because of a prior relationship that he exploited. Can you imagine some random clan warrior doing that without any knowledge about whom he was arguing with, no way.

[Jaroth Corbett]

Amarus Cameron, on 30 November 2011 - 06:00 AM, said:

They won at Tukayyid because they landed absolutely last and had days to analyze the fighting already going on, they had the easiest cities to take, and they took the most supplies and warriors with them. They fought almost exactly how the Inner Sphere fought, they disregarded any clan tradition. True victory is what matters, but if you lose yourself on the way to it what was the point? We came to make the inner sphere better not vice versa, which the Wolves seem to think is the case.

Wardens did not do better than the Crusaders, had they lost against their opponents they would have been laughed all the way back to Strana Mechty, they were going up against untested units that had only existed for at most 20 years. Had the ever lost any battle to the FRR, you would have never heard the end of it. Phelan was able to capture that world, with only himself because of a prior relationship that he exploited. Can you imagine some random clan warrior doing that without any knowledge about whom he was arguing with, no way.

Whose fault is that? You brought this upon yourselves.

Quote

This bidding became an opportunity to repay a few grudges. Apparently, Jade Falcon, Nova Cat, and Smoke Jaguar went out of their way to ensure that Clan Wolf failed to win good targets or times. They assumed that the fight on Tukayyid would be over before Clan Wolf could join the battle, a loss of glory that would shame the Wolves for many years. When the bidding ended, Clan Wolf was left with the minor citites of Brzo and Skupo, and had to wait five days before dropping onto Tukayyid. The other Clans were allowed to drop during the first day.

Clan Wolf Sourcebook Pg.48

What is that old saying? He who digs a hole for another, may fall in himself.............................

Quote

The Khans of Jade Falcon and Smoke Jaguar were well satisfied with the results of the bidding, but they did not realize that the ilKhan had actually counseled Khan Natasha Kerensky to curb her impatience and to purposely allow the other Clans to take the better targets and times. He knew that the fight for Tukayyid was likely to be a long, drawn-out battle. Being last to land would actually give Clan Wolf an advantage because they would have two days to observe the action and adjust their plans to match the Com Guards' style of combat.

Clan Wolf Sourcebook Pg.48

and speaking of

Quote

They fought almost exactly how the Inner Sphere fought, they disregarded any clan tradition.

Quote

Clan Smoke Jaguar, still smarting from their defeat at Luthien, chose to bend the rules in the opening stages of the conflict. By the time the Com Guards forced them off the planet, they had abandoned all pretense of fighting honorably.

Battle of Tukayyid Pg.8

You wanted to go first, you got it. Do not cry about how it turned out now.

Edited by Jaroth Winson, 30 November 2011 - 09:44 AM.

[Kudzu]

Amarus Cameron, on 30 November 2011 - 06:00 AM, said:

They won at Tukayyid because they landed absolutely last and had days to analyze the fighting already going on, they had the easiest cities to take, and they took the most supplies and warriors with them. They fought almost exactly how the Inner Sphere fought, they disregarded any clan tradition. True victory is what matters, but if you lose yourself on the way to it what was the point? We came to make the inner sphere better not vice versa, which the Wolves seem to think is the case.

Wardens did not do better than the Crusaders, had they lost against their opponents they would have been laughed all the way back to Strana Mechty, they were going up against untested units that had only existed for at most 20 years. Had the ever lost any battle to the FRR, you would have never heard the end of it. Phelan was able to capture that world, with only himself because of a prior relationship that he exploited. Can you imagine some random clan warrior doing that without any knowledge about whom he was arguing with, no way.

Don't forget that they were also protected by miles of plot armor!

[Garth Erlam]

What I think we all want to know is what Clan Wolv

[Renegade]

Garth Erlam, on 30 November 2011 - 09:22 AM, said:

What I think we all want to know is what Clan Wolv

*gauss rifle shot*

Stupid wolverines.