131 replies to this topic

[Sarlic]

Adiuvo, on 25 March 2015 - 03:46 PM, said:

I'm not going to ignore an invisible wall and pretend it doesn't exist for the sake of immersion or whatever. I'll play around it, while hoping that PGI eventually fixes the issue.

Thing is, it's incredibly stupid to imply that people who do play around such things are cheaters/exploiters. It's a part of the game whether you like it or not, just because it doesn't fit in with your version of MWO doesn't mean that the other player is doing something wrong. Using your reasoning, I can easily say that you're playing the game wrong taking some snowflake build that isn't effective at all in the situations present in MWO, and thus you're not playing to win, thus wrong. Bit dumb.


I never said what my position on the subject was, so you can stop baring your little teeth.

I never implyed that you were using it. But:

When you use it, i call you a exploiter. Simple as it is. Any half brained monkey can see that something is not right. Your version of MWO consists to take everything for the win. Which is fairly pathetic if you gain a unfair advantage which can certainly decide the outcome of a match. Regardless of any build you take: the broken gamemechanic is still there.

When a unfair advantage can be match deciding then it's simply a exploit.

Like i said: poop on a stick argument. You are trying to bend every aspect of a unfair advantange right in this game.

As per Russ. Finally. I hope it's worth it.

Edited by Sarlic, 26 March 2015 - 12:06 AM.

[Eboli]

I see it as an exploit as well and regularly see people using it to their advantage and the sooner the fix comes the better.

It would be interesting to video report someone who is without a doubt using it to their advantage because from what I believe players using an exploit is a reportable offense. I am certainly not surprised that people have created macros for such a feature because the nature of some people is to win at all costs...

Cheers!
Eboli

[Weeny Machine]

Adiuvo, on 25 March 2015 - 09:27 AM, said:

Have you done tests on this? Or are you just going off of what you feel?

I have done tests on it. The hitboxes are not affected much, if at all, by tapping JJs. This game doesn't have nearly the amount of hit registration problems people think it does.

For me it seems it also depends on:1. type of weapon2. amount of weapons3. server load

[Kjudoon]

Darian DelFord, on 25 March 2015 - 07:43 AM, said:

We all know what it is and its running rampant and when called out on it the responses are hilarious. Can we please get this fixed

Once something is done about ending convergence and using WOT cone of fire to end precision auto-kills, then we can talk about JJ repair.

[Lily from animove]

Adiuvo, on 25 March 2015 - 09:27 AM, said:

Have you done tests on this? Or are you just going off of what you feel?

I have done tests on it. The hitboxes are not affected much, if at all, by tapping JJs. This game doesn't have nearly the amount of hit registration problems people think it does.

Are you kidding? there are enough videos posted by people how hitreg is totally off, and how a good portion of poeple have to predict where the mech on the server is, now try to predict a mechs hitboxes when he taps JJ's cosntantly at random intervals, That is nearly as good as lottery.

[Unit47]

So when it is 'fixed' whats the next thing you terribads gonna whine about?

[Spr1ggan]

Sarlic, on 26 March 2015 - 12:04 AM, said:

I never implyed that you were using it. But:

When you use it, i call you a exploiter. Simple as it is. Any half brained monkey can see that something is not right. Your version of MWO consists to take everything for the win. Which is fairly pathetic if you gain a unfair advantage which can certainly decide the outcome of a match. Regardless of any build you take: the broken gamemechanic is still there.

When a unfair advantage can be match deciding then it's simply a exploit.

Like i said: poop on a stick argument. You are trying to bend every aspect of a unfair advantange right in this game.

As per Russ. Finally. I hope it's worth it.

It's not an unfair advantage when anyone with JJ's can do it. The fact of the matter is that guys like you refuse to learn how to bunny hop properly or just outright don't do it. Then when you get beaten by someone that does, you throw your toys out of the pram and cry about it.

If I see an enemy in a TBR or Griffin for example and they aren't using their jj's to throw my aim then they are just bad.

Edited by Spr1ggan, 26 March 2015 - 03:44 AM.

[Telmasa]

Spr1ggan, on 26 March 2015 - 03:38 AM, said:

It's not an unfair advantage when anyone with JJ's can do it. The fact of the matter is that guys like you refuse to learn how to bunny hop properly or just outright don't do it. Then when you get beaten by someone that does, you throw your toys out of the pram and cry about it.

If I see an enemy in a TBR or Griffin for example and they aren't using their jj's to throw my aim then they are just bad.

"Anybody with JJ can cheat, so it's not a cheat"

"Anybody with poop on a stick can fling the poop equally, so it's OK"

How can you type posts like this with a straight face? I mean really? THIS is your logic? "Well, if anybody can abuse a cheat, then it's fair to use the cheat all you want!"

Dumb.

Edited by Telmasa, 26 March 2015 - 03:48 AM.

[Spr1ggan]

Telmasa, on 26 March 2015 - 03:47 AM, said:

"Anybody with JJ can cheat, so it's not a cheat"

"Anybody with poop on a stick can fling the poop equally, so it's OK"

How can you type posts like this with a straight face? I mean really?

It's not cheating, if it was then it would be clearly outlined as such and people would be banned for it. It's just terribads like you that can't be bothered to learn to do things advantageous to your play and that is why you never improve and remain terribad.

Your post is a joke.

[Cyborne Elemental]

Russ tweeted about fixing JJ animations, I think this is a good sign that he likely views all the player responses about it as an exploit, otherwise this would not be happening.
https://twitter.com/...860477170823169

My view, is that players do this with the knowledge that it ****(a i d s) in their survival, it shouldn't be considered an exploit "IF" hitreg wasn't so screwed up when JJ pumping happens.

We'll see how it really affects player's when their crutch is no longer there after the animation fix has been deployed.

Edited by Mister D, 26 March 2015 - 04:16 AM.

[Sarlic]

Spr1ggan, on 26 March 2015 - 03:38 AM, said:

It's not an unfair advantage when anyone with JJ's can do it. The fact of the matter is that guys like you refuse to learn how to bunny hop properly or just outright don't do it. Then when you get beaten by someone that does, you throw your toys out of the pram and cry about it.

If I see an enemy in a TBR or Griffin for example and they aren't using their jj's to throw my aim then they are just bad.

Just because every pilot can do it does not mean that it's legit and a valid mechanic to use. As said before several people have posted video's online showing it's actually game breaking. It was just a matter of time before it would hit the main crowd. A JJ capeable mech already has a legit advantage of jumping prior non JJ mechs. (Set the JJ nerf aside for a moment and think about a decent JJ capeable system.)

The evidence is there and the legit and valid complaints are there and yet you still wear those black eyecups. No offense.

Quote

When a unfair advantage can be match deciding then it's simply a exploit.

In this case we're talking about the JJ- animation. What do you not understand about that line?

Quote

Then when you get beaten by someone that does, you throw your toys out of the pram and cry about it.

What has that to do with a B R O K E N game mechanic? You are just like the other guy trying to bend a banana straight.
Remember we are talking about the repeating tapping JJ's and specific the animation.

[Kmieciu]

I always bunny hop in a TBR. It's my way of protesting against fixed JJ!

And I do the same in the Victor. I just like the sight of him bending over mid-flight :-)

Plus, you need all the advantage you can get while piloting this barn door mech.

I had 3 people shooting at me, taking off my arms and side torsos, and they still couldn't kill me. In the end, they resorted to legging. Those exploiting bastardos!


PS: On a serious note: If that's not an exploit - I don't know what is!

Edited by Kmieciu, 26 March 2015 - 04:16 AM.

[Darian DelFord]

Gonna be funny to see how many "OMG I am a God TW Pilot" get set into their place if they have actually fixed the cause of this problem. This think is so rampant its not even funny.

[Kjudoon]

Telmasa, on 26 March 2015 - 03:47 AM, said:

"Anybody with JJ can cheat, so it's not a cheat"

"Anybody with poop on a stick can fling the poop equally, so it's OK"

How can you type posts like this with a straight face? I mean really? THIS is your logic? "Well, if anybody can abuse a cheat, then it's fair to use the cheat all you want!"

Dumb.

I dunno. Same way we can say Macros are not cheats, or broken hitboxes, broken ECM, broken AMS, broken convergence are not cheats. Everyone can use it.

They're documented, so they're features. Exploits to the rules are part of the game in this logical thinking.

And this is what constitutes for ethics for the majority of gamers sorry to say. "What's possible and benefits me is good. If it doesn't benefit me, it's not" is the order of the day.

I'm about to chuck in the towel and just say "Fine, if exploiting the game isn't cheating and since everyone can do it, I may as well too. Where's my firestarter and Dire/Timber/Storm Cheese Bringers?" Leaving me wondering at what price my ethical standards too.

Edited by Kjudoon, 26 March 2015 - 04:53 AM.

[Spr1ggan]

Mister D, on 26 March 2015 - 04:03 AM, said:

Russ tweeted about fixing JJ animations, I think this is a good sign that he likely views all the player responses about it as an exploit, otherwise this would not be happening.
https://twitter.com/...860477170823169

My view, is that players do this with the knowledge that it ****(a i d s) in their survival, it shouldn't be considered an exploit "IF" hitreg wasn't so screwed up when JJ pumping happens.

We'll see how it really affects player's when their crutch is no longer there after the animation fix has been deployed.

The PGI devs though like 90% of the community are crap at the game though. Just wait dude after jj's have been "fixed" they'll be crying about something else.

All this community want is Napoleonic stationary line formation versus line formation.

Edited by Spr1ggan, 26 March 2015 - 04:31 AM.

[Spr1ggan]

Sarlic, on 26 March 2015 - 04:08 AM, said:

Just because every pilot can do it does not mean that it's legit and a valid mechanic to use. As said before several people have posted video's online showing it's actually game breaking. It was just a matter of time before it would hit the main crowd. A JJ capeable mech already has a legit advantage of jumping prior non JJ mechs. (Set the JJ nerf aside for a moment and think about a decent JJ capeable system.)

The evidence is there and the legit and valid complaints are there and yet you still wear those black eyecups. No offense.



In this case we're talking about the JJ- animation. What do you not understand about that line?



What has that to do with a B R O K E N game mechanic? You are just like the other guy trying to bend a banana straight.
Remember we are talking about the repeating tapping JJ's and specific the animation.

I have no difference in hit reg versus bunny hoppers than non jj mechs. Hit reg in general is ****** up, I've put AC20 rounds point blank into the back of a stationary Atlas for no damage. I spec'd an Atlas pilot put multiple AC20 rounds into the open ST of a Mad dog right in front of him and only 1 round registered. I've put 2 cerrpc shots into the open cherry red CT of a Dire Wolf only to have it still live and tear half my mech off in return.

The only time I have issues versus hoppers is when I miss or have the same BS reg I can have against any other mech in the game.

Also I can do the same thing with Victors, Shawks, Griffins, Jenners, Wolverines etc but you don't see anywhere near same level of whining about hopping in those mechs. Even though those mechs have noticeable lurch or ducking animations when they hit the ground allowing them to dodge under shots.

Edited by Spr1ggan, 26 March 2015 - 04:43 AM.

[Kjudoon]

The hit reg is the issue. Even I know that it's messed up when I bunnyhop. Yes, I use it. Some mechs don't need to. Their hitboxes are just that bad.

[Kmieciu]

Bunny hoping is the best way of avoiding / spreading damage while piloting a TBR. It's easier to target a specific component on a Locust than to hit a specific component on a bunny-hopping TBR.

What is worse, it completely decyncs your model with your cockpit. Your model moves up and down, but your crosshair doesn't. You can hit everything you aim at while your enemy is unable to do so.

Personally, I like to counter bunny hopping with excessively quirked IS firepower. I won a 1vs1 against a Timberwolf in a CN9-D (LBX 2xSRM4 2xML XL280). He bunny hopped like a champ. It was the only mech I engaged that round (conquest on terra therma and he decided to cap). The results screen showed 500-something damage done on my part :-)

I swear this duel looked like this: https://youtu.be/08COdok-5UA?t=69

My point is: bunny hopping in TBR can be exploited by total noobs that go for a cap instead of fighting and are unable to kill an IS 50-tonner equipped with XL Engine. The guy did not even torso twist much, he just tanked with his side torso.

It has nothing to do with skill.

Edited by Kmieciu, 26 March 2015 - 05:04 AM.

[Cyborne Elemental]

Spr1ggan, on 26 March 2015 - 04:22 AM, said:

The PGI devs though like 90% of the community are crap at the game though. Just wait dude after jj's have been "fixed" they'll be crying about something else.

All this community want is Napoleonic stationary line formation versus line formation.

I'm not so sure Spriggan, I think fixes like this are the groundwork for being able to restore JJ mobility back to where it should be.
JJ's are only OP because hitreg is broken, with exploits like this fixed, and hopefully Neema and the other PGI guys finally getting some interest in getting hitreg resolved, JJ's will be less exploitable and we can see thrust and height levels get a boost again.

That is my hope anyway.

Edited by Mister D, 26 March 2015 - 04:54 AM.

[Karl Streiger]

Spr1ggan, on 26 March 2015 - 04:22 AM, said:

All this community want is Napoleonic stationary line formation versus line formation.

Of course its called BATTLEMech like in BattleShip derivate from Ship of the Battle Line - derivate from the line of pre "Zündnadelgewehr" - era .
So the Mech of the BatteLine is exactly what is supposed to do