109 replies to this topic

[FLG 01]

Wolfways, on 30 November 2017 - 08:50 PM, said:

I've always thought it was lights that made mediums obsolete. Mediums are supposed to be the workhorses and I always assumed the best brawlers, but with lights being able to chuck in a big engine they are way faster than they are supposed to be which increases their survival. They are no longer the scouts/harassers/skirmishers they are said to be in BT lore.
I don't use big alpha builds, and don't see that many who do in QP, but lights are a PITA to kill and they are very often amongst the high damage dealers.

"Very often" is an exaggeration, and if lights are among the high damage dealers it's mostly because the few people who chose to pilot them on a regular basis usually know what they are doing. Those who don't die and die quickly. There is a reason why light Mechs are the least played weight class.
You also seem to forget that lights are not the only class capable of equipping a bigger engine. For other classes however this is a bonus, sometimes not even neccessary, although most do it anyway. A light with a stock engine on the other hand is dead meat, simple as that. Even the Clan Adder and Cougar - which are not really slow by overall standards and mount the high survivability cXL - rank among the bad lights because of their 'small' engines.

Lastly, as a dedicated pilot of mediums (with some experience on lights, too) I have to say that lights don't make mediums obsolete at all. If anything faster and lighter mediums like Assassin and Artic Wolf take traditional light roles.

Again it must be stressed lights are the least played weight class. And that's certainly not because our community is so damn noble that it refuses to play a good class of Mechs.

[MrMadguy]

Jman5, on 31 March 2015 - 02:38 PM, said:

This probably wont come as a surprise to many, but I thought it would be nice to illustrate why the light queue tends to be so low, and why the heavy queue is always so high. Damage number are abnormally high for Heavy mechs, and dismally low for light mechs. It's not exactly an Earth shattering revelation, but people like doing damage and the heavy is the damage king by a mile.

Here, I broke down a bunch of games for you guys. I'll admit this isn't a huge sample size, but it's about 300 points of data in the solo queue.



167 average damage is terrible. Is it really any surprise no one wants to play lights? Also look at all those people who were in the 1-99 damage section. It's the biggest chunk!




At least you're usually breaking 200 damage. Still not that impressive. Again no surprise that mediums are the second least played. Also of note, the biggest chunk is in the 100-199 section. Not good.




TO THE MOON!!! So we went from 231 to 375. That's a huge spike. And the biggest piece of the pie is 500+ damage!




And here we come crashing back to Earth. Assault damage numbers are actually what you would expect to see from heavies, which is a little weird. However it does seem pretty nicely split between each damage section.




As you can see average damage numbers go way out of wack when we get to heavies.


Weirdly though when you flip Assault and Heavy around you get a pretty nice line.


So what the heck is going on with Heavies? Are they the perfect storm of mobility, survivability, and firepower? Or is this simply a matter of good players gravitating toward heavies? But then shouldn't Elo correct for skill?

Working as intended, except gimped Assaults of course, cuz armor doesn't serve it's purpose exactly due to too overpowered dmg of other 'Mechs, especially Lights/Mediums. Lights/Mediums aren't supposed to do lots of damage. Stop expecting them to do it. As I've said many times already, heavier 'Mech cost much more in both CB and MC. They should be worth their price. If you want Lights/Mediums to have same performance - prices should be adjusted first. 'Mech, that costs 1M CBs just shouldn't be as viable, as 'Mech, that costs 20M, sorry.

Edited by MrMadguy, 30 November 2017 - 10:09 PM.

[Mcgral18]

MrMadguy, on 30 November 2017 - 10:08 PM, said:

Working as intended, except gimped Assaults of course, cuz armor doesn't serve it's purpose exactly due to too overpowered dmg of other 'Mechs, especially Lights/Mediums. Lights/Mediums aren't supposed to do lots of damage. Stop expecting them to do it. As I've said many times already, heavier 'Mech cost much more in both CB and MC. They should be worth their price. If you want Lights/Mediums to have same performance - prices should be adjusted first. 'Mech, that costs 1M CBs just shouldn't be as viable, as 'Mech, that costs 20M, sorry.

stahp

[Wintersdark]

There's always that guy. *Sigh*

[Armored Yokai]

StOp NeCrOing THREAds

[mogs01gt]

WarZ, on 01 April 2015 - 08:11 PM, said:

Are these questions out of curiosity ?

Or are you grasping at straws that would prove the misconception of holy trinity being OP, but are realizing from Jmans data, that there isnt actually proof of it ? That there actually isn't real data to support the tbr/scr's being OP ? I consider it an eye opener how LITTLE removing tbr's from the heavy queue data affected the average damage.

lol The TBR and Crow have been nerfed fairly heavily so yeah, they were op.

[Wolfways]

FLG 01, on 30 November 2017 - 09:24 PM, said:

"Very often" is an exaggeration,

It really isn't.

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and if lights are among the high damage dealers it's mostly because the few people who chose to pilot them on a regular basis usually know what they are doing. Those who don't die and die quickly. There is a reason why light Mechs are the least played weight class.

No, there are reasons, which imo include probably the biggest reason which is in a game about big mechs less people are interested in the smaller mechs, no matter how powerful they are.

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You also seem to forget that lights are not the only class capable of equipping a bigger engine. For other classes however this is a bonus, sometimes not even neccessary, although most do it anyway. A light with a stock engine on the other hand is dead meat, simple as that. Even the Clan Adder and Cougar - which are not really slow by overall standards and mount the high survivability cXL - rank among the bad lights because of their 'small' engines.

That's more of a "tiny map" problem more than a mech problem.

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Lastly, as a dedicated pilot of mediums (with some experience on lights, too) I have to say that lights don't make mediums obsolete at all. If anything faster and lighter mediums like Assassin and Artic Wolf take traditional light roles.

I meant in general. There are always some that cross boundaries.

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Again it must be stressed lights are the least played weight class. And that's certainly not because our community is so damn noble that it refuses to play a good class of Mechs.

Like how most players don't use meta? Although I have noticed an increase in meta, probably due to the drop in players.

[Mole]

I've always felt like the light queue was so empty because each weight class requires its own learning curve, and lights by far have the steepest of them all. Some people never quite acquire the skill to effectively pilot them. And a whole lot of people simply do not have the patience to trudge through such a learning curve. So they play bigger, more straight-forward classes such as heavies.

[draiocht]

[mod]By the original poster's request,
this thread is now closed.[/mod]

[Tarl Cabot]

draiocht, on 01 December 2017 - 11:37 AM, said:

[mod]By the original poster's request,
this thread is now closed.[/mod]

Hmm, I think you may have un-closed it