104 replies to this topic

[Andi Nagasia]

MauttyKoray, on 18 April 2015 - 02:23 PM, said:

As a Clan player, I vehemently oppose these ******** bandage fixes that people keep bitching for. Unlocking the fixed equipment/JJs and ES/FF WILL NOT FIX THE MECHS. Unless the devs take a ******* step back and fix the underlying bloated mechanics, high damage pinpoint alpha builds will always be the ONLY mechs that will be meta/top tier. Mechs limited by tonnage/hardpoints only have problems because the heat scale is garbage, armor is severely bloated to compensate for these insane damage builds, a lot of ammo has been bloated to allow ammunition based weapons to compensate, and overall we have these mechs blowing alphas in each other's faces for the win, not the superior aiming, positioning, and piloting.

The reason 12 v 12 snowballs happen is because once you hit a certain point, the firepower of one side is too great to allow the other side to turn it around. A single mech carrying the armor of 2 doesn't matter when 12 mechs being able to unleash roughly 3x the intended damage at a single time focus on it. Another issue is the link of Engine Rating to so many movement variables. It bring less Tactical mech piloting and more of a CoD-esque reaction shooter to the game.

the Nova can Boat lots and lots of Energy, and can pull off a High Alpha, but its not OP,
you fail to take into consideration Shape, also makes a mech sometimes more so,
which is why the Nova is also on that needing Endo list, as it would get +2.5 tons,

saying Endo, wont Make any of those Clan without it Better?

Andi Nagasia said:

Mechs with Endo that will not Change,
Lights(MLX)(KFX)(ADR), Mediums(IFR)(SCR), Heavies(TBR),
so to recap the SCR/TBR will not be buffed by this change!

Mechs without Endo that will Change and gain more Tonnage(+Number=ExtraTons)
Mediums(NVA+2.5), Heavies(MDD+3)(HBR+3)(SMN+3.5), Assualts(GAR+4)(WHK+4)(DWF+5)
so to recap the DWF gets the most Benefit from this, but it already has more Tons than it can use!

ya perhaps 2.5-4tons isnt much but its enough to give these Lesser Omnis more flexibility,
(the 5tons for the DWF im not including as it needs its slots more than another 5tons),
Edit- this

Edited by Andi Nagasia, 18 April 2015 - 06:01 PM.

[Ratpoison]

Thinly veiled plugs for buffs you want don't count as questions, they're right to ignore junk questions that aren't relevant to current development. Polls wont tell you what questions should be answered either, you'll end up with nothing but personal biases and self serving interests wrapped in question form(X is OP, when will you fix by implementing my unrealistic idea instead?), and will fail to choose relevant questions at all.

[Cyborne Elemental]

Yep, allowing ENDO/FF swaps or allowing Clans to use both, while it would be nice its more of a handicap on those already powerful mechs when they need all the slots they can get.

Its mostly the issue of FF forced mechs being able to switch to Endo, as most of the mechs that started with FF only are almost all the "bad" mechs or the underdogs compared to the ES or ES+FF mechs.

I don't know how TT dealt with locked FF/ES, don't care, IMO its fine where it is for the most part.

Now Locked Equipment.. not a fan, it wasn't locked on some mechs when they first came out, and I think that freedom of Equipment removal should be available again.

I just remember the Kitfox having JJ's that could be swapped around and repositioned allowed it just enough freedom for some interesting builds, that and being able to put DHS or Ammo in more convenient places ect.

I'm sure that the Myst linx, Adder, Nova, Summoner, would also benefit.

It comes down to, how far can we go with it?
Allowing removal of JJ's, CAP, Locked weapons is one thing, because its something we already had.

But what about locked DHS?
As long as the minimum 10 DHS is met, for these underdog mechs, would allowing repositioning of locked DHS be possible as well?
That would open up some serious freedom on the underdogs, without even having to bring ES/FF into question.

[Andi Nagasia]

i dont agree although i do feel JJ should be unlocked if its a choice between JJ and Endo, ill go Endo,
JJ and DHS(And engines) being locked can be used to give Omni some flavor and balance,

but when the use of a mech is determined by whether it has Endo,
and Endo is locked? then its a problem, thats just how i see it,

i feel we should have Endo unlocked, but i also feel Engine Types should be as well,
WHY ENGINE TYPES????? this is a complete IS thing, as Clan only have Clan XLs,
Most IS Omnis come with IS XLs so having the Choice to go STD should be there,

[Ursh]

Serpieri, on 18 April 2015 - 03:21 PM, said:

InnerSphere invest just as much from standard military training grounds to prestigious academies for their elite. Clans system of bidding works well and many trials had multiple combatants fighting a single person. The warrior that bid the least amount of resources won the right to attack. The Warrior that challenged with a single Warhawk would have been out bid by the warrior that challenged with 2 Gargoyles because they cost less to field. Solamna warriors were assigned second line battletemechs and old SLDF mechs not Omnimechs. What does the exploits of the clans have to do with any of this? Also the Hellbringer mech costs 2,654, the Gargoyle is 1,537 which means that the Hellbringer requires more logistics/resources to build and maintain.

You just confirmed my point is applicable with the Shermans and Panzers. A star of Warhawks would be overwhelmed by two stars of Gargoyles and in that aftermath of the battle the damaged/destroyed Gargoyles would be up and running again while the Warhawks would still be in the mechbay.

Before the battle value system was introduced, people just went by tonnage. I read a lot of clan novels, and I don't remember them ever talking about a Gargoyle being worth 1500 points and a Hellbringer being worth 2600. In lore, They bid by Trinary, Binary, Star, or Point, but rarely did they take into consideration that one side could bid lower by including their Gargoyles. There were examples of bidding away aerospace fighters or resupply, for example, but no particular examples of one side saying "We'll bring Mr. Gargles if you agree to have half your forces watch the battle from the sidelines."

The battle value system was developed to quantify just how bad some mechs were, as it was a point of contention between players. The Gargoyle has standard structure, so does the Hellbringer. Why is the Hellbringer worth so many more points? Because it was actually good. For tabletop games, you could have fun and run 10 mechs versus 5 when there were huge discrepancies in the mech design, but in the fictional world of Battletech, some mechs would have been discontinued or re-engineered after they were determined to be routinely turned into scrap by mechs 15-20 tons lighter than them. Why bring an 80 tonner to do the job a 60 tonner can do?

The clans valued efficiency, and the Gargoyle is not an efficient mech. It's powered by the single most expensive engine in the game, LBX autocannons aren't cheap, and it requires a mechwarrior to pilot it. A mechwarrior that would be more efficiently used in a mech that didn't suck.

The reason the Loki has high battle value is because the prime comes with CAP, ECM, and TC. The non-electronic parts of the mech though are standard structure and standard armor, which are cheap as it comes for the clans, and supposedly easier to repair. The Gargoyle had standard structure and ferro fibrous armor, but lacked electronics, so it's battle value was lower because of that, and because it's a terrible mech.


You missed the point I was making about the Shermans. Allied commanders were willing to throw away the lives of Sherman crews because they knew the Germans would run out of men and equipment before the Allies did. Clan commanders didn't voluntarily throw away the lives of ten pilots carelessly, as attrition calculus didn't work in their favor, and the whole point of bidding when it was clan against clan was to prove who the better pilots and tacticians were. Those Sherman crews that overwhelmed the Tiger tanks were extremely lucky if they managed to get out of their burning tank before it exploded. I think the movie "Fury" illustrated pretty well the end result of attrition tactics. 4 Shermans attack a Tiger, the Tiger dies, but so did the crews of three of the Shermans.

Oh, and about the IS investing as much as the clans in their pilots. The sourcebooks prove you wrong. Clan mechwarriors start with gunnery and piloting skills 1 point lower than IS mechwarriors do, as a reflection of their total dedication to their craft.