108 replies to this topic

[Fate 6]

reddevil, on 05 May 2015 - 06:14 PM, said:

Still better than the Summoner.

Nope. I wish that was true though. Summoner gets better hitboxes, C-Gauss, and C-ERML.

[Fate 6]

Ultimatum X, on 05 May 2015 - 06:23 PM, said:

IS engines & IS laser boat - without one critical aspect "+range".



You can make a decent showing with solid quirks, but what the Grasshopper has is very middle of the road and it shows.


There is just no real way to compete on equal footing when you are at both an engine disadvantage (vs. Clan XL), inferior weapon disadvantage (vs. Clan Lasers) or a performance disadvantage (vs. Other Quirked IS mechs).


Being ridiculously tall with JJs that are weak, really just exasperates the issue.

^
Basically no reason to run the Grasshopper with the TDR as it is right now.

[Sergeant Random]

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...e3f8cbef279e302

STD 300 zombie, comparable to Stormcrow Prime.

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...b#i=183&l=stock

Ton for ton the Stormcrow really competes. But I think I want to master this Grasshopper.

[bad arcade kitty]

Fate 6, on 05 May 2015 - 06:40 PM, said:

Nope. I wish that was true though. Summoner gets better hitboxes, C-Gauss, and C-ERML.

i saw 5 x streak-6 summoner too (:

[Bishop Steiner]

Carrioncrows, on 05 May 2015 - 05:32 PM, said:

But you can't keep the CT alive...it's like the Kintaro fiasco all over again.

Dunno what to tell you, I never have an issue with the CT. Maybe with your time off, your twist-fu is rusty?

I just don't use it because it's not agile enough for me. And laservomit is boring. And I find it mediocre at heat dissipation (a shame since that was one of it's claims to fame)

But durability I never have an issue with. Not as tanky as my ZOOS, but solid.

Edited by Bishop Steiner, 05 May 2015 - 07:34 PM.

[bad arcade kitty]

Ultimatum X, on 05 May 2015 - 06:23 PM, said:

inferior weapon disadvantage (vs. Clan Lasers)

is dares to say it when their large lasers are better

[Ultimax]

Sergeant Random, on 05 May 2015 - 07:22 PM, said:

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...e3f8cbef279e302

STD 300 zombie, comparable to Stormcrow Prime.

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...b#i=183&l=stock

Ton for ton the Stormcrow really competes. But I think I want to master this Grasshopper.

1) You are comparing a 70T heavy mech to a 55T Medium mech.
2) The 55T medium is capable of more firepower than that build, and with better overall range synergy.
3) "Comparable to Stormcrow Prime" except yours is 30 KPH slower...

bad arcade kitty, on 05 May 2015 - 07:28 PM, said:

is dares to say it when their large lasers are better

You have absolutely no idea what you are talking about.

[XX Sulla XX]

Quote

So who think they suck are the weak link...can't blame the mech for your failings.

Hmm then why is it not the go to mech of all the best players in the game.

[RoboPatton]

Piney, on 05 May 2015 - 05:48 PM, said:

I certainly don't think they suck................the prime problem is they're just too damn tall. They tower over most every mech and stick out like sore thumbs.

[Sergeant Random]

Sergeant Random, on 05 May 2015 - 07:22 PM, said:

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...e3f8cbef279e302

STD 300 zombie, comparable to Stormcrow Prime.

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...183&l=stock

Ton for ton the Stormcrow really competes. But I think I want to master this Grasshopper.

Ultimatum X, on 05 May 2015 - 07:33 PM, said:

1) You are comparing a 70T heavy mech to a 55T Medium mech.
2) The 55T medium is capable of more firepower than that build, and with better overall range synergy.
3) "Comparable to Stormcrow Prime" except yours is 30 KPH slower....

Sigh. The man is right. But I posted the Smurfy links coz I thought some things are better left unsaid... -.-

Is it like comparing the Nova Prime to the 9Mlas Hunchback? Those mechs have their own followings... Tho the Hunchback seems more popular.

Edited by Sergeant Random, 05 May 2015 - 07:59 PM.

[CocoaJin]

XX Sulla XX, on 05 May 2015 - 07:36 PM, said:

Hmm then why is it not the go to mech of all the best players in the game.

Didn't say it was the premier mech for its class or role...it is a very good mech none the less. How is it going to compete with the history of uber-quirks for the Thunderbolt? Of course comp players will choose the one or two Heavies with wild quirks over it. It has JJs, so by default it'll never get any crazy metas.

Still, the brave enough to try something outside of the meta know it's worth.

[bad arcade kitty]

Ultimatum X, on 05 May 2015 - 07:33 PM, said:

You have absolutely no idea what you are talking about.

0.25 sec less duration, 2 less heat and only 3 less damage + it goes to overquirked chassis

[Ultimax]

bad arcade kitty, on 05 May 2015 - 07:59 PM, said:

0.25 sec less duration, 2 less heat and only 3 less damage + it goes to overquirked chassis

The least you can do before you even attempt joining a conversation, is to actually know something about what you are going to discuss.



2x CLPL vs. 3x LLAS.


You do the math, they teach it in 3rd grade and you really aren't worth my time for me to re-teach it to you.

[bad arcade kitty]

you compare large and large pulse

[Clownwarlord]

Lets be honest PGI makes horrible IS mechs but they can make decent clan mechs.

[Felio]

I guess you could do what I do with my Jenners and drop side torso armor to 5/5. Streaks are the only reason it's not 0/0.

[Ultimax]

bad arcade kitty, on 05 May 2015 - 08:33 PM, said:

you compare large and large pulse

Yes, because those two weapons are the most similar.


Unlike your choice of Clan EXTENDED RANGE LLAS vs. IS LLAS where the Clan EXTENDED RANGE LLAS has SIXTY FIVE PERCENT MORE RANGE.


I know this is challenging, have a banana, and power through it.

Edited by Ultimatum X, 05 May 2015 - 08:36 PM.

[Kjudoon]

Till you get speed tweak, you will hate it. If you use it as a brawler, you will hate it. If you have less than 4 JJs you will hate it.

This mech is a long range jumsniper. That's it. Till pgi deigns to make AMS a "self only" defense, having a single LRM5 or SRM4 is worthless. Even then, it is iffy.

But with the biggest XL and lots of erlls you are basically dead in the water. Like a Quick
raw, with no quirks. I do like the double high mounted PPC version at times, but other than that, it is in desperate need of velocity and heat gen quirks to make it something really special and compete with the zTbolts and stalkers.

clownwarlord, on 05 May 2015 - 08:34 PM, said:

Lets be honest PGI makes horrible IS mechs but they can make decent clan mechs.

Designs are biased to the loves of the people in charge. No denying that.

[Sergeant Random]

According to that chart, 1 Llas dps = 2.12 while 1 cLPlas = 2.97.

So, comparing 3 Llas to 2 cLPlas dps will be 6.36 vs 5.94.

Considering the tonnage, crits, and hardpoint requirements, well...

Uh, whut?

Edit: lets look at heat per second: 3 Llas = 3 x 1.65 = 4.95 while 2 cLPlas = 2 x 2.29 = 4.58. Erm... looks sort of close to me. You can discount range in a brawl, so (gasp!)... Situationally fair?

Edited by Sergeant Random, 05 May 2015 - 09:17 PM.

[Mad Porthos]

Carrioncrows, on 05 May 2015 - 05:25 PM, said:

So I didn't buy this resistance pack, despite wanting the Grasshopper like mad.

Had some left over MC and got the flash sale today and .....the grasshopper is downright horrible!

What the mother man?

It's a literal walking CT. The only way I am seemly able to take damage to the LT or RT is if I accidentally catch a stray shot meant for another mech.

Worse I can't even hide behind the usual cover because the damn thing is SOOO tall. Which wouldn't be so bad if every LRM launched against me didn't strike the CT 90% of the time. I can get shot in the back by LRM's and still have it hit the front CT.

I knew IS energy vomit was going to be bad, simply because IS energy weapons "NEVER" deal full damage because they are always out of optimal range. I just didn't think it would be THIS bad.

So, can't take damage, can't deal damage, and can't jump. Another disappointment...and to top it off, missile perks on a single missile slot located in the head. Desk palm.

Ya know, I just finished eliting the grasshoppers. I started yesterday morning, had them all finished by evening. I don't have all mastered for that last slot yet, but it was not a bad grind, even if it is something of a grind. The 5 J, H and N all went quick and I now have W/L ratios about 1.3-1.5 and kdr on them between 1.5 and 2.2. They are not bad as in each case, soon as I had finished eliting them with the last skill (speed tweak etc, for the 2x efficiency) I stopped running them... so no part of their stats is due to full efficiencies.

I think the trick is, you should consider pulse lasers, even if they don't have range bonuses. Also, you do not need XLs in these. If CT is being cored, I recommend much more twisting and the pulses let you do that because they dump damage in an instant as you are on target, allowing you to swing your CT to the left or right before it gets focused. Also... JUMP. Simple fact, people suck at tracking a jumping target, regardless of any accusations of HAX or hitboxes, a jumping target moves erratically and can cut out jump jets in an instant, changing it's nice predictable arc, to a quick drop that then stops as well or continues at yet another angle, if you hit jump jets again with some of your remaining jump fuel. This really is something the Grasshopper does well with jump jets for... spreading and evading damage. As they aim at that CT, often you instead splash their damage onto your legs and between your legs, jumping upwards as you twist your torso left, right and back to fire again when you land - if the Grasshopper was horrible, I would not have those numbers on W/L, KDR after just a few grinding drops.

Some of the mechs that have been horrible for me were things like the highlander, the pre-quirk victor (with negative penalties), atlases and king crabs. Until they were elited, they felt like moving in mayonaise and I struggled with getting even a 1.0 w/l and kdr until the 2x efficiencies unlocked some actual responsiveness for these chasis (though they still require deliberate planning in your actions and approaches). Grasshopper, in comparison, even with just a 300 standard, running about 69kph was able to do some impressive things, with 4 JJ. Something I think a few missed also was that the variants that can manage 2 energy in the left and right side torsos will get a high mount if you fill the low mount. This means you can run some pulse builds using those numerous low mounts for close range combat, while pushing your ranged weapons into higher hardpoints, allowing the towering Grasshopper to poke over certain barriers, pop tart a bit and generally enjoy unobstructed firing lanes with those ppcs, large pulse lasers or er large lasers that I found useful.

Even the missile in the head grasshopper had something to offer, which surprised me. Ended up going tag in central torso and NARC in the head with a bit of ammo 1.5-2t I think. The rest of the armament was meant for up close fighting, Large Pulse, Medium Pulse, even some small pulse in the low slung arms in a heirarchy of bigger weapons higher in body. When jumping, the arm mounted SPLs were great for firing down on opponents I was soaring over who were desperately trying to focus thier ballistics up onto me, but only grazing my legs. When I crashed to earth, I then would have the high/heavier weaponry I could do more substantial hits with, exploiting holes the SPL managed to make.

Why the NARC and TAG? So often as a mech that gets in a scrum, I see 2x, 3x ECM, over lapping ECM that makes for a painful ambush or shuts down my teams streaks or LRMS. I get over a ridge or around a corner attempting to flank and I clearly see 3-5 cored enemy mechs just waiting for my buddies to come over the rise they are facing... and I see that a few missiles could really win the fight. But DDCs and Pirates Bane are doing a number on my team who are about to blithely poke one at a time around a corner to face the combined fire power of 6 mechs who have murderballed and created a firing line. What can I do? Well, I'm pretty good at prioritizing and as I see this going down, I can drop some narcs into the best targets, maybe even laze several with TAG directly. That can do some serious disruption, especially if my ranged heavy weapon is ppc/er ppc as yet a third counter-ecm tool. This works. I've had people curse me out for bringing NARCs, then be all apologies as I brawl through 6 enemies, lighting each one up with a nice beacon that points out they are all CORED. I may not survive, but I'll be damned if I'm going to let my team fall into the same ambush that is ending me.

Edit: I'm an idiot, I did the narcing in a different mech last night LATE after finishing the grind on all the grasshoppers. I blurred memory of the NARCing with the last build I was running of the Grasshopper, which had been running an LRM5. Thank you for pointing out my idiocy.

Edited by Mad Porthos, 05 May 2015 - 09:48 PM.