431 replies to this topic

[Widowmaker1981]

El Bandito, on 20 May 2015 - 05:03 AM, said:

I am talking in weapon to weapon basis.

If Clanners wish to remove Endo and Ferro and change engine sizes, they must give up omni-pod swapping in return.

if you think omnipod swapping makes up for being able to swap structure/engine you are insane (like, literally insane. go commit yourself levels of mind broken). Id make that trade in a heatbeat. Plenty of Omnimechs have perfectly good hardpoint setups without swapping stuff about, its really only the crap ones no one uses anyway that need to swap stuff much.

Edited by Widowmaker1981, 20 May 2015 - 05:20 AM.

[El Bandito]

Knyx, on 20 May 2015 - 05:16 AM, said:

Sure as soon as IS get quirks they have right now wiped, clan weapons get buffed to actually be equal, and most IS mechs get massive negative quirks instead like the timber and scr. Deal

See how things get out of hand if we do not limit the balancing to weapon-to-weapon basis, like how I first suggested? This was simply part of my education to you Clanners, and you swallowed it hook, line, and sinker.

Edited by El Bandito, 20 May 2015 - 05:21 AM.

[Widowmaker1981]

El Bandito, on 20 May 2015 - 05:19 AM, said:

See how things get out of hand if we do not limit the balancing to weapon-to-weapon basis, like how I first suggested? This was simply part of my education to you Clanners, and you swallowed it hook, line, and sinker.

If you balance weapons on a 1 to 1 basis, again, that gives IS a MASSIVE advantage, because swapping omnipods is really only of big use in meaning all variants of clan chassis are useful, instead of some being good and some being Junk. I dont really care about that though, i only need 1 variant of a chassis to be good, since i can only drive one at a time.

For example: with no omnipod swapping all hellbringers would suck donkey except the prime. But thats fine, because id only ever drive the prime.

Edited by Widowmaker1981, 20 May 2015 - 05:27 AM.

[Joseph Mallan]

Widowmaker1981, on 20 May 2015 - 05:17 AM, said:

if you think omnipod swapping makes up for being able to swap structure/engine you are insane (like, literally insane. go commit yourself levels of mind broken). Id make that trade in a heatbeat. Plenty of Omnimechs have perfectly good hardpoint setups without swapping stuff about, its really only the crap ones no one uses anyway that need to swap stuff much.

I don't know Widow. Being able to mix and match Hard Points seems like a fair trade for Locked Engine and structure to me.

Edited by Joseph Mallan, 20 May 2015 - 05:27 AM.

[Widowmaker1981]

Joseph Mallan, on 20 May 2015 - 05:27 AM, said:

I don't know Widow. Being able to mix and match Hard Points seems like a fair trade for Locked Engine and structure to me.

Yes, but you also think that TT rules somehow apply to this game, so your opinion is a little suspect on balance issues

All Dires except A are fine without swapping

All Timbers except C are fine without swapping

All Warhawks except A are fine without swapping

Hellbringer Prime is fine without swapping

Just some examples, and EVERY SINGLE ONE of those above mentioned mechs would benefit HUGELY from being able to swap structure and engine

Edited by Widowmaker1981, 20 May 2015 - 05:36 AM.

[Joseph Mallan]

Widowmaker1981, on 20 May 2015 - 05:30 AM, said:

Yes, but you also think that TT rules somehow apply to this game, so your opinion is a little suspect on balance issues

Only where and when those rules can and do fit real time execution.

[Khan Warlock Kell]

Personally I'd like to see a complete reset of all weapon values to MW4 values reset all the quirks, give quirks only to mechs that actually need them. Accept the fact that some mechs are just plain bad, and others are good. I realise this is a massive change to make, But with all the mechs and weapon systems we have now a complete reset might allow for an easier over all balancing of weapons. Because put bluntly what we have now seems a complete farce and clock up.

Edited by Khan Warlock Kell, 20 May 2015 - 05:46 AM.

[Almond Brown]

IraqiWalker, on 19 May 2015 - 09:30 PM, said:

Stuff

There are over 20 different types of AC 5, firing anywhere between 1, and 10 shots. There is a lot of variety with all other ballistic weapons. If we can give each one it's own stat line, and price. Then we can make all ACs burst fire (the clans would definitely have an advantage considering the better size, and weight, but I think we can find a way to balance that out).

Why waste all that time and effort only to have the Comp players boil that list of 20 down to 2 in 3 hours and then have to deal with all the QQ and BS about how all the others SUCK BALLS and we are back to where we started, but with 18 "suck" units for those who would Whine and QQ about them, instead of the current 4-5.

PGI will address the issue. They have stated as much ffs. Many will obviously disapprove, just becasue "reasons", and without even trying the new changes because so many on here live on the "hearsay" of others for their own opinions.

Others will undoubtedly enjoy whatever changes are implemented and we will begin proceedings on the Subject anew. I am quite confident the new discussion will be "very similar" in nature.

Surely it will be just as entertaining and whiny as always.

Edited by Almond Brown, 20 May 2015 - 06:52 AM.

[Joseph Mallan]

Widowmaker1981, on 20 May 2015 - 05:30 AM, said:

Yes, but you also think that TT rules somehow apply to this game, so your opinion is a little suspect on balance issues

All Dires except A are fine without swapping

All Timbers except C are fine without swapping

All Warhawks except A are fine without swapping

Hellbringer Prime is fine without swapping

Just some examples, and EVERY SINGLE ONE of those above mentioned mechs would benefit HUGELY from being able to swap structure and engine

Fine for you may not be fine for me. Remember "fine" is a personal preference. And On TT an Omni Mech can have whatever loadout so long as it fits tons and Crits, and the GM (and other players) allow it. So even as is PGI has limited the options for Omnis over TT.

Edited by Joseph Mallan, 20 May 2015 - 06:46 AM.

[Almond Brown]

Joseph Mallan, on 20 May 2015 - 03:22 AM, said:

Only reason I can see for not doing this is laziness, of complexity of the programming. Which really means laziness.

And I thought, based on the thread contents, the problem was there are already to many cAC Shells being fired over to long a time span?

Did I miss something in that video? Did those AC5's not Spray shells like totally crazy...

Those 4 AC5's would need 15 times the ammo to be of any use at all in MWO...

[nimdabew]

Joseph Mallan, on 20 May 2015 - 03:22 AM, said:

Only reason I can see for not doing this is laziness, of complexity of the programming. Which really means laziness.

It wouldnt even be any more programming, just tweaking the stats.

AC/2
Damage per shell = .05
Cooldown = .2
Impulse = .02
Range = 2160
Speed = 2000

AC/5
Damage per shell = .09
Cooldown = .24
Impulse = .04
Range = 1500
Speed = 1250

AC/10
Damage per shell = .15
Cooldown = .3
Impulse = .06
Range = 1040
SPeed = 980

AC/20
Damage per shell = .2
Cooldown = .34
Impulse = .1 (extra boom)
Range = 360
Speed = 760




No new coding, no new whatever, just tweak the stats so shooting an auto cannon feels like shooting an auto cannon. FOr ultras, reduce the cooldown by half. DONE. Give the ultra autocannons a 1% chance to jam or something so the LONGER you hold the button down, the greater chance of them jamming.

[IraqiWalker]

Knyx, on 20 May 2015 - 03:16 AM, said:

Since IS has superior lasers, ballistics and LRMs, and now they nerfed the only competitive clan mechs while barely touching the extremely overpowered quirk monsters. I think it is fair to ask for an extreme in this area. Clans should get the PPFLD and IS gets the burst, clans should get lower jam chance whilst IS gets more ammo per ton. If they want to complain about something that they can't even prove has an effect (like slot+weight of their weapons), we can easily fire back with their quirks. It's too bad there isn't more clan players to post on the forums and make mass demands like the IS players do, since PGI knee jerk nerfs and buffs based on forum whine and not actual metrics like a real dev

Thank you for showing again how ignorant you are of the game's state, and lack of understanding of what "superior" means. Seriously, stop, you're an embarrassment.

(Really, you can't taste the effect of lighter, and smaller weapons with similar if not better performance?)

El Bandito, on 20 May 2015 - 05:19 AM, said:

See how things get out of hand if we do not limit the balancing to weapon-to-weapon basis, like how I first suggested? This was simply part of my education to you Clanners, and you swallowed it hook, line, and sinker.

In all fairness, tricking someone with the IQ of a half eaten banana is not that difficult. What would be impressive is if he learned a lesson. However, higher brain functionality is yet to be proven in this case, so I doubt it.

Almond Brown, on 20 May 2015 - 06:47 AM, said:

And I thought, based on the thread contents, the problem was there are already to many cAC Shells being fired over to long a time span?

Did I miss something in that video? Did those AC5's not Spray shells like totally crazy...

Those 4 AC5's would need 15 times the ammo to be of any use at all in MWO...

Kind of an exaggeration there. However, the real problem isn't the duration (it's a part of it), the real problem is HSR. When an IS AC fires, it's got a 50/50 shot of dealing it's full damage. Since HSR only needs to check for this one bullet, those odds actually improve dramatically.

However, a clan UAC 5 fires 3 shots. Each starts off at 50/50 odds of being registered by HSR. The problem is that there are multiple bullets fired, which increases the chance of these bullets just disappearing into the ether and not dealing any damage. Suddenly, that UAC 5 has dealt only 3 damage with the first salvo, and the second salvo arrives, with a more stressed HSR, leading to another 1 or maybe 2 bullets missing. Suddenly, that entire salvo instead of dishing out 10 damage, deals 5.

THAT is the real problem with Clan ballistics. It is the same problem with lasers, but missing out 2 or 3 ticks out of 15 is not that big of a deal, since you're losing fractions of damage there. So that's why lasers are a bit more reliable with damage.

If HSR gets fixed, ballistics improve immensely. None more so than clan ballistics.

Edited by IraqiWalker, 20 May 2015 - 10:09 AM.