101 replies to this topic

[990Dreams]

Novakaine, on 12 May 2015 - 08:24 PM, said:

Last night I was in a match, I watched a FS9 take 5 gauss shots.
And it still lived.
The FS9 was dancing and alpha striking a Direwolf.
It shut down at 3 times, managed to kill the Dire Wolf, then turn and killed the Shadow Hawk.
I was in the Shadow Hawk's cockpit watching.
That is just ridiculous.
I understand you put microscopic hit boxes on lights to improve their survivabilty.
Or no one would play them.

First of all, this poetry is beautiful. Second of all, Firestarters are notorious for taking too much damage. Their hitboxes have been in question for some time.

Novakaine, on 12 May 2015 - 08:24 PM, said:

Not to mention the lag shield included.
Just plain stupid.

Once again, PGI isn't going to run fiber optic cable to your house to fix your internets. Lights don't have a built in lag shield, so stop whining about it because it isn't even PGI's problem.

Novakaine, on 12 May 2015 - 08:24 PM, said:

Oh and by the way increase the range on my tag, and fix my freaking lrms.

First, Clan or IS? Second, TAG is fine as it is.

Also, once again, I adore the OP's poetic style. Makes me cry every time.

Edited by DavidHurricane, 13 May 2015 - 07:23 AM.

[InRev]

N0MAD, on 13 May 2015 - 01:32 AM, said:

You play the game, as per the russian UFO comment, indeed brother.
P39 has 4 mg to go with the 37mm btw.
Yes i was refering to the 9T, i dont play Russians often, altho i have Lvl them up, but we do for fun an gigles take them into Rank 4-5 matches (as you know 9T is rank 2). Still like to troll with them, still they dont make shooting any easier.
Main nation is German, but all my nations are at highest lvls

I don't know if they've changed the ballistics since I last played, but the 37mm M4 on the P39 was not nearly as effective as the Russian 37mm. It was infuriating really. You could pump 37mm HE into a Yak's tail and it would just *sparkle sparkle sparkle*. Meanwhile the 9T just breathes in your general direction and your wing falls off. Hell, most of the time I would just ignore the 37mm on my Cobras unless shooting bombers, even though the 50s on them didn't have the good ammo belts.

Plus, the goddamn Yaks retained energy so well, they could boom and zoom better than dedicated energy fighters. Poor P-47. Its flight model was so off. Being caught by paper-light Russian turn fighters in any dive (long, short, steep, shallow, it didn't matter you couldn't out-dive a Yak) was one of the stupidest things I have ever seen in any flight sim. Its why the damn plane was so ridiculously undertiered. Something was seriously wrong with its drag coefficient. Oh, and it caught on fire instantly, despite it being a flying tank.

And don't get me started on how stupidly overtiered the Germans were.

Ugh, that game was infuriating. So much potential was squandered by incompetence. People don't realize how much better PGI are compared to Gaijin.

[Dino Might]

Aresye Kerensky, on 12 May 2015 - 10:33 PM, said:

We know this game DOES have hitreg issues, so it is by no far stretch to assume that when hitreg is poor, the mechs with the best hitboxes will end up being the most survivable.

The most common type of hitreg issues I've seen often require a very small amount of lag shooting to compensate. For example in this video:


Towards the end of the video when chain-firing medium lasers you can see that more than enough shots are landing on the CT to effectively "kill" it, but when you look at the paper doll, most of the damage seems to be wearing down the left torso.

I didn't notice massive hit-reg problems. To me, it looked like a lot of the medium laser shots went clearly to CT or ST, and the paperdoll readout matched closely what was going on. Remember that the Timby does have quite a bit of internal structure to chew through. Something like 23 or so on that CT? That's at least 5 full burn medium lasers, and given that hit reg is at least a bit wonky and aim is not perfect, should be more than 5 shots. I don't see anything so grossly bad that it warrants a redesign. I was only looking towards the end, when the Timby had an orange CT.

BUT - I appreciate you posting a video to point something out, unlike everyone who is telling us how big the fish was that they caught, but then released back into the stream. Videos like this help us actually evaluate the problem.

[Lily from animove]

DavidHurricane, on 13 May 2015 - 07:22 AM, said:

Once again, PGI isn't going to run fiber optic cable to your house to fix your internets. Lights don't have a built in lag shield, so stop whining about it because it isn't even PGI's problem.

if that is the case, then hitreg would be a constant and consistent discrepancy in its behavior also related to where someone connects to MWO from.
But the fact that this chanegs form match to match, and soemtimes (mostly with many people playing) generaly decreases, shows that ther eis more than just network involved in this.

[990Dreams]

Lily from animove, on 13 May 2015 - 07:32 AM, said:

if that is the case, then hitreg would be a constant and consistent discrepancy in its behavior also related to where someone connects to MWO from.
But the fact that this chanegs form match to match, and soemtimes (mostly with many people playing) generaly decreases, shows that ther eis more than just network involved in this.

It changes because of different form factors and hitboxes. Firestarters have consistently been the glitchiest Mechs for my hitreg; everything else has been constant (except in instances of high ping for me or the other player, or other unusual instances which don't occur more than once).

Maybe I just have a perfect computer, client, and internet, and everyone else doesn't. Except none of those things are the case.

[mogs01gt]

DavidHurricane, on 13 May 2015 - 07:22 AM, said:

Once again, PGI isn't going to run fiber optic cable to your house to fix your internets. Lights don't have a built in lag shield, so stop whining about it because it isn't even PGI's problem.

When people post this kind of crap, it really shows who knows **** about this game.

[DONTOR]

Ya pretty sure laser designators have a MUCH better range IRL, than our TAG's

[Novakaine]

DavidHurricane, on 13 May 2015 - 07:22 AM, said:

First of all, this poetry is beautiful. Second of all, Firestarters are notorious for taking too much damage. Their hitboxes have been in question for some time.



Once again, PGI isn't going to run fiber optic cable to your house to fix your internets. Lights don't have a built in lag shield, so stop whining about it because it isn't even PGI's problem.



First, Clan or IS? Second, TAG is fine as it is.

Also, once again, I adore the OP's poetic style. Makes me cry every time.

I heard that free fiber optics would be part of IS reinforcement pack 5.
But don't tell anyone.

[Greenjulius]

Mister D, on 12 May 2015 - 09:26 PM, said:

I get 44 ping to the server, and hitreg is still a joke.

Mister D speaks the truth. Hitreg is bad, bad, bad.

I feel like in order to do best in matches, you have to be in that magic realm of having poor latency, (But not too bad) while your opponents have good latency. That way the server hitreg punishes the players with good ping by most hits registering, while the laggert gets the benefit of magic lag armor.

I know some players simply open up a few torrents to add cheesy, artificial latency to make it that much harder to hit their itty bitty mech. Try it with a 170kph locust, and never stop running. You'll rarely get hit unless someone is really lucky, or brings SSRMs.

I'd love to see this remedied, but it hasn't been fixed in 3 years.

Edited by Greenjulius, 13 May 2015 - 08:10 AM.

[Apnu]

Poisoner, on 12 May 2015 - 08:36 PM, said:

So people who play Clans are horrible no skill players who need OP mechs to win but somehow firestarter pilots arent?

OP said what about clans?

[Almond Brown]

Lily from animove, on 13 May 2015 - 07:32 AM, said:

if that is the case, then hitreg would be a constant and consistent discrepancy in its behavior also related to where someone connects to MWO from.
But the fact that this changes form match to match, and sometimes (mostly with many people playing) general decreases, shows that there is more than just network involved in this.

The fact that it changes Match to Match shows exactly that it is Network based most of the time. Every Match has a different set of Pings and Latencies based on who is in the Match. We all suffer the LCD of the group, especially when they are directly in the action with you.

It is why I can have a silky smooth Match, then a GD slideshow the next. Checking Pings between the 2 Matches reveals the issue. First was all sub <250 pings and the next had 3 guys/gals with +500 pings, and 1 +750.

Thus the change even when those Matches are a mere 10 minutes apart. Do you think the PGI Servers change up and down every 10 minutes? Not at all likely. Mixed Pings and Latency among a group of 24 different players (Pug). Quite likely indeed.

Every Match has a different LCD. When the East TZ's plays with Oceanic TZ, etc etc etc, things can get pretty wonky.

It is after-all the World Wide Web right?

Edited by Almond Brown, 13 May 2015 - 08:50 AM.

[Fate 6]

I've played against competitive players that regularly 1shot components (torsos, legs) on my Firestarter while I'm running full speed amd tapping JJs. Hit reg may be bad, but people's aim is often worse. Good players kill light mechs, bad players don't.

[Satan n stuff]

InRev, on 13 May 2015 - 07:24 AM, said:

I don't know if they've changed the ballistics since I last played, but the 37mm M4 on the P39 was not nearly as effective as the Russian 37mm. It was infuriating really. You could pump 37mm HE into a Yak's tail and it would just *sparkle sparkle sparkle*. Meanwhile the 9T just breathes in your general direction and your wing falls off. Hell, most of the time I would just ignore the 37mm on my Cobras unless shooting bombers, even though the 50s on them didn't have the good ammo belts.

Plus, the goddamn Yaks retained energy so well, they could boom and zoom better than dedicated energy fighters. Poor P-47. Its flight model was so off. Being caught by paper-light Russian turn fighters in any dive (long, short, steep, shallow, it didn't matter you couldn't out-dive a Yak) was one of the stupidest things I have ever seen in any flight sim. Its why the damn plane was so ridiculously undertiered. Something was seriously wrong with its drag coefficient. Oh, and it caught on fire instantly, despite it being a flying tank.

And don't get me started on how stupidly overtiered the Germans were.

Ugh, that game was infuriating. So much potential was squandered by incompetence. People don't realize how much better PGI are compared to Gaijin.

Wait, these guys play a game made by the same idiots who made X-Blades? Damn right PGI are better than them, that game ranks lower than most movie adaptations in my book.

[SkyHammyr]

Yeah, but when -I- pilot an FS9.
Somebody even looks at me funny, I explode.
FML.

[Joseph Mallan]

SkyHammr, on 13 May 2015 - 09:07 AM, said:

Yeah, but when -I- pilot an FS9.
Somebody even looks at me funny, I explode.
FML.

Your Mileage does not vary!

[Ovion]

Novakaine, on 12 May 2015 - 08:24 PM, said:

Last night I was in a match, I watched a FS9 take 5 gauss shots.
And it still lived.
The FS9 was dancing and alpha striking a Direwolf.
It shut down at 3 times, managed to kill the Dire Wolf, then turn and killed the Shadow Hawk.
I was in the Shadow Hawk's cockpit watching.
That is just ridiculous.
I understand you put microscopic hit boxes on lights to improve their survivabilty.
Or no one would play them.
Not to mention the lag shield included.
Just plain stupid.
Oh and by the way increase the range on my tag, and fix my freaking lrms.
GRRRRRR.......
Rant over.
Commence QQ.

Hitreg issues or not, lets just share some info for you.

Firestarter - 35T, properly armoured, has the following health values (HP+Armour):
Head - 29
Center Torso - 55 Front (33 Rear)
Side Torsos - 2x 40 Front (24 Rear)
Arms - 2x 36
Legs - 2x 48
Total - 359
Meaning, unless all those were put in one location, it'll be quite capable of tanking 50 damage.

From fresh, it would take 4x Gauss to the CT to drop it, 3 to a single Side Torso,
It would take 3 to destroy an arm, and 4 to each leg.

Any other issues aside, hope this helps.

Edited by Ovion, 13 May 2015 - 09:18 AM.

[Satan n stuff]

SkyHammr, on 13 May 2015 - 09:07 AM, said:

Yeah, but when -I- pilot an FS9.
Somebody even looks at me funny, I explode.
FML.

Round the wrong corner and you have just enough time to go "oh ****" before something blasts you to the great mechbay in the sky, is that about right?

Edited by Satan n stuff, 13 May 2015 - 09:20 AM.

[Devilsfury]

Threads like this have been going since the introduction of the Firestarter. Probably hundreds. Anyone playing this game more than a week knows that this mech is completely broken when it comes to the amount of damage they can take in the upper torso. People have posted numerous videos, posts, rants and raves about it. Still, PGI and Russ seem to think that nothing is wrong with them. Their response is that most of the light mechs that seem to shrug off damage, IE: FS, Spider, Commando, IF, is not their hitboxes but the speed of the mechs and ping of the people playing them. I have always, and always will call bullsh!t on this. Seriously, look at the Jenner, you can kill it pretty easy and everything registers on it. If it were the speed and ping and not the hitboxes, why are Jenners so easy to kill? Huh? Explain that one! But yes, you have to leg them. I can say that 95% of all my light kills happen because they are legged. Killing them in the torso dont work unless they are stupid enough to just stand there and trade.

[CygnusX7]

I can see it now...
Lasers waving all over the FS9 = hit reg sucks.

I know this because I've done it myself.

[Sarlic]

Fate 6, on 13 May 2015 - 08:56 AM, said:

I've played against competitive players that regularly 1shot components (torsos, legs) on my Firestarter while I'm running full speed amd tapping JJs. Hit reg may be bad, but people's aim is often worse. Good players kill light mechs, bad players don't.

You are full of balony.

Hitreg and or desyncs problems have always been a problem in this game. Does not matter which, who or what it have, it's still a problem.