757 replies to this topic

[Unit47]

Alienized, on 20 May 2015 - 09:32 AM, said:

how come some people say the nerf is actually not that bad and massive?

Who?

The underhive who can't even figure out how to build mechs and slaps anything that fits on a mech and calls it godly when he wins against other terribads? Thats hardly a valid opinion when it comes to balancing questions.

You can turn and twist it as much as you like 18% more duration on the SCR and 21% on the TBR is over the top. The 2X is no longer viable due to its 15% nerf and will completely vanish from competitive play. But hey I guess having only a SINGLE viable light mech ingame is a good design decision by your standards.

[Alienized]

Repasy, on 20 May 2015 - 09:44 AM, said:

Yup, typical founder behaviour. They think just because they bought into MWO early they're entitled to OP mode. Read the EULA people. They can change stats whenever the heck they want to.

i could have been a founder too, played closed beta but im not entitled to anything but my own ideas. i play mechs how i want them and i play them better as many do the meta.
on the other hand not everyone can play loadouts.

the high horse always had a long fall down.
now that they are falling down from it they have nothing better to do than insulting players that can deal with it without problems, driving loadouts they dont understand. and call it underhive.

[Repasy Cooper]

teslabear, on 20 May 2015 - 09:46 AM, said:

After a few more games, really feels like the nerfs on the timberwolf achieved the opposite of what the devs intended. The reduced DPS and longer face time affected my close range brawler builds with only 2-4 lasers the most, while the alpha striking cMPL tbr is barely affected.

For all practical purposes lasers feel like an all or none option now. I guess the large number of lasers and pinpoint damage still mostly offsets the reduced dps. I guess PGI wanted everyone to go meta.

So not true though. People should go back to stock builds and give them a try before discounting builds that aren't laser-meta. I have barely been affected by this nerf. The ONLY people affected are the laser-meta cowboys lol.

[Pihoqahiak]

Repasy, on 20 May 2015 - 09:35 AM, said:

My first game in got 3 kills with the TBR-PRIME. Stock build. Post 'nerf' lol.

It REALLY is not that bad guys, don't get so obsessed over pen & paper stats...

Everyone gets a lucky game here or there, simple as that, just as great players in the best builds can have unlucky games and get headshot by a dual gauss a minute into a match. Also, kills are not a reliable measure of performance at all as it's fairly easy to finish off heavily damaged mechs with nearly anything. Your comment really doesn't prove anything other than showing that you try to justify your position with irrelevant stats.

[Alienized]

Unit47, on 20 May 2015 - 09:48 AM, said:

Who?

The underhive who can't even figure out how to build mechs and slaps anything that fits on a mech and calls it godly when he wins against other terribads? Thats hardly a valid opinion when it comes to balancing questions.

You can turn and twist it as much as you like 18% more duration on the SCR and 21% on the TBR is over the top. The 2X is no longer viable due to its 15% nerf and will completely vanish from competitive play. But hey I guess having only a SINGLE viable light mech ingame is a good design decision by your standards.

the underhive is thicker than you will ever be. one light?
the myst lynx i rank up 600 to 800 damage?
the raven 3l with 179 armor getting the same and even more in CW?
the 3 jenners i started to play?

no idea why you have such a grudge against me but i can deal with the changes and still play good.
you obviously cant.

i feel good in my underhive as long as such arrogant, ignorant and toxic players are not welcome here.

[Pihoqahiak]

Repasy, on 20 May 2015 - 09:44 AM, said:

Yup, typical founder behaviour. They think just because they bought into MWO early they're entitled to OP mode. Read the EULA people. They can change stats whenever the heck they want to.

Yeah, because anything a Founder got from buying into MW:O early was "OP mode" lol. How many Founder variants do you see on the battlefield (other than when they had the Founder weekend event)?

[Unit47]

Alienized, on 20 May 2015 - 09:55 AM, said:

the underhive is thicker than you will ever be. one light?
the myst lynx i rank up 600 to 800 damage?
the raven 3l with 179 armor getting the same and even more in CW?
the 3 jenners i started to play?

lol

[Alienized]

Unit47, on 20 May 2015 - 10:03 AM, said:

lol

sorry that you can only play good in meta mechs.

[Repasy Cooper]

Pihoqahiak, on 20 May 2015 - 09:57 AM, said:

Yeah, because anything a Founder got from buying into MW:O early was "OP mode" lol. How many Founder variants do you see on the battlefield (other than when they had the Founder weekend event)?

It doesn't matter if you're a founder, or you bought the clan packs (like me) or you're a newbie. They have the power to change the product at will, no matter how many people complain about it. Having said that, they would not arbitrarily randomly Nerf a mech without statistical data to support it. The self-entitled players don't recognize this, or don't want to, because since they paid money they deserve to have better stuff.

This game is not p2w. If you paid money, you did so to receive early access to content and support the continuation of this f2p game. You do not own the content, you only have access to it. PGI can change that content as much as they want and they won't breach any contract doing so.

It's in their best interests to find balance that pleases a majority of players. Thus, those who are still qqing over this Nerf are the minority.

[IraqiWalker]

Unit47, on 20 May 2015 - 09:48 AM, said:

Who?

The underhive who can't even figure out how to build mechs and slaps anything that fits on a mech and calls it godly when he wins against other terribads? Thats hardly a valid opinion when it comes to balancing questions.

You can turn and twist it as much as you like 18% more duration on the SCR and 21% on the TBR is over the top. The 2X is no longer viable due to its 15% nerf and will completely vanish from competitive play. But hey I guess having only a SINGLE viable light mech ingame is a good design decision by your standards.

Considering you're in that underhive. I really don't think you should be throwing that word around too much. I've already had clan players confirm that the nerfs are barely felt on their TBRs, and I'm talking actually GOOD players, the solid ones who have been playing this game for several years now, and know their stuff.

Now specifically to address your 2x comment: What have you been smoking? Since when was the IS limited to only the raven chassis for viable lights? The FS9s are doing a phenomenal job. The Spider 5D specifically is still a great, and quite viable, light in competitive play. Some of the jenners have seen play in competitive scenes. Throw in a stray Hugginn or two, and I don't see how making the 2X less beastly limits us to only ONE viable light mech.

[Unit47]

Repasy, on 20 May 2015 - 10:12 AM, said:

It's in their best interests to find balance that pleases a majority of players. Thus, those who are still qqing over this Nerf are the minority.

I guess thats why every PVP game with commercial success doesn't balance for the casual majority but for the competitive minority.

But hey you better tell Blizzard, Valve and Riot before they need shutdown the servers tomorrow.

IraqiWalker, on 20 May 2015 - 10:44 AM, said:

Now specifically to address your 2x comment: What have you been smoking? Since when was the IS limited to only the raven chassis for viable lights? The FS9s are doing a phenomenal job. The Spider 5D specifically is still a great, and quite viable, light in competitive play. Some of the jenners have seen play in competitive scenes. Throw in a stray Hugginn or two, and I don't see how making the 2X less beastly limits us to only ONE viable light mech.

L2Read. I said after the nerf the only viable light in unrestricted comp play is the FS. The rest of the chassis work only in certain artificially created scenarious - like MRBC or MCW - where chassis and tech are restricted.

Edited by Unit47, 20 May 2015 - 10:57 AM.

[Alienized]

i dont balance lights all time but when i do i take the light with the highest quirks, the best hitboxes and the worst hitreg
with the most laser-hardpoints as standard.

[Ceneakor]

Mosadoff, on 20 May 2015 - 03:34 AM, said:

On the russian World of Tanks forum WarGaming is very active in talking with their community. There is thousands-posts long thread where they answer questions.

And ofc, there was a question "why my OP tank was nerfed". WarGaming's official position is: "you have played it for 1.5 years, had the PWNage and was happy, we have the statistics. And you knew that it's going to be nerfed".

BTW, WG actually warns a community in 6 month or so before each popular chassiss nerf.
PGI should learn from them.

Wargaming also has a policy of avoiding direct nerfs to paid for premium vehicles.

They had a problem with the premium Type 59 medium tank though.
The tank had good mobility (as expected of a medium tank) and a rounded dome turret that due to it's shape could deflect shots made at the wrong angles dispite it's mediocre armor value. It had the disadvantage of a weaker penetration gun and small ammo count compared to other tanks of it's tier, and a few weak spots where you were able one shot it due to ammo racking. Due to these weaknesses It also came with prefered matchmaking so it would not face tanks of much higher tier than itself.
The matchmaking meant that it would usually only meet it's tier and lower tanks and in the hands of veteran players however, it would wreak inexperienced players in lower tier tanks who did not know how to fight it because the Type 59s could just out-maneuver them and then shoot their flank or rear where their armor was weaker.
After a long period of endless complaints of Type 59 OP in the forums (almost one every other days), they finally removed it from sale for the NA and EU. Current owners of the Type 59 were allowed to keep their types but nobody else could buy one of these from then on ever again.

[Alienized]

omg people compare tanks that cant be customized with mechs that can be customized and refitted in many ways....
tanks that will be in battles with its own tier +/-2

IF we would have such a MM or only stock loadouts it would be something else
BUT we dont have that.

MWO is much more complicated to balance than WoT. you cant shove mechs around tiers like its done in WoT to play in a different tier for the matchmaker.

you have to balance mechs against every other mech and their roles which is thousand times harder.

[IraqiWalker]

Unit47, on 20 May 2015 - 10:53 AM, said:

L2Read. I said after the nerf the only viable light in unrestricted comp play is the FS. The rest of the chassis work only in certain artificially created scenarious - like MRBC or MCW - where chassis and tech are restricted.

That's why I'm telling you you're wrong. I just listed at least 2 others that work just fine, not just in comp play, but even in CW.

So that L2Read sounds like good advice, you should probably heed it.

[Unit47]

IraqiWalker, on 20 May 2015 - 11:29 AM, said:

That's why I'm telling you you're wrong. I just listed at least 2 others that work just fine, not just in comp play, but even in CW.

Yes? Please enlighten me which units used those chassis to great extent in RHOD or a similar league and had great success with them.

[ScarecrowES]

I don't think the complaint is that the community is terribly unhappy that an OP meta gets nerfed. The complaint is more, I think, that what we define as the "meta" is a combination of both builds and tactics, and that addressing merely the base fundamentals of a build irrespective of both the tactics that make the build effective (remember the changes that lead to the end of poptarting) and how those changes will effect builds outside the meta is a very very poor way to do things.

As i said, these changes don't really hurt t-wolves and s-crows with a meta build and being used how meta mechs are run. For them, most time in a match will be about the same. Players who don't use the meta will be impacted most. So really, they may be pushing players in the opposite direction TOWARD The meta.

The reality is, using a laser-laden mech to pop out of cover, vomit, and drop back into cover to cool off is going to be largely uneffected by laser duration or cooling efficiency. All it means is that you're going to have to remain behind cover a little bit longer to cool off, and that your lasers will be run in for more of the Time you've 'spent out of cover. That's it. But for everyone else using lasers as a part of a normal build playing in normal fashion? 15-21% change is a huge deal for brawling face to face where clans are already at a disadvantage.

Edited by ScarecrowES, 20 May 2015 - 12:14 PM.

[IraqiWalker]

Unit47, on 20 May 2015 - 11:45 AM, said:

Yes? Please enlighten me which units used those chassis to great extent in RHOD or a similar league and had great success with them.

Oh hey! since you have access to those brackets, you can save us both the trouble, and just look up the rosters. That should answer your own question.

[Unit47]

IraqiWalker, on 20 May 2015 - 12:14 PM, said:

Oh hey! since you have access to those brackets, you can save us both the trouble, and just look up the rosters. That should answer your own question.

Ah you can't win the argument and now you are buggering off. Pathetic.

But since you asked the answer is 3x RVN 3L, 2x Huggins in the 8v8 division out of ~200 games total (6 matches, best of 3/unit). All teams using them ended in the lower end of the scoreboard/or did switch to FS against higher tier competitors.

In the 4v4 division the numbers are slightly higher due a higher number of newer teams competing. Again all teams using them ended in the lower end of the scoreboard or switched to FS during the season.

Edited by Unit47, 20 May 2015 - 12:41 PM.

[Augustus Martelus II]

Hoffenstein, on 16 May 2015 - 01:38 PM, said:

Hooray! We may see more than 3 Clan Mech's played now

like they should do with the 3 main IS chassis in CW

So we could get a bunch of gargage mech on both side trowing rocks at each others....might add something.