172 replies to this topic

[Knyx]

Bishop Steiner, on 18 May 2015 - 07:44 AM, said:

The TBR and SCR DID need to be reigned in. (but then, so do certain IS builds, more on that later)


While it can add up to a pretty ridiculous number, seems to me that only really happens if..... you insist on laserboating everything. It's certainly the easiest builds to play with. And no one in their right mind would argue Clan ACs don't need some love (which is supposedly coming, but should have been implemented first). So It's not quite the End of Days, some are forecasting for those Mechs, unless you insist on laserboating. But it's still the wrong nerf, and overdone.

But they should have hit the Agility and maybe removed the Speed Tweak bonus from the chassis, instead of this. (Of course, I have been cussed at for saying this for over 6 months..yet now some of those who cussed me are begging for these nerfs instead, lol) And then, possibly hit some individual pods, or not have the pods Quirks stack to begin with. (Aka, your bonus or nerf for the LT should not affect your weapons in the RA, and vice versa). Sadly, that would take time and effort, and thus.... won't happen.

BUT...........

Truly to me the issue is...how tiny the changes to the STK-4N and FS9s are, compared to Clan Mechs. a whopping 2.5% reduction to cooldown and such on the FS9, while ignoring it's real issue (worst hitreg in the game, combined with great hitboxes, speed, jumping and DPS potential) 2.5% reductions to the important stuff (cooldown and heat) on the STK-4N will barely make a difference.

And this ignores mechs like the Huginn altogether (funny how much Clanners still cry over the DRG-1N, when I'd rather face one of those, then the SRM DPS of a Huginn mixed with it's intermittently wonky Light Mech hitreg), along with the other overquirked IS Mechs (though when people QQ over a HBK-4J, I gotta laugh, as LRMs still pretty much only regularly kill bads, and maybe it says more about how Comps and other high Elos players have gotten away from using AMS, cover, Target Derp Modules, etc).

Only idiots and Homers still claim the TBR and SCR aren't OP. But even with the stock pods, seems like they might be getting hit a little too hard. Laughable, that Russ's pet mechanic to fight this, GH has been so totally circumvented, that he has to go QuirkNerf Wild on stuff. Even worse, seems to be the quirk imbalance, and the severity difference between IS and Clan OP MetaMechs in this patch. And how many Clan Underperfomers are still largely laughable in their quirks (Nova got over-armored, but otherwise is MEH, SMNs and Adders are still BAD, etc)

Just my 2cts, as someone who regularly plays accts for BOTH factions.

I would be happy to have your input, but let's try to minimize the melodrama, as my hope is to get Russ to look at this thread, and not just ignore it because of some people whining like Teenage Girls who parents aren't getting them the new Iphone. Thanks!

1. The IS nerfs were dumb and worthless, especially when I'd bet the metrics would show the 4n, FS, Tbolt, jager and a few other IS mechs completely ooutperforming the TBR and SCR combined. But hey, we don't have the metrics, PGI does... and they just ignore them and nerf as the forum *loud minority* dictates.

2. If the TBR and SCR were OP feel free to post the metrics proving such.

[Almond Brown]

Knyx, on 19 May 2015 - 05:16 AM, said:

1. The IS nerfs were dumb and worthless, especially when I'd bet the metrics would show the 4n, FS, Tbolt, jager and a few other IS mechs completely ooutperforming the TBR and SCR combined. But hey, we don't have the metrics, PGI does... and they just ignore them and nerf as the forum *loud minority* dictates.

2. If the TBR and SCR were OP feel free to post the metrics proving such.

Quote

and they just ignore them and nerf as the forum *loud minority* dictates.

and it would be very interesting to see you prove that statement with "facts based on real fact"

You Do exactly what you accuse PGI of doing and yet your doing it is somehow OK? Gotta call BS... sorry.

Edited by Almond Brown, 19 May 2015 - 05:31 AM.

[Knyx]

Almond Brown, on 19 May 2015 - 05:31 AM, said:

and it would be very interesting to see you prove that statement with "facts based on real fact"

You Do exactly what you accuse PGI of doing and yet your doing it is somehow OK? Gotta call BS... sorry.

Feel free to point out where I am doing what I accuse of PGI doing. Please feel free.
As I said they have access to the metrics, we don't

[Chrome Magnus]

LordKnightFandragon, on 18 May 2015 - 11:11 PM, said:

But the Stalker still remains in the positive, so its still getting a nice bonus...so there is no reason to QQ about the nerf....

LordKnightFandragon, on 18 May 2015 - 11:11 PM, said:

But the Stalker still remains in the positive, so its still getting a nice bonus...so there is no reason to QQ about the nerf....

As I've said before, this means nothing. NOTHING. A nerf is a nerf and impacts it's overall performance. It doesn't mean squat that a mech still retains some positive quirks when those quirks were needed to bring it up to about TW/SC/pick another level in the first place. A reduction in performance is a reduction in performance, even if they don't make it go negative. The whole "positive quirks" argument is inane and holds less water than a fishing net.

Edit: before someone who hasn't read all my posts jumps in... I am not saying that the the TW/SC nerfs were done right or on the same level as the Stalker nerfs as there is POTENTIAL for theirs to be a good bit harsher.

Edited by Chrome Magnus, 19 May 2015 - 07:01 AM.

[Dagor1]

I get a kick out of the people who are like "Maybe we will see more clan AC builds",

You will not, All the clan AC's are not just bad, they are horrible. Every other clan weapon outperforms them, even the ones that get nerfs, Heck, Every IS weapon outperforms them.I would boat SRMs and machine guns on my tbr before I would put on AC's...It would perform better.

Interesting to me that PGI buffed underperforming IS mechs by ALOT. But does the opposite to clan.

Hey, PGI, ever wonder why people have pet names for the other clan mechs like the adder is the Badder?

Want people to play something else, make it more attractive. And not by surrounding it with manure.

Edited by Dagor1, 19 May 2015 - 07:58 AM.

[Almond Brown]

Knyx, on 19 May 2015 - 05:34 AM, said:

Feel free to point out where I am doing what I accuse of PGI doing. Please feel free.
As I said they have access to the metrics, we don't

If you do not comprehend what your wrote, then far be it for me to bring you self-clarity. Your apparent FOG is surely a cozy blanket from under which you see the world differently.

[FlipOver]

I'm sorry if I arrived a bit late for this discussion but I'd like to share my thoughts about quirks and nerfs/buffs.

To me, there should be no quirks available.

We should have multiple manufacturers of weapons, and each manuf would improve the weapon in a way or the other.
Examples:
ER-LL - Manuf1 - Bigger ( +2 slots used) - longer range (x%) - higher heat (x%) - larger duration (x%)
ER-LL - Manuf2 - Standard size - standard range - standard heat - standard duration
ER-LL - Manuf3 - Semi-big (+1 slot) - bit longer range (x-y%) - bit less heat (x-y%) - bit duration (x-y%)
ER-LL - Manuf4 - Standard size - closer range (x%) - less heat (x%) - less duration (x%)
And so on... You get the idea.

Now, some mechs would be compliant with some models more than others.

And now comes the mech design into play.
All mechs have a similar structure and I mean similar as in all have a few slots to use on each part, quantity varies but that's it.
They don't take into account the weight ratio between the mech and weapon (fitting a 35 ton mech with a weapon that weighs 15% of the mechs total weight on just one component should be the limit, but then we have mechs with 2 weapons with 15% of the mechs weight on the same component)
Also, I think the larger the mech (in tonnage) the bigger the weaponry they would be able to use.
(Right now we can fit anything into any mech, we just need to compromise in ammo or armor or speed/type of engine)

So, to me AC20's, Gauss and LRM20, SRM6 should only be used on Heavy to Assault mechs.
The lower the weapon caliber, the lighter the mech could be to use it.

Also, with the weapon manufacturers idea, the same mech could have slots to fit a weapon from Manuf2 but not one from Manuf1 or 3.

If this was in effect, there would be no need for quirks, and probably we wouldn't need ghost heat also.
It would all depend on how this matter would be implemented.

I wish I had time and skill to have a few pictures uploaded with the slots ideas and changes, but you guys will have to use your imagination.

[ThirtyOughtSix]

Loving the ideas and the feedback from our community. This is all well and good. I do think that these quirks and adjustments are just annoying and intrusive on gameplay. I think more than anything else the meta needs to be broken. Of course there will always be a meta - we all want the best - but level the damn field. So many are in an uproar because the easy mode laser meta just got a little tougher. I say break this trend before it's too late PGI. In effect this will stop the requirement for 66% of the quirks. For instance, PPC quirks won't be needed because they are ACTUALLY viable. AC quirks won't be needed because THEY ARE NOW VIABLE.

Fix PPCs (total overhaul)
Fix IS ballistics (are you kidding me on AC2 heat?! LBX spread ect)
Fix Clan ballistics
Fix double heat sinks
Lower mech heat cap (force mechs to use ACs and LRM to mitigate heat)

All I'm saying is level the weapons out so more than 1 friggin type is playable. That way it rewards the beaten down not played variants that need 3-4 weapon groups. Not the laser boats who only need 2 groups, alpha and chain fire. The game is so stale.

Who cares about quirks - fix the basic game. Get rid of 66% of the quirks. Quirk the seriously useless mechs that desperately need them. Not the already really great Stalker.

[Mirkk Defwode]

FlipOver, on 19 May 2015 - 08:37 AM, said:

...

I've advocated this for awhile to add additional variety. The issue that starts here is that we should have stable and consistent balance between the weapons before we do this. Then we can use the original "balanced" baseline to differentiate off of.

I also think we should have quirks for the things that define the chassis and it's function. But I also don't want to encourage boating with those extreme rewards for using a singular weapon.

[Joseph Mallan]

FlipOver, on 19 May 2015 - 08:37 AM, said:

I'm sorry if I arrived a bit late for this discussion but I'd like to share my thoughts about quirks and nerfs/buffs.

To me, there should be no quirks available.

We should have multiple manufacturers of weapons, and each manuf would improve the weapon in a way or the other.
Examples:

So get rid of the Quirk system we have to implement a more specific Quirk system? And let the Players decide which way THEY like to fight?!

I like it.

[Shredhead]

Dagor1, on 19 May 2015 - 07:51 AM, said:

I get a kick out of the people who are like "Maybe we will see more clan AC builds",

You will not, All the clan AC's are not just bad, they are horrible. Every other clan weapon outperforms them, even the ones that get nerfs, Heck, Every IS weapon outperforms them.I would boat SRMs and machine guns on my tbr before I would put on AC's...It would perform better.

Interesting to me that PGI buffed underperforming IS mechs by ALOT. But does the opposite to clan.

Hey, PGI, ever wonder why people have pet names for the other clan mechs like the adder is the Badder?

Because people are idiots? Because people don't know how to mechlab, people don't know how to move and twist, people don't know how to play mechs to their maximum potential?
Because these same people come to the forums and ***** and moan about the opposite faction being 'OP', accuse everyone who can hit specific torso parts of 'cheating', demand ridiculous garbage like sized hardpoints or 'fixing' of certain mechs hitboxes although absolutely nothing is wrong with them or quirks for tier 1 mechs that are absolutely unnecessary! And all that without knowing jack-**** about this game and how it works, like the OP of this thread who plays in steering wheel underhive but supposedly knows how to balance it.
Case in point, this special snowflake here:

FlipOver, on 19 May 2015 - 08:37 AM, said:

I'm sorry if I arrived a bit late for this discussion but I'd like to share my thoughts about quirks and nerfs/buffs.

To me, there should be no quirks available.

We should have multiple manufacturers of weapons, and each manuf would improve the weapon in a way or the other.
Examples:
ER-LL - Manuf1 - Bigger ( +2 slots used) - longer range (x%) - higher heat (x%) - larger duration (x%)
ER-LL - Manuf2 - Standard size - standard range - standard heat - standard duration
ER-LL - Manuf3 - Semi-big (+1 slot) - bit longer range (x-y%) - bit less heat (x-y%) - bit duration (x-y%)
ER-LL - Manuf4 - Standard size - closer range (x%) - less heat (x%) - less duration (x%)
And so on... You get the idea.

Now, some mechs would be compliant with some models more than others.

And now comes the mech design into play.
All mechs have a similar structure and I mean similar as in all have a few slots to use on each part, quantity varies but that's it.
They don't take into account the weight ratio between the mech and weapon (fitting a 35 ton mech with a weapon that weighs 15% of the mechs total weight on just one component should be the limit, but then we have mechs with 2 weapons with 15% of the mechs weight on the same component)
Also, I think the larger the mech (in tonnage) the bigger the weaponry they would be able to use.
(Right now we can fit anything into any mech, we just need to compromise in ammo or armor or speed/type of engine)

So, to me AC20's, Gauss and LRM20, SRM6 should only be used on Heavy to Assault mechs.
The lower the weapon caliber, the lighter the mech could be to use it.

Also, with the weapon manufacturers idea, the same mech could have slots to fit a weapon from Manuf2 but not one from Manuf1 or 3.

If this was in effect, there would be no need for quirks, and probably we wouldn't need ghost heat also.
It would all depend on how this matter would be implemented.

I wish I had time and skill to have a few pictures uploaded with the slots ideas and changes, but you guys will have to use your imagination.

And the worst thing is, PGI's devs are playing on that same level. That's nothing I'd criticize them for, and I hope everyone on that level enjoys the game and have at it, but they should never base balancing decisions on that type of players, only with regards to them.

The nerf to the 4N is absolutely unnecessary, for example. What has to be part of the equation when balancing a mech? Only the weapon stats after quirks? Hell no, geometry, max speed, equipment, twist speed, twist angle, weapon placement. The 4N is an absolute one trick pony. As soon as you get in its flanks, it's done.
This thread is a joke.

[Knyx]

Almond Brown, on 19 May 2015 - 08:30 AM, said:

If you do not comprehend what your wrote, then far be it for me to bring you self-clarity. Your apparent FOG is surely a cozy blanket from under which you see the world differently.

AKA Almond Brown is illiterate and ignorant. Now I know why you can't quote me to support your statement.

Don't make random statement and talk sh!T if you can't back it up mmk.

[FlipOver]

Joseph Mallan, on 19 May 2015 - 08:57 AM, said:

So get rid of the Quirk system we have to implement a more specific Quirk system? And let the Players decide which way THEY like to fight?!

I like it.

I probably missed the post where you pointed out things that could be changed and how or where it says this is just fine and let's move on.
I know there are multiple threads about this issue, and you probably shared your perspective in one of them before but...
If you haven't, I'd like to get your POV on the subject.

Edit - Before this comes across as cocky, this is a genuine request. I value other players opinion and also my opinion can change in light of some ideas or concepts I've not considered before.

Edited by FlipOver, 19 May 2015 - 09:52 AM.

[0bsidion]

This is the TBR-Prime build I've been running since day 1 of the Clan Invasion Pack: http://mwo.smurfy-ne...bbdb0c775c95fe8

As you can see, it's pretty similar to stock with a few minor alterations. And I have to be very careful about how often I fire those lasers. This is before these nerfs. After, I'm probably going to have to scrap it completely, maybe run with gauss or something, because I think my build is going to be pretty much unusable now.

I guess it's a good thing I hardly ever use my Timber, compared to my other mechs.

[Apnu]

Many people forget this: Clan tech has so many perks compared to the IS. 2 slot DHS. 2 slot XL engines. 7 slot ES and FF. Omnipods. Better range, lighter weapons, more ammo per ton. Plus the best clan mechs also happen to be the biggest of their classes (Let's face facts, every TBR is like another assault in the game) so they can boat the most armor for their class. Those good clan mechs also have, through the FASA artists pen, the best body shape for this game.

The SCR and TBR have many inherant advantages that the IS will never have, that adds to their OP and that will never change.

Yes the engines are locked, yes so is the ES and FF and some DHS. Yes PGI has balanced clan weapons with longer laser burns and bursting auto canons and trickle missiles.

but all of that doesn't make up for the huge list of perks the clan mechs get. The last "balancer" for them is cost. They're really expensive!

And the clans also suffer mech selection problems. Their mechs are either amazing (TBR), or suckage (SMN). Few are in-between (HBR). The IS has the clans on mech diversity.

Still despite all that, the SCR and TBR are the top mechs in the game for clans. They are only surpassed by the over-quirked mechs that meta-whores insist on boating 100% of the time. Take the STK-4N or the FS9-S quirks away and those mechs tumble down to the trash heap, but the TBR will still have a prized spot at the top.

Also, thanks to powergaming boaters, the nerf bat is out for the top meta IS mechs. Gamers, around here, can't help but boat the hell out of stuff until PGI notices and beats them back. If you want to complain, complain at them, not PGI, and not us balanced or non-meta players.

The TBR and SCR needed nerfs and they got them. Russ and PGI has been telegraphing this for months now, and on the eve (and day of) the patch, players are suddenly having tantrums over it.

The opportunity to wage a protest campaign on PGI over this is long past. They should have been carpeting Russ' twitter feed in April, not May. PGI had these changes ready to go two weeks ago.

Edited by Apnu, 19 May 2015 - 10:12 AM.

[Knyx]

Apnu, on 19 May 2015 - 10:12 AM, said:

Many people forget this: Clan tech has so many perks compared to the IS. 2 slot DHS. 2 slot XL engines. 7 slot ES and FF. Omnipods. Better range, lighter weapons, more ammo per ton. Plus the best clan mechs also happen to be the biggest of their classes (Let's face facts, every TBR is like another assault in the game) so they can boat the most armor for their class. Those good clan mechs also have, through the FASA artists pen, the best body shape for this game.

The SCR and TBR have many inherant advantages that the IS will never have, that adds to their OP and that will never change.

Yes the engines are locked, yes so is the ES and FF and some DHS. Yes PGI has balanced clan weapons with longer laser burns and bursting auto canons and trickle missiles.

but all of that doesn't make up for the huge list of perks the clan mechs get. The last "balancer" for them is cost. They're really expensive!

And the clans also suffer mech selection problems. Their mechs are either amazing (TBR), or suckage (SMN). Few are in-between (HBR). The IS has the clans on mech diversity.

Still despite all that, the SCR and TBR are the top mechs in the game for clans. They are only surpassed by the over-quirked mechs that meta-whores insist on boating 100% of the time. Take the STK-4N or the FS9-S quirks away and those mechs tumble down to the trash heap, but the TBR will still have a prized spot at the top.

Also, thanks to powergaming boaters, the nerf bat is out for the top meta IS mechs. Gamers, around here, can't help but boat the hell out of stuff until PGI notices and beats them back. If you want to complain, complain at them, not PGI, and not us balanced or non-meta players.

The TBR and SCR needed nerfs and they got them. Russ and PGI has been telegraphing this for months now, and on the eve (and day of) the patch, players are suddenly having tantrums over it.

The opportunity to wage a protest campaign on PGI over this is long past. They should have been carpeting Russ' twitter feed in April, not May. PGI had these changes ready to go two weeks ago.

Wrong. Range is purely subjective and circumstantial. It is completely dependent on the speed of the mech whether or not is actually an advantage or how much of one. News Flash! Maps in MWO are not flat, they are littered with cover... all kinds.... all over the place. In some fantasy world where these IS loyalists RP in on these forums I am sure they are all flat where clan mechs are sniping them from drop zone to drop zone, and where even a heavy with Small pulse has trouble getting in range of a sniper. Fortunately (or unfortunately depending which side of the fence you are on) it is actually quit the opposite in practice. How about the math behind weapons? IS lasers.... superior in burst damage and dps.... IS ballistics (except gauss), superior in burst and DPS... IS LRMs...pretty even but still superior.

Weight and crit slot size are also circumstantial/controversial because anyone could easy take the runt of a litter, show a crappy build, and say "look! see I can't boat this mech out with firepower and DHS like I could on a clan mech". When in reality any non bias person could easily take one of the many overpowered and even any of the competitive mechs (which is still a large list), show off builds where not only does it EASILY fit excellent firepower in ALL hardpoints, but can also fit enough DHS to sustain it.... as well as all the goodies like a fast engine. This is due to mech construction, and the fact IS have unlocked ferro/endo.

It is obvious to anyone who has played a many MMOs in their time, that the forums is where you find the minority... no matter what.. with a few people that minority would consider "black sheep" because they don't hold the minorities' PoV. This minority is always very vocal but the majority of the playerbase couldn't be bothered with reading forums... to them voting on what is overpowered or underpowered is simple... they move on.. whether it is to the overpowered or off the game completely... there is no middle ground. Let CW be an example... which side had a larger population by a GIGANTIC amount?

Edited by Knyx, 19 May 2015 - 10:21 AM.

[Apnu]

Knyx, on 19 May 2015 - 10:19 AM, said:

Wrong. Range is purely subjective and circumstantial. It is completely dependent on the speed of the mech whether or not is actually an advantage or how much of one. News Flash! Maps in MWO are not flat, they are littered with cover... all kinds.... all over the place. In some fantasy world where these IS loyalists RP in on these forums I am sure they are all flat where clan mechs are sniping them from drop zone to drop zone, and where even a heavy with Small pulse has trouble getting in range of a sniper. Fortunately (or unfortunately depending which side of the fence you are on) it is actually quit the opposite in practice. How about the math behind weapons? IS lasers.... superior in burst damage and dps.... IS ballistics (except gauss), superior in burst and DPS... IS LRMs...pretty even but still superior.

Weight and crit slot size are also circumstantial/controversial because anyone could easy take the runt of a litter, show a crappy build, and say "look! see I can't boat this mech out with firepower and DHS like I could on a clan mech". When in reality any non bias person could easily take one of the many overpowered and even any of the competitive mechs (which is still a large list), show off builds where not only does it EASILY fit excellent firepower in ALL hardpoints, but can also fit enough DHS to sustain it.... as well as all the goodies like a fast engine. This is due to mech construction, and the fact IS have unlocked ferro/endo.

It is obvious to anyone who has played a many MMOs in their time, that the forums is where you find the minority... no matter what.. with a few people that minority would consider "black sheep" because they don't hold the minorities' PoV. This minority is always very vocal but the majority of the playerbase couldn't be bothered with reading forums... to them voting on what is overpowered or underpowered is simple... they move on.. whether it is to the overpowered or off the game completely... there is no middle ground. Let CW be an example... which side had a larger population by a GIGANTIC amount?

These walls of text make little sense. You're also taking passive-agressive character pot shots that do nothing to bolster whatever your point is. I had no idea there was terrain in the maps, and that weapons are situational, thanks for illuminating me, please clan-splain some more.

I think you're trying to justify boating?? Not sure and doesn't matter, we have nerfs because of boaters.

Clan players can talk all they want about their martyr complex, but they always ignore this point: we have the quirk system in an attempt to raise IS mechs to clan levels. Any argument that IS is OP or that Clan tech, alone, is on the level of IS, pre-quirk, is laughable. Simply put: IS has quirks because of clan OP. We never had quirks, nor even talked about quirks before the clans hit MWO.

Even FASA creators admit the clans were screwed up and OP. My point is, clans get bennies that are baked in and then clan players whine about any nerfs to bring them down. You want all the awesome tech and all the build flexibilty of the IS. Why don't we just get rid of the IS all together and just call this game Clanwarrior Online OK?

Edited by Apnu, 19 May 2015 - 11:15 AM.

[Bishop Steiner]

Apnu, on 19 May 2015 - 11:14 AM, said:

These walls of text make little sense. You're also taking passive-agressive character pot shots that do nothing to bolster whatever your point is. I had no idea there was terrain in the maps, and that weapons are situational, thanks for illuminating me, please clan-splain some more.

You want all the awesome tech and all the build flexibilty of the IS. Why don't we just get rid of the IS all together and just call this game Clanwarrior Online OK?

only took skimming a few of his posts to see hee is simply trying to be combative. Once you discern that, and see all the aggro and thinly veiled attempts as character attacks, instead of any remotely cogent arguments, it was pretty obvious he is either a troll, or needs his crutch. Thus I tossed him on the ignore pile with the rest of the people who talk a lot and say nothing.

[Artifact]

Bishop Steiner, on 19 May 2015 - 11:19 AM, said:

only took skimming a few of his posts to see hee is simply trying to be combative. Once you discern that, and see all the aggro and thinly veiled attempts as character attacks, instead of any remotely cogent arguments, it was pretty obvious he is either a troll, or needs his crutch. Thus I tossed him on the ignore pile with the rest of the people who talk a lot and say nothing.

And it only takes about 10 seconds to see which IS players support and like each other's posts in an incestuous little circle ****.

But congrats to you guys -- you finally drove the stake into the dark, shriveled heart of the Clans. Now you can all pat each other on the back (and stroke each other's....egos) and come here to the forums to crow about your leet skills when the Clans are all limited to their one starting world.

Whatever. Pathetic.

Edited by Artifact, 19 May 2015 - 11:29 AM.

[Moldur]

InnerSphereNews, on 15 May 2015 - 05:25 PM, said:

The Quirk pass for this patch is geared toward encouraging better loadout diversity for a few energy-focused 'Mechs

https://mwomercs.com/resistancetwo


hahahaha