125 replies to this topic

[Gas Guzzler]

Novawrecker, on 22 May 2015 - 10:39 AM, said:

Equality whinners complained about the lack of an IS Heavy w/ECM ("We gotta have it ONLY because THEY have one" nonsense). IS does not, and will NEVER, need a Hvy w/ECM. They already have a decent sized pool of mechs with ECM. Hell that new Griffon variant w/ECM is one ECM mech too many IMHO.

I'm good with it.

[Burktross]

Bishop Steiner, on 22 May 2015 - 10:43 AM, said:

give Atlas DDC Clan XL and Weapons.

So more easy prey?

Edited by Burktross, 22 May 2015 - 10:46 AM.

[RustyBolts]

Gargoyle or Executioner would be great options for ECM. However, that would mean a 5th variant introduction and I do not recall there being a variant of the Executioner with ECM. NVM The "I" variant had ECM. And I also believe you run into time line issues. But lets face it, time line issues don't mean **** when you are not even remotely sticking to cannon. (PGI)

Edited by RustyBolts, 22 May 2015 - 10:53 AM.

[Pjwned]

Joseph Mallan, on 22 May 2015 - 10:13 AM, said:

An OmniMech more than any BattleMech should be able to throw on an ECM. It is literally part of the description of what make is Omni!

Even if ECM got an appropriate nerf before that happened, it seems like that would make things rather boring since every omnimech ever would equip ECM.

Novawrecker, on 22 May 2015 - 10:39 AM, said:

Equality whinners complained about the lack of an IS Heavy w/ECM ("We gotta have it ONLY because THEY have one" nonsense). IS does not, and will NEVER, need a Hvy w/ECM. They already have a decent sized pool of mechs with ECM. Hell that new Griffon variant w/ECM is one ECM mech too many IMHO.

And Inner Sphere doesn't need a heavy with ECM because...?

Having other mechs with ECM is not a good reason.

Edited by Pjwned, 22 May 2015 - 10:54 AM.

[Bishop Steiner]

RustyBolts, on 22 May 2015 - 10:46 AM, said:

Gargoyle or Executioner would be great options for ECM. However, that would mean a 5th variant introduction and I do not recall there being a variant of the Executioner with ECM. And I also believe you run into time line issues. But lets face it, time line issues don't mean **** when you are not even remotely sticking to cannon. (PGI)

not quite sure about the "not remotely sticking to canon" part. Certainly there have been some exceptions made, but few and minor, as to mech availability. Weapon and Faction Balance being a whole different thing.

[Lugh]

Khobai, on 22 May 2015 - 10:14 AM, said:

No.

But if Clan lasers got a much needed nerf, IS SRMs got a much needed buff, and the Atlas-D-DC got proper armor quirks it might at least be able to put up a good fight in brawling range.



ECM needs a nerf more than ever though. Especially now that half the mechs on each team have ECM.

Jesus on a stick. Clan lasers come pre nerfed. They have Longer Duration (means more face time) And higher Heat (means firing less often)

Stop sticking your fat face out in the open longer than it needs to be and you'll be fine. The only way they could nerf the clan lasers without totally gimping then would be to make them EXACTLY like IS lasers. And then let the crying begin.

[IraqiWalker]

Bishop Steiner, on 22 May 2015 - 10:43 AM, said:

give Atlas DDC Clan XL and Weapons.


that can be taken in so many different, generally EWWWWWWW ways......

That's where I was afraid it might go.

Lugh, on 22 May 2015 - 10:54 AM, said:

Jesus on a stick. Clan lasers come pre nerfed. They have Longer Duration (means more face time) And higher Heat (means firing less often)

Stop sticking your fat face out in the open longer than it needs to be and you'll be fine. The only way they could nerf the clan lasers without totally gimping then would be to make them EXACTLY like IS lasers. And then let the crying begin.

You do know the longer burn duration is there to help with the fact that they have crazy range for their tonnage, and slot cost, right? Also, heat isn't as big of a factor at long range, where you have the luxury of cooling off at your own leisure.

Maybe if you started picking the right lasers for the job you wouldn't over heat as much.

[Bishop Steiner]

IraqiWalker, on 22 May 2015 - 10:56 AM, said:

That's where I was afraid it might go.



You do know the longer burn duration is there to help with the fact that they have crazy range for their tonnage, and slot cost, right? Also, heat isn't as big of a factor at long range, where you have the luxury of cooling off at your own leisure.

Maybe if you started picking the right lasers for the job you wouldn't over heat as much.

clan 350XL, C-Pulse lasers, C.Gauss and C-SRMs.... thinking would a pretty evil Atlas DDC make.

[Wildstreak]

FupDup, on 22 May 2015 - 10:14 AM, said:

Suddenly, every single Omnimech in the game would autoequip ECM. Every. Single. One. Of. Them.

No red doritos would be seen that day.

IS wants it too for every Mech, they are out there in the community.

FupDup, on 22 May 2015 - 10:17 AM, said:

Scatman comes in July.

Which Scatman?

Crothers?


or John?

[RustyBolts]

@ Bishop


Really? Clan Mechs look NOTHING like they are supposed to in performance or modification availability. There are also Double Heat sinks? Ghost Heat? Clan AC? Fed-Com? LRMS? MASC? Rear Mounted Weapons? Leg mounted Weapons? Other Clans? ComStar? I could go on, but I am hungry and going to log off.

Edited by RustyBolts, 22 May 2015 - 11:01 AM.

[Lugh]

Bishop Steiner, on 22 May 2015 - 10:50 AM, said:

not quite sure about the "not remotely sticking to canon" part. Certainly there have been some exceptions made, but few and minor, as to mech availability. Weapon and Faction Balance being a whole different thing.

-Heat sinks aren't true Dubs.
-UACs IS side have 10x the jam chance they should (it should be .028% a 1 1 on two d6 over the course of a full turn which is 60 seconds) in other words IT SHOULD HARDLY EVER HAPPEN.
-The clan mechs we've been given are a PALE fricking shadow of their lore counter parts Exceptions x18
-JJs don't work the way they should
-There is no COLLISION mechanic in place anymore. It has apparently gone away for good as whiny ******* didn't like getting knocked down and not being able to fight back.
-As a result there is no DEATH FROM ABOVE available to mechs with jump jets.
-PPCs are a pale shadow of themselves, they should be knocking out HUDs and ECM both, not just ECM.
-There are no laser based ECM options for either side.

I could go on, this is just off the top of my head in 3 minutes.

[Novawrecker]

Pjwned, on 22 May 2015 - 10:50 AM, said:

And Inner Sphere doesn't need a heavy with ECM because...?

Having other mechs with ECM is not a good reason.

Because (as stated previously) IS already has enough, which makes it plenty reason by itself. IS having another mech w/ECM is no longer a necessity, It's more of a convenience now.

Edited by Novawrecker, 22 May 2015 - 11:06 AM.

[Bishop Steiner]

Lugh, on 22 May 2015 - 11:01 AM, said:

-Heat sinks aren't true Dubs.
-UACs IS side have 10x the jam chance they should (it should be .028% a 1 1 on two d6 over the course of a full turn which is 60 seconds) in other words IT SHOULD HARDLY EVER HAPPEN.
-The clan mechs we've been given are a PALE fricking shadow of their lore counter parts Exceptions x18
-JJs don't work the way they should
-There is no COLLISION mechanic in place anymore. It has apparently gone away for good as whiny ******* didn't like getting knocked down and not being able to fight back.
-As a result there is no DEATH FROM ABOVE available to mechs with jump jets.
-PPCs are a pale shadow of themselves, they should be knocking out HUDs and ECM both, not just ECM.
-There are no laser based ECM options for either side.

I could go on, this is just off the top of my head in 3 minutes.

cool so balancing mechanics are being used to argue mech availability. Kind of what I thought.

Guess what? PvP game. Will never have your "true canon" mechanics. Gonna have to just deal with it.

Novawrecker, on 22 May 2015 - 11:02 AM, said:

Seeing that you missed it the first time: Because IS already has enough.

It's not a necessity any longer. It's more of a convenience now.

IS has an ECM Heavy now. It's called the CTF-0X

[Lugh]

IraqiWalker, on 22 May 2015 - 10:56 AM, said:

That's where I was afraid it might go.



You do know the longer burn duration is there to help with the fact that they have crazy range for their tonnage, and slot cost, right? Also, heat isn't as big of a factor at long range, where you have the luxury of cooling off at your own leisure.

Maybe if you started picking the right lasers for the job you wouldn't over heat as much.

Yes if only everyone always stayed at long range so you didn't have to cycle up firing times to attempt to kill things at close range. Don't worry I'm not meta enough to want to run3,4,5, 6 c-erlarge lasers (in my view it's not versatile enough) And against skilled opponents a complete waste (as they will never ever let you get the full burn on them.

[Novawrecker]

Bishop Steiner, on 22 May 2015 - 11:04 AM, said:

IS has an ECM Heavy now. It's called the CTF-0X

I'm fully aware. My point wasn't that IS didn't have one. It's that Inner Sphere didn't need one. That ECM 'phract is pure convenience (and note: I'm not complaining that we have it. I'm glad that we do, but by no means did IS need this).

Edited by Novawrecker, 22 May 2015 - 11:13 AM.

[Lugh]

Bishop Steiner, on 22 May 2015 - 11:04 AM, said:

cool so balancing mechanics are being used to argue mech availability. Kind of what I thought.

Guess what? PvP game. Will never have your "true canon" mechanics. Gonna have to just deal with it.


IS has an ECM Heavy now. It's called the CTF-0X

And I do. However, if everything was as it should be, people would just have to deal with it as well. Heat Neutral mechs are NOT the Anathema that Russ thinks they are.

Having weapons that don't jam isn't game changing either, as you can run them out of ammo which is the ultimate balancing mechanic as ballistics go.

And come on Bishop I know you miss knocking people over with collisions.

Edited by Lugh, 22 May 2015 - 11:12 AM.

[Aresye]

Khobai, on 22 May 2015 - 10:14 AM, said:

But if Clan lasers got a much needed nerf...

You want to fix Clan lasers? Gotta revert the TBR and SCR nerfs to laser duration before you do. The IS Large Laser already does more damage per 0.1s of duration than the Clan ER Large Laser does, and that was BEFORE the recent nerfs.

[IraqiWalker]

Lugh, on 22 May 2015 - 11:01 AM, said:

-Heat sinks aren't true Dubs.

True, our heatsinks are actually stronger, (about 2.2 - 2.4 on average)

Lugh, on 22 May 2015 - 11:01 AM, said:

-UACs IS side have 10x the jam chance they should (it should be .028% a 1 1 on two d6 over the course of a full turn which is 60 seconds) in other words IT SHOULD HARDLY EVER HAPPEN.

A turn is 10 seconds in TT, not 60.

Lugh, on 22 May 2015 - 11:01 AM, said:

-The clan mechs we've been given are a PALE fricking shadow of their lore counter parts Exceptions x18

Not as much as you think. Omni tech has a lot of restrictions to it. Such as the fact that ALL equipment on the base config are hardlocked, and can not be removed. That includes engines, DHS, JJs ... etc.

In reality, clan mechs are fairly accurate (aside from the "variant" thing).

While our IS mechs are much easier to customize than the clan ones.

Lugh, on 22 May 2015 - 11:01 AM, said:

-JJs don't work the way they should

True. They should have stronger thrust forwards. Since they give you 30 meters per JJ. The problem is that in TT it doesn't say the exact height the mech goes when it jumps forwards.

Lugh, on 22 May 2015 - 11:01 AM, said:

-There is no COLLISION mechanic in place anymore. It has apparently gone away for good as whiny ******* didn't like getting knocked down and not being able to fight back.

Not exactly, it was removed because it was one of the nastiest griefing mechanics in the game to date. As demonstrated by a rather (in)famous youtube video.

Lugh, on 22 May 2015 - 11:01 AM, said:

-As a result there is no DEATH FROM ABOVE available to mechs with jump jets.

I want that in the game as well, but that is based on collision damage, not collision falling.

Lugh, on 22 May 2015 - 11:01 AM, said:

-PPCs are a pale shadow of themselves, they should be knocking out HUDs and ECM both, not just ECM.

Thank god they don't. You think people are complaining about cockpit shake from ballistics? Wait until their HUDs go away.
PPCs used to be super powerful, and got nerfed for it. They were doing too much, too well.


It's a good thing that they don't try to replicate TT in every way possible. Some of it would just make the gaming experience bothersome, rather than fun.

Lugh, on 22 May 2015 - 11:01 AM, said:

-There are no laser based ECM options for either side.

Elaborate please.

[1453 R]

Lugh, on 22 May 2015 - 11:01 AM, said:

...
-There are no laser based ECM options for either side.
...

Did no one else catch 'Laser-based ECM'?

I want to know how LECM works. No, really. Is it, like, a weird small pulse laser that shoots out enemy sensor fixtures the way LAMS shoots down enemy missiles? Or is this like those LBHS they tried in the Night Gyr, where you shoot heat with lasers to turn it into light and dazzle your enemies with your fab heat dissipation capabilities?

Ya know, I bet that's it. Laser-based ECM isn't conventional ECM, it's a system which causes your 'Mech to generate a distracting array of disco ball beams all around itself that gets enemy targeting systems doing the Macarena instead of tracking targets.

I'll buy that. Who else is on board for the "Inferno" LECM system?

[Koniks]

We totally need this. The IS wanted an ECM heavy because the HBR showed how useful that was in CW. Especially at 65 tons where you can take 2-3 of them. There's no game balance issue with not having a Clan ECM assault because the DDC is barely used in public queue let alone CW. Even then, at most you're going to see 12 total, not 36. Unless a team is crazy enough to bring 24 Locusts.

Alternatively, Clans are getting MASC mechs. Where are the IS mechs with MASC or triple strength myomer?

Edited by Mizeur, 22 May 2015 - 12:02 PM.