387 replies to this topic

[masCh]

Mcgral18, on 29 May 2015 - 12:03 PM, said:

1000 missiles, 1000 damage.
How many of those were completely useless?

Shooting at unlocked targets, not group firing the missiles, only 2 weapon groups.

Shooting at the wrong components to pad damage.

I don't see much impressive gameplay there; just inefficient use of weapons.

It was not about my skill as a player, it was about "what if this slot is better emtpy because I brought LRMs".. would the team have fared better?

[MechWarrior3671771]

"I think most players will hold locks when it makes sense too, at least they do in the games I'm in, and that's without being asked. So either the missile boat in your example is insulting our intelligence or they are needlessly stating the obvious."

Shrug. My experience has been the opposite - most players don't even bother locking. As a Light pilot, I get to spectate quite a lot and have been amazed at the number of pilots who won't lock even to see what component to throw their pinpoint alpha at.

So for me, "hold locks pls" comes across as a good reminder in general to tap that R key.

[Cion]

I don't usually lurm, but when I do, I get my own locks....


True Story

Edit: on the phone so I can't do the meme, you'll just have to imagine it

Edited by Cion, 29 May 2015 - 12:12 PM.

[Bishop Steiner]

masCh, on 29 May 2015 - 12:06 PM, said:

It was not about my skill as a player, it was about "what if this slot is better emtpy because I brought LRMs".. would the team have fared better?

this kinda nails it.....is that there are enough players with irrational hostility toward lrms, that they would answer yes. I have actually seen people TK other players for bringing a LRM mech.

[Mcgral18]

masCh, on 29 May 2015 - 12:06 PM, said:

It was not about my skill as a player, it was about "what if this slot is better emtpy because I brought LRMs".. would the team have fared better?

Team could have fared better with a direct fire mech, yes. 4 MPLs and 30 tubes isn't what I call a boat.

You had weapons for mechs that closed within 200M, so you weren't Rekt.

[masCh]

Mcgral18, on 29 May 2015 - 12:13 PM, said:

Team could have fared better with a direct fire mech, yes. 4 MPLs and 30 tubes isn't what I call a boat.

You had weapons for mechs that closed within 200M, so you weren't Rekt.

What? Since when has this been a topic about boats?

It is a topic about LRMs.

Benefitted better what it means? The team can won? But the team did won no?

[Nightmare1]

@OP: Here's why:

1) LRMs are viewed as a low-skill weapon system and considered a cheap way to fight. There's no honor in using them.
2) People don't like LRM boats stealing their kills.
3) People are generally stupid.

Personally speaking, I really, really, really, really, really hate LRMs. That being said, I will hold locks for LRM boats because I am a team player. Shoot, I've even run them time-to-time during periods of bad lag, and have even produced a tutorial video on how to be an effective LRM boater. My hate for them is due to the ridiculous ease with which I can murder people with LRMs (or be murdered) when you face an effective LRM team (or you're stuck with Pugs that get scared). The hate you are feeling is simply because people are small minded, childish, and greedy to the point where they are willing to jeopardize the match with their unwillingness to be cooperative.

At the end of the day, what matters is how helpful you were to your team. If you pulled your weight, then great! I personally may still hate the fact that you're using LRMs, but I will grudgingly recognize the contribution and will refrain from flaming you. The other pilots just need to learn to suck it up and keep their childish tantrums to themselves.

[Mcgral18]

masCh, on 29 May 2015 - 12:17 PM, said:

What? Since when has this been a topic about boats?

It is a topic about LRMs.

Benefitted better what it means? The team can won? But the team did won no?

Laser kill faster, meaning the other team damages you less, meaning it doesn't come down to 2 mechs.

You deal less damage, but kills are precise, and you don't vomit 400 damage on a single mech without even killing it.

[Bishop Steiner]

Mcgral18, on 29 May 2015 - 12:23 PM, said:

Laser kill faster, meaning the other team damages you less, meaning it doesn't come down to 2 mechs.

You deal less damage, but kills are precise, and you don't vomit 400 damage on a single mech without even killing it.

you also can't lend damage to a teammate out of LoS with Lasers, like getting that Firestarter that is coursing your friendly DWF, etc.

Properly used, there are pros and cons for both approaches.

[masCh]

Bishop Steiner, on 29 May 2015 - 12:25 PM, said:

you also can't lend damage to a teammate out of LoS with Lasers, like getting that Firestarter that is coursing your friendly DWF, etc.

Properly used, there are pros and cons for both approaches.

I wanted to reply with the same content, yes I agree. LRMs are called support fire. They're not weapons you want to use to get kills for yourself, but to help other team mates. In fact even in the video posted in the first page, the LRMs broke off the armours from far distances and it was the lasers that finished the enemy off.

[TheStrider]

I haven't read the whole thread. Nor will I likely revisit it. I'm just going to say my peace.


I don't understand the hostility.

I have an LRM boat. I will call myself out at the start of a match, usually with a bit of humor which I find helps... I am relaying information to the team which will assist us in winning. Occasionally I'll get a response from a light carrying Narc, and both of us will now performing better because of it.

Why do people assume I won't try to get my own locks? I do.

Why do people assume I won't keep up with the 'mob'? I do.

Finally, why do people assume I won't dish out my weight class worth of damage in a match? I do, and then some.

[rolly]

This is sad to see when inoffensive requests for teamwork are met so harshly just because they aren't fighting or equipping themselves with the load-out you want or deem effective. What's more telling the reasons presented are reasoning backed up by generalizations. What next? Heaven forbid scout volunteer to scout or assaults volunteer to lead a charge.

Edited by rolly, 29 May 2015 - 12:40 PM.

[DONTOR]

GET UR OWN LOCKS!!!!

Sorry I had too...

[mogs01gt]

LoLz

It works better to say "hit the R key noobs!"

[nehebkau]

Aloha, on 29 May 2015 - 10:54 AM, said:

Last night in a PUG drop, one LRM player on my team types a simple request: "Hold Locks Please". It's a simple enough request, and not that uncommon. However, another player types "How about getting your own locks?", which leads to the LRM player to respond if the second player would like him to leave the match. The second player responds "Yes, please", and the LRM player complied. We already have one D/C, so now we're down 2 players.

Now I don't play LRMs very often, but I do it once in a while just to mix things up. I no longer remind the team to hold locks precisely due to that attitude towards LRM players. I admit I have seen some bad LRM players who just sit way back waiting for his teams to lock targets for them, but I've also seen good LRM players who are very effective in providing fire support and keeping the enemy pinned with LRMs. I feel that this hostility towards LRM players is unjustified and foolish. I would rather have a bad LRM player than playing the match short one player. At the very least he'll serve as canon fodder and absorb some damage, and maybe even strip off a few points of armor off an enemy.

Honestly, if you dislike LRM as a weapon system, then don't use it, but to tell your own team mate to leave the match is a disservice to your own team.

Personally, I bristle when someone types "Hold locks please LRMs here". When I translate that to how it affects my game it means "Please get your mech shot up for me by staying in the enemies line of fire so I can fire from behind you instead of ducking back into cover" or to "Please expect my FF lrm fire as you close circle strafe that target in your light mech"

So, when someone says "Hold locks please" I am likely to respond with "get your own" because for every excellent LRM pilot I have had a match with I've had matches with 199 bad ones. (and by the way the excellent LRM pilots would get their own locks)

Maybe I shouldn't be so jaded -- but it can get real hard not to. I wouldn't have asked the player to leave but I wouldn't have gone out of my way to get shot up so their weapon systems get used to its potential

Edited by nehebkau, 29 May 2015 - 12:47 PM.

[Lugh]

Mcgral18, on 29 May 2015 - 10:58 AM, said:

Having a LRM centric build is already being down a useful player.

They are terribly inefficient weapons that are so easy to completely neuter.


They often can't keep up with the deathball, and I'm not about to kill myself trying to support him, while he can't even damage the enemy.
Down a player, without saying a single thing.


I won't insult them when asking for locks; I'll just ignore them. I lock targets when I shoot them. I will not not get locks out of spite, but I won't stop torso twisting so he can pad his stats with useless damage.

They are generally a waste of a player slot.

incorrect. properly utilized and supported LRMs are still devastating. Most of you mouth breathers can't figure out it requires teamwork to do it and this is why you fail.

[Spleenslitta]

I'll say this. The reason i don't hold locks for LRM boats is not because i dislike them.
It's just that---

- I use lights in 19 out of 20 matches. I don't have the armor to stay in contact with the enemy for long.
I prefer to shoot but don't get shot.

- Once i requested an LRM strike on an enemy Stalker.
Held the lock steady for about 1/2 minute without attracting the targets attention while giving 2 requests for the LRM barrage on the target.
Then a salvo finally arrived....and exploded just shy of the target. I waited a bit more but no further LRMs.
I had to go over there and fight that Stalker myself. LRM boats don't make reliable allies for me.

[Tatula]

However some people may dislike LRMs, there are a few mechs that are just made for it. The Catapult A1, Awesome 8R, Battlemaster 1S, Stalker 5M, Mad Dog and Timberwolves, to name a few. If everyone only run meta builds on Tier 1 mechs, the game would be boring. I would much rather have a LRM-centric mech on my team than a Jenner with 6 flamers (you know who you are).

[MechWarrior3671771]

"Why do people assume I won't try to get my own locks? Why do people assume I won't keep up with the 'mob'? ...why do people assume I won't dish out my weight class worth of damage in a match?"

Because, as someone alluded to upthread, those are not their true complaints, they are just hiding behind them. Its why they have to make up stuff about what they assume you are doing. I think the real reasons are:

1) they don't like being damaged by indirect fire
2) they don't like having to find cover
3) they don't want to use space for AMS

So they try to shame LRM pilots so there are fewer of them on the field.

[Gralzeim]

Should always lock targets anyway, whenever possible, because a locked target is useful information for you and your team. Target loadout, damage status, that sort of thing. Even if you're not currently shooting at something, you should still lock it if it's in your line of sight.

Clans and IS get free data sharing, should take advantage of it. It's just as useful as relaying to your team that a pass has a pair of heavies attempting a flanking maneuver.

Edit: I'm not saying you should go out of your way to stay out in the open and get shot at by five different CERML sources, just that if you have line of sight to something and you don't currently have a target locked, lock something. Any lock is better than having no lock, if you currently have LoS. Even if that lock is only held for long enough to get a brief glimpse of the target's loadout, that is still useful.

Edited by Gralzeim, 29 May 2015 - 12:49 PM.