203 replies to this topic

[Theodore42]

Animus41, on 07 June 2015 - 11:24 AM, said:

Rant away my friend.

I have always enjoyed American history.

Case in point, here we are, already judging entire populations, based only on the immoral actions of a select few elite propagandizing the masses.

[AnimosityMonk]

Theodore42, on 07 June 2015 - 11:22 AM, said:

Read Rise and Fall of the Third Reich. I did in highschool. That definition of tyranny has nothing to do with how it happens or what it looks like to the people living it.

Im sorry but THAT is the definition of tyranny. The one and only definition of tyranny. Do you have some "special" dictionary that says otherwise?

Here is the FULL definition, with link, and it does not support your statements.

tyranny
noun tyr·an·ny \ˈtir-ə-nē\

: cruel and unfair treatment by people with power over others
: a government in which all power belongs to one person : the rule or authority of a tyrant

plural tyr·an·nies

1
: oppressive power <every form of tyranny over the mind of man — Thomas Jefferson>; especially : oppressive power exerted by government <the tyranny of a police state>

2
a : a government in which absolute power is vested in a single ruler; especially : one characteristic of an ancient Greek city-state
b : the office, authority, and administration of a tyrant

3
: a rigorous condition imposed by some outside agency or force <living under the tyranny of the clock — Dixon Wecter>

4
: an oppressive, harsh, or unjust act : a tyrannical act <workers who had suffered tyrannies>


: cruel and unfair treatment by people with power over others
: a government in which all power belongs to one person : the rule or authority of a tyrant

http://www.merriam-w...tionary/tyranny

Edited by Animus41, 07 June 2015 - 11:34 AM.

[AnimosityMonk]

Theodore42, on 07 June 2015 - 11:30 AM, said:

Case in point, here we are, already judging entire populations, based only on the immoral actions of a select few elite propagandizing the masses.

Seriously dude, calm down. Think of your blood pressure. I wish my {Godwin's Law} grand-ma-ma was here to give me a phrase that would be appropriate.
Does anyone have an Irish-{Godwin's Law} grams would could help us out here?

[Moomtazz]

utontihso, on 07 June 2015 - 11:24 AM, said:

Actually we require people to be respectful of other players, to the point we have often stopped winning a match to allow a loosing team to get their respective points in events. So Animus41 that is a valid comment many times, it however doesn't apply to the members of the 66AH in general.

People judging people by the actions of others are short changing themselves IMHO. I have seen homeless poor people be generous, and ubber rich be ass hats full of selfish greed and uncaring.

People in general need to be more respectful.

The issue at hand however is PGI moved this into a PUBLIC domain and is accountable to remove / deal with this issue. They are the ones that started this ..... they now need to step in and stop this, this needs to be handled professionally as a business. This should not be treated like someone's little kingdom to do anything without any expectation of blow back.

Since this goes 100 % into the public domain it now is no longer just a PGI issue its public with all the potential for blow back.

The PUBLIC harassment needs to stop PERIOD.

Utontihso

66AH

Are you crazy?

[utontihso]

Animus41,

Its not a rant ...... since they MODERATE this forum they can not claim ignorance of the issue raised and thus can not deny accountability.

Utontihso

66AH

[Theodore42]

Firstly, "The Rise and Fall of the Third Reich" By William Shirer is the definitive history of WWII. It is probably the best single source for understanding Tyranny.

I don't disagree with the definition of tyranny. I'm trying to tell you what tyranny looks like and how it happens. There are social human traits that lead to the rise of tyranny, as you have defined it. Divide and conquer is ONE method used to divide groups of people and have them hate each other and help consolidate power. The "N" party in Germany at the time was not popular, and even when "H" was elected, he wasn't a very popular person. Most Germans considered them a joke. Yet when you read history you will understand how "H" consolidated his power and what techniques he used.

I'm basically saying that the human instinct to think in this way (that is causing discrimination and harassment to the OP), ever since Babylon, has been the main method for attaining power over humanity. So DON'T BE A TOOL is what I'm saying.

Everybody knows what tyranny is. Nobody knows where it comes from. And that is what I'm trying to tell EVERYONE.

[AnimosityMonk]

utontihso, on 07 June 2015 - 11:24 AM, said:

Actually we require people to be respectful of other players, to the point we have often stopped winning a match to allow a loosing team to get their respective points in events. So Animus41 that is a valid comment many times, it however doesn't apply to the members of the 66AH in general.

People judging people by the actions of others are short changing themselves IMHO. I have seen homeless poor people be generous, and ubber rich be ass hats full of selfish greed and uncaring.

People in general need to be more respectful.

The issue at hand however is PGI moved this into a PUBLIC domain and is accountable to remove / deal with this issue. They are the ones that started this ..... they now need to step in and stop this, this needs to be handled professionally as a business. This should not be treated like someone's little kingdom to do anything without any expectation of blow back.

Since this goes 100 % into the public domain it now is no longer just a PGI issue its public with all the potential for blow back.

The PUBLIC harassment needs to stop PERIOD.

Utontihso

66AH

I wasn't attacking your group. As a matter of fact I have never heard of 66AH. I was just pointing out why some people make such attacks in the first place.

As for PGI doing something about it well good luck with that. Maybe when they are done helping you they can get to work on ending world hunger, disarming all nuclear weapons, putting an end to racism and get the cat from across the street to stop crapping in my flower beds.

[Theodore42]

utontihso, on 07 June 2015 - 11:47 AM, said:

Animus41,

Its not a rant ...... since they MODERATE this forum they can not claim ignorance of the issue raised and thus can not deny accountability.

Utontihso

66AH

What would you like PGI to do to resolve this?

[Mudhutwarrior]

I think like many your team had a thin blue line in place. Its not very hard to spot the cheater on the opposite team and much easier to spot one on your own team. As the public becomes more and more aware how corruption is covered up in groups like the police they more than expect the same from a group such as yours. Many of you benefited from that poisonous fruit and many more came here to defend.

I for one hope you enjoy your shame. If I was made aware top level guys in my group did such a thing I would clear out an disassociate myself from it.

Sorry, Keep the flag expect the guff.

[Moomtazz]

Theodore42, on 07 June 2015 - 11:52 AM, said:

What would you like PGI to do to resolve this?

Raparations!

[Mudhutwarrior]

utontihso, on 07 June 2015 - 11:47 AM, said:

Animus41,

Its not a rant ...... since they MODERATE this forum they can not claim ignorance of the issue raised and thus can not deny accountability.

Utontihso

66AH

Accountability ... LOL

[Alan Davion]

utontihso, on 07 June 2015 - 11:24 AM, said:

Actually we require people to be respectful of other players, to the point we have often stopped winning a match to allow a loosing team to get their respective points in events. So Animus41 that is a valid comment many times, it however doesn't apply to the members of the 66AH in general.

People judging people by the actions of others are short changing themselves IMHO. I have seen homeless poor people be generous, and ubber rich be ass hats full of selfish greed and uncaring.

People in general need to be more respectful.

I really hate to say this, because I agree with you on this point.

This is the internet, respect goes out the window due to 'internet anonymity', and that is likely why PGI publicly named those cheaters, so that people can be wary of people with those names in other games.

And unfortunately, be wary of the people those players were associated with.

utontihso, on 07 June 2015 - 11:24 AM, said:

The issue at hand however is PGI moved this into a PUBLIC domain and is accountable to remove / deal with this issue. They are the ones that started this ..... they now need to step in and stop this, this needs to be handled professionally as a business. This should not be treated like someone's little kingdom to do anything without any expectation of blow back.

Since this goes 100 % into the public domain it now is no longer just a PGI issue its public with all the potential for blow back.

The PUBLIC harassment needs to stop PERIOD.

Utontihso

66AH

I refer to my earlier point. PGI are not likely to retract their statement with the names of the banned cheaters. For one, the backlash from the forums would be incredible, and two, if those people had not cheated to begin with, this would not be an issue at all.

They did. It is. And there is nothing anyone can do about it now.

Because of the rampant hackusations in this game, both in game and on the forums, this is unfortunately the stance PGI is forced to take.

If people didn't constantly shout hack or OP or any of the other BS they constantly spout, this wouldn't be a problem, but again, this is the internet, and people don't tend to think about the consequences.

All they care about is that almighty K/D-R.

Almost no body cares about fun anymore it seems.

[AnimosityMonk]

Theodore42, on 07 June 2015 - 11:48 AM, said:

Firstly, "The Rise and Fall of the Third Reich" By William Shirer is the definitive history of WWII. It is probably the best single source for understanding Tyranny.

I don't disagree with the definition of tyranny. I'm trying to tell you what tyranny looks like and how it happens. There are social human traits that lead to the rise of tyranny, as you have defined it. Divide and conquer is ONE method used to divide groups of people and have them hate each other and help consolidate power. The "N" party in Germany at the time was not popular, and even when "H" was elected, he wasn't a very popular person. Most Germans considered them a joke. Yet when you read history you will understand how "H" consolidated his power and what techniques he used.

I'm basically saying that the human instinct to think in this way (that is causing discrimination and harassment to the OP), ever since Babylon, has been the main method for attaining power over humanity. So DON'T BE A TOOL is what I'm saying.

Everybody knows what tyranny is. Nobody knows where it comes from. And that is what I'm trying to tell EVERYONE.

Um, yeah, the DEFINITIVE history of WWII is History of the Second World War by Sir B.H. Liddell Hart. Shirer's book may only be the definitive work on the Rise and Fall of the Third Reich. In your opinion of course.

Edited by Animus41, 07 June 2015 - 12:12 PM.

[utontihso]

Theodore42

PGI has chosen to handle this unprofessionally and very PUBLIC. They as well as all companies
know you cant just cause public issues without expecting some push back. They need to remove all Public discussions and naming of this, since it causes collateral effects and they know it now.

When it moved from PGI to open twitter etc discussions its now a VERY PUBLIC domain with all the up sides to PGI as well as the INDIVIDUALS. It also opens up all the negatives " reputation, accountability, legal etc".

Actions have reactions / consequences

Supporting Harassment is an easy one to identify / prove, if they don't stop it.

Utontihso

66AH

[Saint Scarlett Johan]

utontihso, on 07 June 2015 - 11:47 AM, said:

Animus41,

Its not a rant ...... since they MODERATE this forum they can not claim ignorance of the issue raised and thus can not deny accountability.

Utontihso

66AH

It doesn't work that way. ToS forbids cheating. Your leadership cheated. Your leadership was held accountable for their actions by PGI and as such failed you and the rest of your unit.

I doubt you were here or on reddit for the ModPud incident, but her own team suspected her of cheating, gathered the evidence, and turned her in. She was a very high profile player and the reason few people harass the 228th is because they held their own accountable. They were still left stinging from the embarrassment she brought, but they did the right thing by cleaning their own ranks by disassociating themselves from cheating and having no place for it.

Your unit did not do that. And now your unit is suffering the blowback from having to be held accountable by PGI.

Tl;dr:

228 cleaned out the cheaters themselves and turned them over to PGI. 228th suffered no blowback due to their actions.
66AH did not clean out their ranks of cheaters and PGI stepped in to do so. 66AH is suffering blowback due to their inactions.

[Davegt27]

I only recognized one name on the banned player list, ironically that player caused me out after
One match, i did not know or care if they belonged to any particular unit.

We pugs take a lot of abuse from people from units, so much so a lot of us
Won't join a big unit

Still we should all man up and try to put an end to all abuse
The way to do that is as soon as someone posts or says something
Speak up and say PGI delt with the cheaters its over let's move on

[Mudhutwarrior]

This dude just proves some have no shame.

[utontihso]

Alan,

I cannot get into specifics due to forum rules, I however have done extensive research about the events up to this.
I chose to disagree based on facts, not on emotion.

if you want to take it off line:
mwo2013@comcast.net

Utontihso

66AH

[Mudhutwarrior]

utontihso, on 07 June 2015 - 12:14 PM, said:

Alan,

I cannot get into specifics due to forum rules, I however have done extensive research about the events up to this.
I chose to disagree based on facts, not on emotion.

if you want to take it off line:
mwo2013@comcast.net

Utontihso

66AH

Sunlight is the best disinfectant. Wanting to drag things in the shadows leaves me with doubt about your intentions here.

[utontihso]

Lord Scarlett,

I can not get into the aspects of PGI and them identifying cheating by their rules or I will be banned myself. This is not my choice its PGI's..... I must only focus on the public harassment they "PGI" has directly caused as a result of how this has been handled.

I can say this as far as 66AH goes. We actively look to stop cheating and HAVE done so in the past and removed members for doing so.

This is the internet, people can do as they wish and we all then get to react after its said and done.

You never know what a persons moral character is till to walk along side them for a while, and it shows best in the toughest times.

If you have noticed I am trying to be mature and ignore trolls and just stay on point.

Utontihso

66AH