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I Don't Get Why People Don't Like The Summoner


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#81 Burktross

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Posted 14 June 2015 - 02:11 PM

View Postlordtzar, on 14 June 2015 - 02:00 PM, said:


My question is, why don't you put on a ******* shirt. Like god damn dude.

edit

I sent the link to my friends so that they too can experience the torture I did.

If you're in Hell you might as well take your friends with you, huh?

Edited by Burktross, 14 June 2015 - 02:11 PM.


#82 Bloodweaver

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Posted 14 June 2015 - 02:15 PM

View Postlordtzar, on 14 June 2015 - 02:00 PM, said:


My question is, why don't you put on a ******* shirt. Like god damn dude.

What difference would a shirt make? lol

#83 Bishop Steiner

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Posted 14 June 2015 - 02:34 PM

View PostKhobai, on 14 June 2015 - 01:24 PM, said:

They need to allow jumpjets to be removed on non-S omnipods. But keep them locked on S-omnipods.

The Summoner would be able to remove its jumpjets then. That would fix a lot of problems.

No, it really wouldn't.

Remove the JJs, and all you do is remove the Summoner's identity while being a worse Hellbringer because of hardpoints and lack of ECM, and still inferior to the Timberwolf. You're just groundbound and mediocre.

Why people cling to this demonstrably nonsensical position is beyond me.

#84 Bishop Steiner

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Posted 14 June 2015 - 02:42 PM

View PostLordBraxton, on 14 June 2015 - 09:58 AM, said:

Endo on a summoner... so I could roll UAC10 + ERPPC +LRM15 + an actual viable amount of ammo.... dream mech!

You and me both. I haven't switched to UAC10 yet because with ammo limits I find the LB-X works a bit better for me, but some general variant of that is exactly what I want.

I would love to have my AC10/erppc/ersl/SSRM6 have the tonnage for ammo and armor at sustainable levels. Wheter it was with a UAC or LB-X.

Catering simply to Missile Vomit or Laser Vomit, and at the expense of what the Summoner does (jumps) is not "fixing" it.

View PostCathy, on 14 June 2015 - 11:55 AM, said:

Because its not a Timberwolf, for the most part

If that were the case, I'd actually use my TBRs. I don't. I want the Summoner to actually be a Summoner, as adjusted for the doubled armor/quirks world of MWO.

#85 Khobai

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Posted 14 June 2015 - 02:46 PM

Quote

Remove the JJs, and all you do is remove the Summoner's identity while being a worse Hellbringer because of hardpoints and lack of ECM, and still inferior to the Timberwolf. You're just groundbound and mediocre.


um you can add them back on if you want them

but having the option to be able to remove them is certainly an improvement

#86 Alistair Winter

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Posted 14 June 2015 - 02:49 PM

View PostBurktross, on 14 June 2015 - 01:01 PM, said:

HATE ALISTAIR NOT ME

For a minute I hoped it was photoshopped. But the nipple casts a shadow!

The nipple casts a shadow!! :(

#87 Burktross

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Posted 14 June 2015 - 03:03 PM

View PostAlistair Winter, on 14 June 2015 - 02:49 PM, said:

For a minute I hoped it was photoshopped. But the nipple casts a shadow!

The nipple casts a shadow!! :(

Never underestimate the horror this world beholds.

#88 bad arcade kitty

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Posted 14 June 2015 - 03:07 PM

implying shadows can't be photoshopped

#89 Lightfoot

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Posted 14 June 2015 - 03:12 PM

Combination of low payload and build restricting hardpoints. Plus MWO's hover-jets are useless except for pop-tarting over a ridge. Technically, the canon use of jump-jets is an agile escape or attack and MWO's jjets are too weak to even bother with in this regard, but the Summoner wastes 5 tons on them.

Battle Tech jump jets work about like the ones in this clip from Ghost Bear's Legacy....



Jump Jets have to be at least this good to be worth 20% of the mech's payload.

I can make the Thor work though, but it is gimped.

#90 Bishop Steiner

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Posted 14 June 2015 - 03:13 PM

View PostKhobai, on 14 June 2015 - 02:46 PM, said:


um you can add them back on if you want them

but having the option to be able to remove them is certainly an improvement

not when 5 tons lighter and 5 tons heavier you have vastly superior choices, that can do exactly what a jumples Summoner can. And *gasp* if you actually want to use that chassis to, IDK.... JUMP? right back where you started.

It solves..nothing.

#91 bobobobobiy

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Posted 14 June 2015 - 03:27 PM

View PostBishop Steiner, on 14 June 2015 - 03:13 PM, said:

not when 5 tons lighter and 5 tons heavier you have vastly superior choices, that can do exactly what a jumples Summoner can. And *gasp* if you actually want to use that chassis to, IDK.... JUMP? right back where you started.

It solves..nothing.

Without jj, the build is actually decent for dual gauss, which no other clan heavy and lower and do effectively. Nipple gauss is best gauss.

But other than that, there's no other point to the summoner. I'd rather run a stormcrow, hellbringer, or timberwolf.

EDIT: I hope Kuronyra is joking...

Edited by bobobobobiy, 14 June 2015 - 03:28 PM.


#92 Wintersdark

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Posted 14 June 2015 - 04:27 PM

View PostBishop Steiner, on 14 June 2015 - 02:34 PM, said:

No, it really wouldn't.

Remove the JJs, and all you do is remove the Summoner's identity while being a worse Hellbringer because of hardpoints and lack of ECM, and still inferior to the Timberwolf. You're just groundbound and mediocre.

Why people cling to this demonstrably nonsensical position is beyond me.
Exactly. Potential solutions are quite simple. Ridiculously quirk stock weapon options that thankfully cannot be boated, improve JJ performance significantly, and/or unlock ES.

Unlocking JJ just removes what the Summoner is all about but doesn't help the summoner do what its supposed to do.

View Postbobobobobiy, on 14 June 2015 - 03:27 PM, said:

Without jj, the build is actually decent for dual gauss, which no other clan heavy and lower and do effectively. Nipple gauss is best gauss.
Even without JJ's the Summoner has nowhere near enough tonnage for Dual gauss.

#93 Mcgral18

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Posted 14 June 2015 - 04:38 PM

View PostWintersdark, on 14 June 2015 - 04:27 PM, said:

Exactly. Potential solutions are quite simple. Ridiculously quirk stock weapon options that thankfully cannot be boated, improve JJ performance significantly, and/or unlock ES.

Unlocking JJ just removes what the Summoner is all about but doesn't help the summoner do what its supposed to do.

Even without JJ's the Summoner has nowhere near enough tonnage for Dual gauss.


8/8 quirks for the Prime are also good candidates to complete those 40% RoF quirks.


3 hardpoints, 1 of each, is literally impossible to boat.

#94 Bishop Steiner

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Posted 14 June 2015 - 04:45 PM

View PostWintersdark, on 14 June 2015 - 04:27 PM, said:

Exactly. Potential solutions are quite simple. Ridiculously quirk stock weapon options that thankfully cannot be boated, improve JJ performance significantly, and/or unlock ES.

Unlocking JJ just removes what the Summoner is all about but doesn't help the summoner do what its supposed to do.

Even without JJ's the Summoner has nowhere near enough tonnage for Dual gauss.

3.5 tons of ammo not enough for ya? (if one keep stock armor)

#95 Templar Dane

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Posted 14 June 2015 - 04:47 PM

View PostBurktross, on 14 June 2015 - 02:11 PM, said:

If you're in Hell you might as well take your friends with you, huh?


It's more revenge for links they've sent me.

#96 Bishop Steiner

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Posted 14 June 2015 - 04:47 PM

View PostMcgral18, on 14 June 2015 - 04:38 PM, said:


8/8 quirks for the Prime are also good candidates to complete those 40% RoF quirks.


3 hardpoints, 1 of each, is literally impossible to boat.

Ridiculous quirks and endo, it still wouldn't replace TBR and HBR, because of hardpoints, ecm, etc, but it woul dhave it's own anti-meta niche finally, one similar to what the old brawling VTRs did before poptarts ruined it for everyone.

#97 Burktross

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Posted 14 June 2015 - 04:50 PM

View Postlordtzar, on 14 June 2015 - 04:47 PM, said:


It's more revenge for links they've sent me.

Hmmm....
Good idea.

#98 Wintersdark

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Posted 14 June 2015 - 04:55 PM

View PostBishop Steiner, on 14 June 2015 - 04:45 PM, said:

3.5 tons of ammo not enough for ya? (if one keep stock armor)
For a lightly armoured mech only sporting 2 gauss rifles? No. I'm a huge proponent of limited ammo supplies and accuracy, but each ton of ammo is at best 150 damage. 3.5t is 525 damage if you never miss... 17.5 shots. In this double armor world, that isn't enough.

Even my K2 back in the day ran a couple mediums AND had more ammo.

View PostBishop Steiner, on 14 June 2015 - 04:47 PM, said:

Ridiculous quirks and endo, it still wouldn't replace TBR and HBR, because of hardpoints, ecm, etc, but it woul dhave it's own anti-meta niche finally, one similar to what the old brawling VTRs did before poptarts ruined it for everyone.
Yup. I'm not looking for the Summoner to be a godmech, but I'd like it to not feel gimped and have a unique role. Actually strong jump jets (not "good for a 70t heavy") would do that. But we still don't have JJ quirks.

#99 Bishop Steiner

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Posted 14 June 2015 - 04:57 PM

View PostWintersdark, on 14 June 2015 - 04:55 PM, said:

Yup. I'm not looking for the Summoner to be a godmech, but I'd like it to not feel gimped and have a unique role. Actually strong jump jets (not "good for a 70t heavy") would do that. But we still don't have JJ quirks.

Exactly, and yet what so many people, especially the "gosh just strip the JJs" crowd don't seem capable of understanding.

Everything should just be stripped to a generic metastick and life is good.


SMH

#100 bobobobobiy

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Posted 14 June 2015 - 05:28 PM

Without arm armor and leg armor reduced to 41 each, the summoner gets 50 rounds of gauss ammo, which my jager gets as well. Coupled with the reduced XL vulnerability and way higher speed than the jager, it's not that bad of a mech.

And you're gonna be peeking, so leg armor shouldn't matter too much





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