74 replies to this topic

[Joseph Mallan]

El Bandito, on 23 June 2015 - 03:33 AM, said:

Oh you are right.

Not that Canyon isn't a good Missile map mind you.

[Weeny Machine]

Bishop Steiner, on 22 June 2015 - 08:22 PM, said:

Remove yourself from the Underhive, and you will find the prevalence of LRMs to evaporate like a morning dew under the summer sun.

Bishop, a well-designed game mechanic (in this case a weapon system) should be balanced more or less at skill ranges (imagine new players in an environment with hardly any ECM and no radar dep) and which equipment people bring to the table.
In the absence of ECM you can often hardly step out of cover before you have incomming missiles. Actually missiles are a first-rate supression weapon - were it not for the ECM inflation.

Also, the "underhive" comment is misplaced. As said above it is not just about skill but also equipment and map (LRM Valley is such a fun map when you have no ECM and the enemy is boating LRMs like mad)

However, the easiest to handle weapon which is as fool-prove as it can get is the laser (hitscan, no ammo, no hard counter etc). And laser boating is quite dominant in the higher ELO regions

Edited by Bush Hopper, 23 June 2015 - 03:59 AM.

[Weeny Machine]

Soy, on 23 June 2015 - 03:07 AM, said:

i just hate boobs that chainfire lrm5s 80meters from spawn point, ugh, uninstall

I will never hate boobs. Ok, when they are able to spam missiles it is hard to play with them, though. Armed boobs...the horror actually

[El Bandito]

Joseph Mallan, on 23 June 2015 - 03:35 AM, said:

Not that Canyon isn't a good Missile map mind you.

I do hope that you do not mean to to start an e-peen war here. Cause I have better score with LRM boat in Canyon, than that one. Once in a while people do get lucky. And they keep the screenshots.

Bush Hopper, on 23 June 2015 - 03:51 AM, said:

Bishop, a well-designed game mechanic (in this case a weapon system) should be balanced more or less at skill ranges (imagine new players in an environment with hardly any ECM and no radar dep) and which equipment people bring to the table.
In the absence of ECM you can often hardly step out of cover before you have incomming missiles. Actually missiles are a first-rate supression weapon - were it not for the ECM inflation.

Also, the "underhive" comment is misplaced. As said above it is not just about skill but also equipment and map (LRM Valley is such a fun map when you have no ECM and the enemy is boating LRMs like mad)

However, the easiest to handle weapon which is as fool-prove as it can get is the laser (hitscan, no ammo, no hard counter etc). And laser boating is quite dominant in the higher ELO regions

Player mentality issue, mostly. Were they equip at least 1 AMS each, then none of them would have to fear LRMs. And AMS is on 99% of the mechs.

Edited by El Bandito, 23 June 2015 - 04:33 AM.

[Soy]

Bush Hopper, on 23 June 2015 - 04:00 AM, said:

I will never hate boobs. Ok, when they are able to spam missiles it is hard to play with them, though. Armed boobs...the horror actually

[MeiSooHaityu]

Do screenshots of the endgame score board ever really convince anyone of anything?

A screenshot proves that something is possible, but it doesn't prove it can be done consistently (and by the majority of the player base). My god some people do try by posting like 5 scoreboards. Great, 5 out of 100s of matches, congratulations lol.

[Novakaine]

Pjwned, on 22 June 2015 - 10:00 PM, said:

Considering the absolutely ridiculously overquirked nature of the HBK-4J, yeah I can believe that it gets kills.

Not saying that other mechs without absurd cooldown quirks can't get good stats with LRMs either, but your example isn't exactly proving a lot with LRMs themselves.

Your'e missing my point.
Any mitch can spam lurms, what I saying is the other players battlefield awareness ... just sucks.
Then they whine because they just stood there not listening to Betty screaming at them incoming lurms run fool.
And got lurmed to death.
Don't be the practice target.

[Joseph Mallan]

El Bandito, on 23 June 2015 - 04:31 AM, said:

I do hope that you do not mean to to start an e-peen war here. Cause I have better score with LRM boat in Canyon, than that one. Once in a while people do get lucky. And they keep the screenshots.

No no. Not trying to E-Peen. Sorry if it sounded that way.

[Novakaine]

MeiSooHaityu, on 23 June 2015 - 04:39 AM, said:

Do screenshots of the endgame score board ever really convince anyone of anything?

A screenshot proves that something is possible, but it doesn't prove it can be done consistently (and by the majority of the player base). My god some people do try by posting like 5 scoreboards. Great, 5 out of 100s of matches, congratulations lol.

So would 70, 80 or 90 out of 100 be enough because I got them dating from 2011?
Stalkers, Kintaro's, Catapults and even my Orion VA I only recently discover the power of the Hunchie J.
It's not the lurms it the witless players making themselves the primary target.
That make lurms so rage intensive.

[CMDR Argo]

Here is a suggestion, create a class of LRM support mechs(Anything over 1 LRM module) and limit the number of LRM support mechs that can be used in a 12 man drop or a 4 lance.

Just like the weight classification we use now.

If it has the same effect like we see with heavies that could curtail the number of LRM mechs we see on a given map

[TheCharlatan]

The other day I was in a match. Enemy team was full of LRMs. My team pushed them: it ended 12-2.
Just to be clear, we had just a single ECM mech (Raven 3L).
If LRMs need a balance change, they probably need a buff.

[Imperius]

Shinikaru, on 22 June 2015 - 08:20 PM, said:

It's been quite some time since LRM's were a thing that was disproportinate to the other weapon options, but we have all noticed that people are boating them again, and boating them in large numbers.

With the ahem "balancing" of just about every other mechanic lately (lasers, heat, ballistics (ac, lbx get no love), mostly to the softer side, LRM's are once again begging to become that thing that is more OP than the rest, as they stand out more then the rest.

Too many people going too much LRM all the time, over other weapons, due mostly to the other options getting softened. This has hit the brawling side adversely, as some of us simply won't jump on the bandwagon; we only pay the price while the numbers tally.
I say that from both sides. Too many of my mates unwilling to actually engage a front line because they're LRM boating....Too many of my mates also unable to push in because were facing face-pummeling numbers of incoming missles.

I think part of it is LRMS are such an easy thing for new players to gravitate too, high reward low risk.

It deserves a discussion, in relation to the constantly unbalanced-triad of missles/lazers/ballistics.


Think on it.

edit for my amazing spelling.

Dude if you die from LRMs you're just bad at the game. I mean you have poor cover use, poor situational awareness, obviously you've never used ECM.

Translation you're getting killed by the crappiest most un-useful weapon system in the game. Post your stats honestly they should be public by now so we can just look at you and see that you're under hive and ignore your thread. Though normally I skip over nerf LRMs I'm a bad player posts.

Edited by Imperius, 23 June 2015 - 07:09 AM.

[Drasari]

LRM's are fine, stop being bad.

[The Amazing Atomic Spaniel]

Imperius, on 23 June 2015 - 06:44 AM, said:

Dude if you die from LRMs you're just bad at the game.

Harsh. But fair.

I seldom even equip the radar deprivation module anymore because LRMs are just so easy to avoid. When I take an LRM-armed mech, it's because I want a challenge where I know I'm going to have to work hard just to get a kill (I recommend an Exe with 2LRM15, 2ERLL and 6ERSL as a fun build for pugging).

[DrunkenAntichrist]

Drasari, on 23 June 2015 - 06:48 AM, said:

LRM's are fine, stop being bad.

LRMs are bad, stop being fine.

[jlawsl]

Shinikaru, on 22 June 2015 - 08:20 PM, said:

It's been quite some time since LRM's were a thing that was disproportinate to the other weapon options, but we have all noticed that people are boating them again, and boating them in large numbers.

With the ahem "balancing" of just about every other mechanic lately (lasers, heat, ballistics (ac, lbx get no love), mostly to the softer side, LRM's are once again begging to become that thing that is more OP than the rest, as they stand out more then the rest.

Too many people going too much LRM all the time, over other weapons, due mostly to the other options getting softened. This has hit the brawling side adversely, as some of us simply won't jump on the bandwagon; we only pay the price while the numbers tally.
I say that from both sides. Too many of my mates unwilling to actually engage a front line because they're LRM boating....Too many of my mates also unable to push in because were facing face-pummeling numbers of incoming missles.

I think part of it is LRMS are such an easy thing for new players to gravitate too, high reward low risk.
It deserves a discussion, in relation to the constantly unbalanced-triad of missles/lazers/ballistics.


Think on it.

edit for my amazing spelling.

Is this game supposed to revolve around what mechs can do the biggest alpha at short range? LRMs are already hit or miss weapons(pun intended) on a lot of maps. Then add in AMS, ECM, Radar Dep and minimum range/reduced damage and you have a weapon that is only really good in rare situations. I have been playing lrm boats, lrm secondaries, long range builds and brawlers for the last few weeks just to mix it up. The only builds that heavy lrm users usually beat out are long range ppc builds because of the heat. Other then that, my ballistic, pulse laser or even srm builds are more reliable for damage.

Just noticing a weapon being used on mechs is not a reason to nerf them. What's the difference between an assault switching out one LL for an lrm 10 or a LPL for an lrm 15? Should they not be able to? It would make it seem like everyone is running lrm heavy, when in reality, I am seeing more one/two launcher builds as opposed to mass lrm boating. Should every weapon be nerfed until short range derp brawling is the only thing left because it seems like everyone in this game has an aversion to anything with any kind of range or velocity. Its like simulated/game/stompy robot warfare has to take a step back to the 18th or 19th century for range and speed, playing "who's the best at tight circles and alpha strikes?" or the weapons are op and need downgraded.

The speed of the missile is already slower in game then a friggin musket ball from the 1600s, so we might as well just line up our mechs and shoot in columns for how effective they are. Add in doing 1 damage per missile on a spread that some missiles miss, and its really hard to kill something that isn't already knocking on death's door with lrms without prodigious target lock time and ammo expenditure. So, no, I don't think lrms need another nerf. They are already bleh enough.

[General Solo]

Include an Encyclopedia in game to better educate players.
Older Mechwarrior games had an Encyclopedia.

For example:

LRM (Long Range Missile)
*Insert Usual specs here
*Insert Fluff here

Advantages - Easy to use weapon
Advantages - Can fire without line of sight using a team mates line of sight to target etc

Disadvantages - Needs a target lock to fire accurately
Disadvantages - Spreads damage over multiple Components (NOT PIN POINT Damage) etc

LRM Buffs: Beagle Active Probe, Advanced Sensor Range, TAG, Artemis, Target Decay etc

Counters- Avoiding Light of Sight Prevents lock which prevents LERMS
Counters- Use Terrian to block line of sight
Counters - ECM etc
Counter - Closing range to under 180 metres make Inner Sphere LERMMS ineffective

That sort of thing

Edited by OZHomerOZ, 23 June 2015 - 07:11 AM.

[C E Dwyer]

Bishop Steiner, on 22 June 2015 - 08:22 PM, said:

Remove yourself from the Underhive, and you will find the prevalence of LRMs to evaporate like a morning dew under the summer sun.

Not entirely correct, as one match I'm dropping with and against great skilled pilots, the next game I can end up in matches full of Lurm boaters, and base campers, only so much cover on the map

Soy, on 23 June 2015 - 04:35 AM, said:

ST mounted auto canon, for the win

[MeiSooHaityu]

Novakaine, on 23 June 2015 - 06:27 AM, said:

So would 70, 80 or 90 out of 100 be enough because I got them dating from 2011?
Stalkers, Kintaro's, Catapults and even my Orion VA I only recently discover the power of the Hunchie J.
It's not the lurms it the witless players making themselves the primary target.
That make lurms so rage intensive.

As for your wonderful picture gallery, Nope don't care .

I will agree that the player is their own worst enemy when it comes to being a victim of LRMs.

[B L O O D W I T C H]

Elizander, on 22 June 2015 - 09:32 PM, said:

Give me a dumbfire mode toggle where they just fire straight ahead like SRMs/LBX. LRMs fixed.

i do that all the time? just unlock and have a go. get an enemy who's like "mah missile warning is not working!!" every 5 games or so, surprising how they refuse to move while getting lurmed just because betty isn't bitching.