469 replies to this topic

[Uncle Totty]

Vashramire, on 30 June 2015 - 03:26 PM, said:

The Orion and Highlander's have a couple that come with standard engines. To my limited knowledge there were no clan standards, and I would find it odd that it could fit only a standard IS or Clan XL otherwise why can't I do that in my Centurion? I'm thinking It's IS engines(I hope) and clan weapons. As is I could recreate my HBK 4G with an ultra/AC 20, more lasers, harder hitting lasers, faster engine and more ammo and likely an AMS. Quirks aside they just seem to dominate their predecessors on paper, but we will see.

In the lore, Battlemechs took a looooooong time to repair/refit. Some times you would have to make a new mech from scratch to get the loadout you want. That is why the IS started building their own Omnimechs.

Edit: Also, I GOT MY ORION IIC PACK! (Christmas will come on the 15th this your. )

Edited by Nathan K, 30 June 2015 - 03:47 PM.

[Smoked]

Nathan K, on 30 June 2015 - 03:40 PM, said:

In the lore, Battlemechs took a looooooong time to repair/refit. Some times you would have to make a new mech from scratch to get the loadout you want. That is why the IS started building their own Omnimechs.

Edit: Also, I GOT MY ORION IIC PACK! (Christmas will come on the 15th this your. )

oO did you go get some KarmaKoins?

[Uncle Totty]

Smoked, on 30 June 2015 - 03:48 PM, said:

oO did you go get some KarmaKoins?

AFF!

[NocturnalBeast]

Vashramire, on 30 June 2015 - 03:26 PM, said:

The Orion and Highlander's have a couple that come with standard engines. To my limited knowledge there were no clan standards, and I would find it odd that it could fit only a standard IS or Clan XL otherwise why can't I do that in my Centurion? I'm thinking It's IS engines(I hope) and clan weapons. As is I could recreate my HBK 4G with an ultra/AC 20, more lasers, harder hitting lasers, faster engine and more ammo and likely an AMS. Quirks aside they just seem to dominate their predecessors on paper, but we will see.

Yes, there are Clan standard engines, but they were rarely used, because there is little downside to using a Clan XL, the only reason they would not use an XL is to cut down on the cost of the mech.

[Liquid Leopard]

InnerSphereNews, on 29 June 2015 - 02:01 PM, said:

Origins IIC Clan Collections are now available for pre-order!

https://mwomercs.com/origins

This is a good idea, but...

Marauder IIC or GTFO

[IraqiWalker]

PeeWrinkle, on 30 June 2015 - 08:51 AM, said:

I did not see it in the post, but in truth I just skimmed it so forgive me if I missed it. My question is will the IIC variants have different configuration rules since they do not have omnipods? Meaning will you be able to change Internal Structure and Armor type as well as change Engine size and number of jump jets or will all of that be locked as it is on the Clan omnimechs?

PeeWrinkle, on 30 June 2015 - 11:28 AM, said:

This is partly why I was wondering if they would be locked as ominmechs are. I can see it going either way because they are not omnimechs, but with clan weapons and the ability to configure anything you like the way you can on IS mechs they would potenitially be able to make every mech in the game obsolete. Imagine configuring any IS mech with both ES and FF for a total of 14 crits, follow that up with lighter weapons that take up less crits, and you allow engine reductions and things like extra DHS and JJs are not locked.

Quirk system aside, which I personally don't really like much, depending on how configurable they are it will most certainly mean another nerf for clan weapons. Which even as an IS mostly pilot, I would not like to see. Clan weapons are supposed to be superior technology. Not superior technology that is nerf'ed out of usefulness.

Anyway I digress. The mechs do look cool and I will probably end up dropping money on them, because I just wont be able to help myself! LOL

IIC mechs are BATTLEMECHS, not OMNIMECHS. So they can swap armor, and structure, and engines. These mechs are IS mechs with clan weapons, engines, and heatsinks.

Woodstock, on 30 June 2015 - 11:56 AM, said:

I think the Engine should be locked ... like all other clan mechs.

This would add some balance ....

Not really. Clan omnis come with CASE II, so they can be much more durable, and they swap hardpoints. IS battlemechs use IS grade weapons, which are colder, and have shorter firing durations. IIC mechs will have the benefits of both sides, and the weaknesses of both. No case mean an ammo explosion in a IIC mech will be catastrophic. While most clan mech can deal with it.

The way I see it, the IIC mechs are going to be the glassiest of glass cannons.

Ed Steele, on 30 June 2015 - 02:59 PM, said:

If the IICs can use Clan equipment and swap it out like an IS mech, then all current Clan and IS mechs will be inferior. If PGI allows this, it would make no sense lore-wise, why would Clan Scientists create vastly more expensive and complicated OMNI mechs, if they could have just kept retrofitting Star League mechs which are much more versatile and powerful?

Ok, PGI, balance this out with a Word Of Blake pack for the IS please.

Because while a battlemech is more versatile in some ways. It still takes months, to add a small customization to it. While a clan mech takes a couple of hours. On top of that, omni mechs are infinitely safer, because they are built with CASEII, they use Clan XLs, and on every respect, faster, and more mobile because of the clan XLs they use.

Many of the advantages the clan mechs have are off the field. They can always customize for every drop, and their repair time is enormously shorter.

If you want to show an approximation of clan mech advantage, then clan pilots should get a full 3 minutes during the drop waiting screen to adjust their mech for the map.

[bar10jim]

IraqiWalker, on 30 June 2015 - 03:25 AM, said:

They are battlemechs. Functionally identical to IS mechs, so unlocked Endo, FF, and engines. While using clan weapons.



I wish people actually bother to learn how the mechs work before they make a whine post about them. The HBK IIC packs 2 UAC 20s by having little armor.If you try to give it more armor while running the 2xUAC20 build, you're going to downgrade to a small engine.

It's not pay to win. You just didn't bother to learn how the mechs are built.



For the billionth time: PEOPLE WHO WORK ON MECHS ARE NOT THE SAME AS THOSE WHO WORK ON OTHER CONTENT, THEY ARE DIFFERENT TEAMS, WITH DRASTICALLY DIFFERENT SKILLS.

Seriously, learn the simple basics of software development if you are going to criticize it.



Yes, there are several dev videos, and even roadmap threads. I suggest you actually check the forums to see if something exists, before asking about it. (Watch the last 2 dev vlogs, and the video that was released specifically to showcase parts of the new River City re-work).

Darth, sarcasm won't help you here.

River City re-work is due out next patch.

[bar10jim]

Lexx, on 30 June 2015 - 07:55 AM, said:

Might as well buy this one if you like clan stuff, because they will be so OP when they come out that they will make every other mech in the game obsolete.

Then a few months later, around the time they come out for c-bills, they might get nerfed.

I have a bad feeling it will be like the clan omnimechs when they first came out, only worse because these can use clantech without any of the omni construction restrictions.

Seriously PGI, WTF are you thinking?

In the dev vlogs they make it look like they are trying to make the game more fun, but then they go an do another blatant cash grab that looks like all they care about is money.

I think the programmers and engineers want to make the game better, but the higher ups only care about the "bottom line". They keep pumping out mech packs with increasingly powerful mechs. They are putting "power creep" into the game to keep us spending money and it doesn't seem like they care about how it breaks game balance. They try and fix the balance later, but we still have a few mechs that are vastly superior to everything else, and that's what most of the players always use.

I was worried about the IIC mechs when I first heard they are going to be released. Now that I see the actual stats, I am really concerned about them breaking the game.



Please don't jump the shark PGI.

/endrant

That's what everybody said about the initial clan mechs....including the shark reference.

[Rodo]

Inner or Clan mechs?
New weapons?

[IraqiWalker]

Rodo, on 30 June 2015 - 11:30 PM, said:

Inner or Clan mechs?
New weapons?

Clan.

They are IS battlemechs with clan weapons, and equipment. That the clans used in garrison duty.

[NocturnalBeast]

IraqiWalker, on 30 June 2015 - 09:02 PM, said:

Because while a battlemech is more versatile in some ways. It still takes months, to add a small customization to it. While a clan mech takes a couple of hours. On top of that, omni mechs are infinitely safer, because they are built with CASEII, they use Clan XLs, and on every respect, faster, and more mobile because of the clan XLs they use.

Many of the advantages the clan mechs have are off the field. They can always customize for every drop, and their repair time is enormously shorter.

If you want to show an approximation of clan mech advantage, then clan pilots should get a full 3 minutes during the drop waiting screen to adjust their mech for the map.

Yes, the whole reason for Omni mechs was so that their loadouts could be changed in the field in a matter of hours whereas an IS or Second Line Clan mech would need to be at a base or production facility which had Engineers and Techs who were able to make the modifications and it would take days (if the parts were not on hand, then longer). Since PGI lets IS pilots change loadouts in minutes, then your idea for allow Omnimech loadouts to be changed during the ready phase, would be a very close approximation to the Omnimech advantage.

[Rodo]

IraqiWalker, on 01 July 2015 - 12:14 AM, said:

Clan.

They are IS battlemechs with clan weapons, and equipment. That the clans used in garrison duty.

Oh i see, so basically there is no point on playing Inner mech anymore? They are Weaker as hell.
My KingCrab with 119 CT Front die like **** to a Direwolf.

[Speedy Plysitkos]

Rodo, on 01 July 2015 - 12:23 AM, said:

Oh i see, so basically there is no point on playing Inner mech anymore? They are Weaker as hell.
My KingCrab with 119 CT Front die like **** to a Direwolf.

and atlas ? pffffff.

[IraqiWalker]

Rodo, on 01 July 2015 - 12:23 AM, said:

Oh i see, so basically there is no point on playing Inner mech anymore? They are Weaker as hell.
My KingCrab with 119 CT Front die like **** to a Direwolf.

That's because you're piloting it wrong.

Look, the second you say "this mech dies to that mech like a ****." it brings into question your style of piloting, and that you are probably making mistakes.

Also, IS mechs still use IS weapons with their own advantages. Also, wait for the mechs to actually hit the field before declaring things dead, or not.

So far, every single prediction by the community has been wrong on almost every account.

IS mechs still have their own advantages and disadvantages. IIC mechs have their own, and omnis have their own.

Or are you going to call clan omnis bad and useless when we get IS omnis?

Edited by IraqiWalker, 01 July 2015 - 12:45 AM.

[Nightshade24]

Navid A1, on 30 June 2015 - 03:36 AM, said:

I've got a question:

Why the (o) variants are the ones that SUCK the most?... too much fun is prohibited?

Also why the extra clan colors are all different shades of grey?

um... does anyone here feels like that the hunchie IIC may have problems with field of view?... dem hunches.

1) the special variant is often the iconic/ first variant. and in this case it is on the most fun jenner, hunchback, balanced orion, and best highlander...
At least for my view...

2) Don't ask me.

3) A trade off for having double the boom.

[Rodo]

IraqiWalker, on 01 July 2015 - 12:43 AM, said:

That's because you're piloting it wrong. Also, IS mechs still use IS weapons with their own advantages. Also, wait for the mechs to actually hit the field before declaring things dead, or not.

So far, every single prediction by the community has been wrong on almost every account.

IS mechs still have their own advantages and disadvantages. IIC mechs have their own, and omnis have their own.

Or are you going to call clan omnis bad and useless when we get IS omnis?

I dont know... I played MW4, nobody there used IS Mechs, the reason? they are bad.
But, we were able to use omni hardpoint, clan and is weapons on every mech, dont matter the faction.
Also, still missing a lot of weapons for IS that could change the game, like the Light Gauss and Heavy.
Where are the MRM? LongTom? etc etc...
I think that they are so much concerned in making money with "new" mechs, that they forgotten a lot of details.

[Nightshade24]

Navid A1, on 30 June 2015 - 04:18 AM, said:

i meant why they (O variants) are outclassed by the standard variants by such a big margin?
Is there any reason to use the (O)s when you have jenner-IIC-A and HBK-IIC-C?

I hope they consider changing it like they did with the zeus.

1) they changed the zeus TO the main zeus.
They would only change the jenner if say it was the Jenner-IIC-A (O) and people where like "f*** you pgi, make it the original!"

2) tell me where the big margin is? because for the jenner and hunchback I see the best variant so to say is the one with the (O)

[Widowmaker1981]

I have absolutely no idea how this can possibly be balanced.

Omnimechs are incredibly limited by the locked customisation, which balances out the obvious tech advantages. If IICs have clan tech and full customisation, how can they be anything other than flat out superior to Omnimechs?

[IraqiWalker]

Rodo, on 01 July 2015 - 12:49 AM, said:

I dont know... I played MW4, nobody there used IS Mechs, the reason? they are bad.
But, we were able to use omni hardpoint, clan and is weapons on every mech, dont matter the faction.
Also, still missing a lot of weapons for IS that could change the game, like the Light Gauss and Heavy.
Where are the MRM? LongTom? etc etc...
I think that they are so much concerned in making money with "new" mechs, that they forgotten a lot of details.

Yeah MW4 was one of the most broken multiplayer experiences in the history of multiplayer gaming. There was no balance there. IS omnis with clan weapons were the standard on most servers.

We didn't use standard battlemechs because they had a hardpoint restriction. Everyone used omnimechs, both clan and IS, because you could slap any weapon you want into the hardpoint slot.

As for weapons, I would explode from joy right now if we can get more weapons into the game right now.

BTW: MRMs, ATMs, Light Gauss, and Heavy Gauss are all 3061+ tech. We're still in 3052.

However, there are dozens of other weapons, and tech that we should have in the game right now. Like Snub Nose PPCs, Specialized ammo, properly functioning LBXs. Silver Bullet Gauss Rifles. Coolant Pods. Arrow IV. Sniper Artillery. Long Tom Artillery. Mech Mortars. Laser AMS. Laser Heatsinks. Thunder LRMs... etc.

Widowmaker1981, on 01 July 2015 - 12:58 AM, said:

I have absolutely no idea how this can possibly be balanced.

Omnimechs are incredibly limited by the locked customisation, which balances out the obvious tech advantages. If IICs have clan tech and full customisation, how can they be anything other than flat out superior to Omnimechs?

Wait, and you'll see.

So far, most of the people who are calm about this, and aren't panicking are thinking the mechs will be good, just not tier 1.

Plus, we have a great balancing method in the form of chassis quirks. Not to mention they are using clan weapons, on IS mechs.

IICs are basically the middle ground between IS mechs, and clan omnis. They have advantages from both, and disadvantages from both.

[Túatha Dé Danann]

IraqiWalker, on 01 July 2015 - 01:17 AM, said:

IICs are basically the middle ground between IS mechs, and clan omnis. They have advantages from both, and disadvantages from both.

Which disadvantages? Locked hardpoints? Most of them have a good mix of hardpoints. While this means, that a full outbuild variant will also use a mix of weapons, this is not really a disadvantage.