59 replies to this topic

[SeventhSL]

Well I feel truly sry for the IS PUG players at the sharp end of the current -MetaStomp-. Spent a couple weeks as a clan player at the end of it myself. Not fun or encouraging I know. Anyway hang in there. They will move on eventually.

[Black Ivan]

CW isn't fun at all anymore.

If it continues the way it does it will soon be the playground for the very few "elite" untis and that's it. Nobody else will play it.

[DarklightCA]

Black Ivan, on 05 July 2015 - 09:56 PM, said:

CW isn't fun at all anymore.

If it continues the way it does it will soon be the playground for the very few "elite" untis and that's it. Nobody else will play it.

That's because majority of the people that play CW ignore the constant advice EVERYBODY gives you about how to increase your enjoyment in CW which again is STOP SOLO DROPPING. Grouping in CW will increase your odds of not only getting a game but actually winning it because 12 people working together is greater then 12 individuals working by themselves. Though that advice will never be followed because who apparently needs friends in a teamwork oriented video game.

[Soulstrom]

DemonicD3, on 05 July 2015 - 10:42 PM, said:

That's because majority of the people that play CW ignore the constant advice EVERYBODY gives you about how to increase your enjoyment in CW which again is STOP SOLO DROPPING.

Sometimes it is great to solo drop. It depends on the pug team you drop with.

[Aresye]

Soulstrom, on 06 July 2015 - 07:52 AM, said:

Sometimes it is great to solo drop. It depends on the pug team you drop with.

Nothing better than pulling 3500+ damage and carrying a pug team to victory against a premade

[Soulstrom]

Aresye Kerensky, on 06 July 2015 - 08:00 AM, said:

Nothing better than pulling 3500+ damage and carrying a pug team to victory against a premade

Does that happen a lot?

[Aresye]

Soulstrom, on 06 July 2015 - 06:50 PM, said:

Does that happen a lot?

When you win the magic lottery where the pugs are bad, but not overly bad, and you're facing a large group that's average, yeah it could happen a lot.

[Ssamout]

I feel that if teams are about even in skill, one good player can easily carry the match in cw, more so than in regular play. But that only happens in the lower skill levels. If both teams are competent the damage is usually speads out quite evenly.

But solo dropping is the way to get those sweet 3000+ matches. In 12-man drops dmg spread is usually in the 900-1500dmg range. Your team mates have to suck a little for you to be able to carry.

[FroBanger]

The issue is Clan mechs are clan mechs that are PRETTY much the same there is no OVER powered chassi its pretty much you put weapons on a clan mech and its almost as good as any other clan mech.

IS mechs are extremly different. They live and DIE by the quirks. And I'm not sure if "pugs" just don't know how to look at the quirks or just don't realize that quirks are their only way to get an advantage over clans.

The real issue the "grouping" in this game well high end grouping is mostly done out of MWO. in TS on the Forums.
They need some sort of "Board" in game where it shows The Clan Units and the IS units shows, how many players they have what time zones they play in and their "skil level"<-- Or just shows how many planets they have their tag on.

No new player that comes into this game has the TS of the high ranking Clan or IS units, they have the Comstar TS and thats about it. Get stomped by enough 12 mans and they either Quit playing Which is bad for all of us or they visit the forums and look for a group to play with which is good for all of us.

If this game ever hopes to thrive and be a bit more user friendly they have to impliment a feature beyond Match Maker That will shuffle new players to units in their time zone or units that play while that person plays. But that is of course only when it comes to CW. I find solo pugging quite friendly for new players or untless players. unforgiving but alot more friendly then pug CW. Granted the VOIP was a great idea but how much conversation do players have about "what mech is best for this map or the theoritcal implifications of different weapon types, probably nill. Frig they could skip All of my other ideas and add a "Chat" that is CROSS faction that all players can participate in to help the new player with mechs and build and weapons and tactics, every player that rages out of mwo hurts us as a community and I'm certain that every veteran knows this and would definatly help new players.

[Aresye]

FroBanger, on 07 July 2015 - 03:14 PM, said:

The issue is Clan mechs are clan mechs that are PRETTY much the same there is no OVER powered chassi its pretty much you put weapons on a clan mech and its almost as good as any other clan mech.

IS mechs are extremly different. They live and DIE by the quirks. And I'm not sure if "pugs" just don't know how to look at the quirks or just don't realize that quirks are their only way to get an advantage over clans.

IS:
KGC-0000
STK-4N
STK-M
RVN-2X
TDR-9SE
TDR-5SS
WVR-6K
DRG-1N
FS9-S
FS9-A

Clan:
DWF
TBR
HBR
EBJ
SCR

We still don't know how good the Arctic Cheetah will be, so for the time being, that's about it for "good" Clan mechs. Most often the 4th and lightest Clan mech is often a, "I hope I never get to this," filler for tonnage. At least IS you get down to your Firestarters you still have a very effective (and fast) way to finish off Omega and/or the last few mechs to secure victory. I get what you're saying though. I just think you're selling out the IS side short. There are a lot of viable drop deck options for IS, and a lot of quirked mechs that have great hard points.

You guys have pilots that don't take advantage of quirks. Our side has pilots that like to build symmetrical loadouts with LRMs, machine guns, and LBXs. No side is immune to clueless players that don't understand the game.

You put a top notch Clan team against a top notch IS team, with both sides running the most effective drop decks and loadouts, and it will end up coming down to teamwork.

Edited by Aresye Kerensky, 08 July 2015 - 10:20 AM.

[Deathlike]

Aresye Kerensky, on 07 July 2015 - 08:44 PM, said:

IS:
KGC-0000

I don't think that belongs with the rest, despite the nature of the beast.

[Koshirou]

KGCs and Atlases are worthless, tonnage-soaking anchors around the necks of waves otherwise consisting of heavies or faster assaults. I'd argue the same is true for the Dire, but at least that one has massive firepower compared to the heavies to show for this disadvantage, as opposed to the IS 100-tonners' okay-ish firepower compared to IS heavies.

Still, and I want to make this absolutely clear, I don't fault anybody for playing these Mechs. They are fun to play - for many people at least - and individual players' fun should actually be the cornerstone of all gameplay considerations.
The current situation, with a "playable meta" consisting of a miniscule fractions of possible 'Mech models and builds, is another of the many CW problems. And like most of these problems, it affects the IS more than it does the Clans - mostly since while almost all other Clan Mechs are at least serviceable, the majority of IS models are "dude, never bring this to CW" material.

Edited by Koshirou, 08 July 2015 - 02:38 AM.

[Aresye]

Deathlike, on 07 July 2015 - 09:22 PM, said:

I don't think that belongs with the rest, despite the nature of the beast.

Koshirou, on 08 July 2015 - 02:31 AM, said:

KGCs and Atlases are worthless, tonnage-soaking anchors around the necks of waves otherwise consisting of heavies or faster assaults.

When 228 goes 48-0 against a 12man team of HHoD with them, I'd say they're far from worthless.

Oh wait, are you going to say it was "teamwork" that decided that match? So what's it called when a 12man of Clanners goes 48-22 with mixed Clan mechs against an IS team? Now it's suddenly, "Clans OP," right?

[Deathlike]

Aresye Kerensky, on 08 July 2015 - 10:25 AM, said:

When 228 goes 48-0 against a 12man team of HHoD with them, I'd say they're far from worthless.

Oh wait, are you going to say it was "teamwork" that decided that match? So what's it called when a 12man of Clanners goes 48-22 with mixed Clan mechs against an IS team? Now it's suddenly, "Clans OP," right?

HHoD is not the best the IS has to offer honestly.

[Aresye]

Deathlike, on 08 July 2015 - 11:39 AM, said:

HHoD is not the best the IS has to offer honestly.

If you're arguing on the merit that 100t mechs don't fit very well into a CW dropdeck because of tonnage, I completely understand that, which is why the Dire Wolf doesn't see much use in CW either, but that doesn't mean the King Crab is a bad option.

KGC-0000, WVR-6K, WVR-6K, SDR-5K
KGC-0000, TDR-5SS, FS9-S, FS9-S
KGC-0000, DRG-1N, DRG-1N, LCT-PB

[Soulstrom]

Deathlike, on 08 July 2015 - 11:39 AM, said:

HHoD is not the best the IS has to offer honestly.

Then what is the best unit IS has to offer that is a loyalist unit?

I have fought with HHoD and they are an excellent team and group of players.

[Deathlike]

Aresye Kerensky, on 08 July 2015 - 01:11 PM, said:

If you're arguing on the merit that 100t mechs don't fit very well into a CW dropdeck because of tonnage, I completely understand that, which is why the Dire Wolf doesn't see much use in CW either, but that doesn't mean the King Crab is a bad option.

While the King Crab has more firepower than the Atlas (the D-DC is still a good option for ECM, but those get focused fired so easily when the opportunity shows up), it doesn't have the same kind of impact. I mean, you could go dual Gauss or multi-dakka, but there are lower tonnage options that do it better (Dragon or Jagermech), which is kind of the ultimate problem. It's a risk-reward thing that doesn't entirely match up in CW sometimes.

Quote

KGC-0000, WVR-6K, WVR-6K, SDR-5K

Don't you mean the 5D?

Quote

KGC-0000, TDR-5SS, FS9-S, FS9-S

Dual Firestarters are not optimal since post-gen clustering. Better off having more beef these days.

Quote

KGC-0000, DRG-1N, DRG-1N, LCT-PB

The PB is a token Light, despite having ECM and some decent firepower. However, building a dropdeck that revolves around more Dragons than necessary/usual doesn't work long term against better teams that expose their weaknesses.

Pretty much most dropdecks include a Thunderbolt-5SS and a Firestarter... the other two mechs are anyone's guess, but tend to include some sort of Stalker option although I think poptarting may come back for a bit (reviving the Victor-DS and Cataphract), but all in all, optimal or at least decent dropdecks tend to minimize weakness and maximum effectiveness across all waves.

Also, it's hard to agree on which is the best IS medium in a dropdeck (ECM Griffin-2N tends to be short range, Wolverine-6K has that arm, and you could name examples but they all have some sort of weakness depending on the situation on group constitution).

Edited by Deathlike, 08 July 2015 - 04:50 PM.

[pwnface]

Don't you mean group composition?

Edited by pwnface, 08 July 2015 - 05:19 PM.

[Deathlike]

pwnface, on 08 July 2015 - 05:18 PM, said:

Don't you mean group composition?

They mean the same thing (I think), but sure, why not.

[Koshirou]

Aresye Kerensky, on 08 July 2015 - 10:25 AM, said:

When 228 goes 48-0 against a 12man team of HHoD with them, I'd say they're far from worthless.

If you seriously went 48 to ZERO, then Mechs don't even enter the discussion. Even the most pitiful pug team I've ever fought with against the toughest unit managed to get at least some kills. The only two explanations I would have for that would be:
a) They just gave up and went afk.
4 straight gen rushes with no attempts to shoot Mechs.

Edited by Koshirou, 11 July 2015 - 12:48 PM.