749 replies to this topic

[MischiefSC]

I'm pretty posses over the state of cw and some other balance issues. I refused to buy the most recent packages and won't until we actually see the "improvements" to cw and balance, quirks, etc.

Yet... Dat Warhammer. Dat Marauder. I know Alex will make them dead sexy. I am horrified by what would get done to them by hit boxes and quirks. Maybe they are best left as imagination where they are unsullied and wonderful.

but....

God damn it. God DAMN it.

Yeah. I'd sell my principles on my frustration over other mwo issues like the ***** I am. The filthy, shameless ***** I am where original art Unseen BT mechs are concerned.

Yeah. I'd buy it. Art like in the op and I'd buy it.

[stjobe]

Deimos Alpha, on 28 July 2015 - 06:46 AM, said:

Was looking at the Goliath four legged mech and it got me thinking do you think they'll ever introduce mechs with multiple legs?

No, not a chance.

Too many animation issues, and also quads don't have waists, so they'd need a whole new control scheme.

Not going to happen.

[Steinar Bergstol]

MischiefSC, on 28 July 2015 - 08:23 AM, said:

I'm pretty posses over the state of cw and some other balance issues. I refused to buy the most recent packages and won't until we actually see the "improvements" to cw and balance, quirks, etc.

Yet... Dat Warhammer. Dat Marauder. I know Alex will make them dead sexy. I am horrified by what would get done to them by hit boxes and quirks. Maybe they are best left as imagination where they are unsullied and wonderful.

but....

God damn it. God DAMN it.

Yeah. I'd sell my principles on my frustration over other mwo issues like the ***** I am. The filthy, shameless ***** I am where original art Unseen BT mechs are concerned.

Yeah. I'd buy it. Art like in the op and I'd buy it.

Take heart in the fact that you're not the only one who'd sell out his principles in a heartbeat for the Unseen. I'm pretty sure most of us posting in this thread would sit up and act like obedient little dogs if PGI said "Here's the Unseen, but you only get them if you beg. Now beg, puppets! Beg!"

[Joseph Mallan]

stjobe, on 28 July 2015 - 08:34 AM, said:

No, not a chance.

Too many animation issues, and also quads don't have waists, so they'd need a whole new control scheme.

Not going to happen.

The Goliath had what looked like a turret housing the main gun... Turret twist???

Edited by Joseph Mallan, 28 July 2015 - 08:45 AM.

[stjobe]

Joseph Mallan, on 28 July 2015 - 08:44 AM, said:

The Goliath had what looked like a turret housing the main gun... Turret twist???

Key word: "looked like". Quads don't have turrets, it's in the rules. In return, they can side-step which no other 'mech can.

Edit: And the Scorpion has no turret:

Edited by stjobe, 28 July 2015 - 08:49 AM.

[Juodas Varnas]

stjobe, on 28 July 2015 - 08:48 AM, said:

Key word: "looked like". Quads don't have turrets, it's in the rules. In return, they can side-step which no other 'mech can.

Edit: And the Scorpion has no turret:

Mhm.
However, i do think that there are ways to implement them into a FPS like MW:O.

But they would require a separate control scheme, more reminiscent to more traditional FPSes. I'm thinking something along the lines of "A" and "D" for moving sideways (add a separate throttle for the lateral movement), with the ability to move diagonally (using both WS and AD throttles), and the Mouse to control the Mech's turning.
As I said, something like a traditional FPS.

I do believe it would add more depth to the game and make it more interesting in general, however the amount of effort is probably not worth the result

[Kristov Kerensky]

MW2 actually had a Quad in it that you could unlock and use. It was fun but really not effective due to the total lack of twist, which means you have to move the entire Mech to aim the weapons, much like the Nova, only without the arm movement which at least allowed you to aim laterally and vertically without having to turn the Mech to aim at something 2m off of center

[Juodas Varnas]

However, keep in mind that PGI did give the Blackhawk/Nova a waist for torso twisting, there's no reason why they couldn't do the same for Quads, by adding either a turret or just giving it an actual waist.

[Armored Yokai]

Quads can move side to side

[Nik Reaper]

MischiefSC, on 28 July 2015 - 08:23 AM, said:

...

Yeah. I'd buy it. Art like in the op and I'd buy it.

Yap, one thing to consider is that we are coming in to an age of 3D printers , so every mech PGI makes we can easily extract and print, so in part even if we don't own the mech model or the rights to use them ( legaly any way ) we are paying for model development that we can print for our selfs while playing them while the game lives .

[Kristov Kerensky]

Juodas Varnas, on 28 July 2015 - 09:01 AM, said:

However, keep in mind that PGI did give the Blackhawk/Nova a waist for torso twisting, there's no reason why they couldn't do the same for Quads, by adding either a turret or just giving it an actual waist.

There's nothing in BTech that says the Nova has no torso twist, that's a MW2 created issue carried on into the follow up titles that had the Nova in them, and it's based soley on the crappy art of the 3050 TRO. In BTech, all biped Mechs have torso twist, the artist doing the drawings didn't always take that into consideration, not to mention that the art wasn't always FOR what it was used for in the end, it was often simply art that someone at FASA liked so they used it, sometimes even remembering to buy the rights to use it

Quads do have very clear rules about NO turrets, their guns face directly ahead, they don't get the ability to aim anywhere but their forward facing. They do get movement rules that are unique to them in compensation for that. In MWO that would probably equate to them being able to straff sideways as well as climbing slopes MUCH easier than any biped Mech could.

[Jetfire]

pbiggz, on 28 July 2015 - 08:15 AM, said:

Light: Valkyrie - 30 tons
Medium: Phoenix hawk - 45 tons
Heavy: Warhammer - 70 tons
Assault: Longbow - 85 tons

Loyalty heavy - Marauder - 75 tons

DO IT!

[Juodas Varnas]

Kristov Kerensky, on 28 July 2015 - 09:20 AM, said:

There's nothing in BTech that says the Nova has no torso twist, that's a MW2 created issue carried on into the follow up titles that had the Nova in them, and it's based soley on the crappy art of the 3050 TRO. In BTech, all biped Mechs have torso twist, the artist doing the drawings didn't always take that into consideration, not to mention that the art wasn't always FOR what it was used for in the end, it was often simply art that someone at FASA liked so they used it, sometimes even remembering to buy the rights to use it

Quads do have very clear rules about NO turrets, their guns face directly ahead, they don't get the ability to aim anywhere but their forward facing. They do get movement rules that are unique to them in compensation for that. In MWO that would probably equate to them being able to straff sideways as well as climbing slopes MUCH easier than any biped Mech could.

I do believe that there was a ruleset that allowed Quads to mount turrets, which gave them the ability to "torso twist".
Something about "Level 3 Rules"? My memory's fuzzy as f*ck

But, if you go by older Mechwarrior titles, i do recall the Nova not actually having a torso twist in Mechwarrior 2, so what's the problem?

Edited by Juodas Varnas, 28 July 2015 - 09:27 AM.

[bad arcade kitty]

stjobe, on 28 July 2015 - 08:48 AM, said:

Key word: "looked like". Quads don't have turrets, it's in the rules.

well nova in the lore cannot torso twist too
our nova can

[stjobe]

bad arcade kitty, on 28 July 2015 - 09:27 AM, said:

well nova in the lore cannot torso twist too
our nova can

Which lore is that? Because in the TT rules it most certainly can torso twist.

[bad arcade kitty]

show me on these dolls... with what joint nova torso twists

[stjobe]

bad arcade kitty, on 28 July 2015 - 09:41 AM, said:

show me on these dolls... with what joint nova torso twists

What do you think happens if one of those humongous hip joints rotates forward and one backward?

Try it - stand up with straight legs. Push one hip forward and the other back. What happens to your torso when you do that?

Have you never been on a dance floor?

[Kristov Kerensky]

Juodas Varnas, on 28 July 2015 - 09:26 AM, said:

I do believe that there was a ruleset that allowed Quads to mount turrets, which gave them the ability to "torso twist".
Something about "Level 3 Rules"? My memory's fuzzy as f*ck

But, if you go by older Mechwarrior titles, i do recall the Nova not actually having a torso twist in Mechwarrior 2, so what's the problem?

bad arcade kitty, on 28 July 2015 - 09:27 AM, said:

well nova in the lore cannot torso twist too
our nova can

Actually the lore says nothing about Nova's being unable to twist, and the actual rules for BTech give it the exact same twist as every other biped Mech. MW2 was the first MW title to have the Nova, and the guys at Activision simply followed the ARTWORK when they did the Nova, they didn't pay attention to the fact that all biped Mechs have torso twist, and THAT error was carried over into the other MW titles UNTIL MWO corrected it by giving the Nova the ability to twist.

Again, the art used by FASA for Mechs was NOT based on what the Mechs could or couldn't do, many times the art was NOT based on BTech at all, it was simply really cool robot art that FASA bought and used as a Mech.

As to turrets on Quads, I don't know the level 3 rules, but I do recall something about setting weapons to have a particular facing on the Quad, which let them fire 'sideways' or even behind them(not uncommon to fire behind you in BTech, lots fo Mechs have rear facing weapons) without having to change their actual facing. What made Quads good was the movement abilities they got.

[martian]

Juodas Varnas, on 28 July 2015 - 09:26 AM, said:

I do believe that there was a ruleset that allowed Quads to mount turrets, which gave them the ability to "torso twist".
Something about "Level 3 Rules"? My memory's fuzzy as f*ck

I mentioned it in my post #439. It's called "BattleMech Turret". You can find it in Tactical Operations, p.347.

For example GOL-6M Goliath is equipped with such turret. Its Gauss Rifle and MMLs have 360° fire arc.

[Johnny Z]

martian, on 28 July 2015 - 09:49 AM, said:

I mentioned it in my post #439. It's called "BattleMech Turret". You can find it in Tactical Operations, p.347.

For example GOL-6M Goliath is equipped with such turret. Its Gauss Rifle and MMLs have 360° fire arc.

Multi player mech.