264 replies to this topic

[Milocinia]

Something tells me that the OP is the type of pilot seen at 2:54

[Odinvolk]

IMHO the current state of LRMs makes perfect sense.
In team-oriented play your scouts with UAVs, Tag and NARC should get you targets.
It can be deadly effective, but good scouts = essential.

[Sarlic]

I just need to have posted here.

[Vesshar]

Hi there.

I'm an LRM user. I am not ashamed of that in any way, shape or form.

I'm also a relatively new player that has played about 200-300ish games. My favorite mech is the Catapult, in all it's forms, but mainly I go for the LRM variants. I play with LRM because I like to be away from the main brawl, since I'm not used to the hectic firefights that shake my screen and throughly disorientate me, thereby limiting my already limited abillity to help my team in destroying the enemy.

I also like being a teamplayer who supports my team.

I like to spam LRM 5 because they give me a better control on my ammunition usage than if I fire 15's or 20's. I also like flamers, despite how they aren't the best. In fact, most would probably agree that they are the worst.

That doesn't matter to me though. I like them, so I play with them. LRM and Flamers; those are my kind of weapons. Oh, and the occasional SRM 4.

Having said all that, let me explain how I view the hatred that some people have with me and my ilk; the people who dare to use these dreadful weapons:

I am totally fine with you being mad. I mean, I can understand it perfectly. It's annoying, it's cheap, it isn't a straight-up firefight, it's unfair, it's not a showcase of skill, it's way too easy. I know all of this. I am prepared for your rage. I can handle it. After all, I'm that guy who's lobbing indirect screaming death at you.

What I won't do, is apologise. I am not sorry in the least. What I won't do either, is complain about my weapons, my team or my enemies. I know what I'm carrying and I've read the fine print. Nobody likes my missiles but me.

I don't complain when my team doesn't give me target locks. I know they are busy trying not to die, so of course I appreciate it when someone does give me more than a 4 second lock on a target. If I could, I would gladly get my own targets in my Line of Sight, but ECM usually prevents me from having any chance of doing that on my own. Even if I could get close enough to target an ECM mech, then either my missiles won't work at that range or I get my fat missile ass handed to me because I have to remain locket on a target, leaving me unable to torso-twist in any way, without losing my precious lock. The same thing applies when facing off against anything with either a Gauss Rifle, ER PPC, ER Large Laser or most Clan weaponry that far outranges my missiles. Theirs are almost instant hitting, while my missiles have to travel. Their damage can be pinpoInt, mine has to spread. They can torso-twist effectively, I can't.

That might seem like whineing or complaining, but I can assure you I would not have ECM or any weapon group in any other way, since I see ECM as a very cool utility tool that also provides me with a challenge to overcome and non-missile weapons as something I just have learn to deal with. There's gotta be some drawback in order to shoot over terrain, right?

Sure, even I get a kill or two every now and then, when people are spotted and in the open. I'm cheap, that's what I do.

In any case, I like LRM's as they are. I understand that many don't. In that case, I suggest you come at me. Full speed and no brakes. That's the best thing you can do against a Lurm'er like me.

But if you do, I, at the very least, will do my very best to burn you to a crisp.

See you all on the battlefield!

[Sigilum Sanctum]

cdlord, on 26 July 2015 - 09:08 PM, said:

Jesus christ I nearly choked on my cranberry juice when I saw this.

[DrxAbstract]

Hit the Deck, on 26 July 2015 - 11:20 PM, said:

What are you trying to achieve by making LRM an accurate low damage low disorientating weapon? It kind of reminds me of Flamer and MGs..., but this one has range.

LRM damage is pretty well off in the current game--If you can get them to connect through ECM, LoS, cover, etc.

And we all know full well what happens when stars align and a blue moon rises: the enemy team has a couple LRM boats and your team has no ECM on an open map. Or the more sinister coordinated group with 3-4 LRM boats and a couple experienced spotters.

But to answer your question:
With the elimination of the ECM blackout bubble and increased accuracy+speed in tandem with reduced cooldown, reducing their damage and disorienting effects combined with boosting AMS's effectiveness are necessary measures in preventing the aforementioned situations from happening... Allowing the weapon to be 'used not abused' and to make AMS a little more valuable plus keeping BAP's value.

They will still have some disorienting capability, but not to the extent they do now, which is far too effective at locking people down. Their accuracy improvement necessitates a reduction in damage as more missiles will hit than they currently do, so it should even out some. The accuracy modifications also afford faster Mediums and Lights some survivability against Standard Guidance LRMs while only the fastest Lights have any hope of escaping Artemis LRMs... A survival bonus Lights capable of 150+ KPH should be afforded.

Edited by DrxAbstract, 27 July 2015 - 12:07 AM.

[Novakaine]

You must be new lrms are worst weapon in the game get real.
Bap is broke.
I have harsher words but why bother.
Command Console is 3 ton joke.
TAG lasers equate to shoot me here light.
And every other mech has a magic jesus box.
Give me a break.
Gonna have to change my freaking sig now.
Thanks for nothing PGI.
On a side note though........

Edited by Novakaine, 27 July 2015 - 12:27 AM.

[Thunder Child]

Dumbkoff, on 26 July 2015 - 11:58 PM, said:

Snip, but excellent post

DrxAbstract, on 27 July 2015 - 12:03 AM, said:

Snip, but in reply to both of your posts.

Dumbkoff, cannot like your post enough. Play what you enjoy using.

<Redacted>

Goddamn, I'm starting to sound like a Tryhard. When did that happen....

Edited by Thunder Child, 27 July 2015 - 03:26 AM.

[Novakaine]

Dumbkoff, on 26 July 2015 - 11:58 PM, said:

But if you do, I, at the very least, will do my very best to burn you to a crisp.

See you all on the battlefield!

And a Rocketeer Award for you my friend.

Edited by Novakaine, 27 July 2015 - 12:26 AM.

[bad arcade kitty]

Novakaine, on 27 July 2015 - 12:26 AM, said:

And a Rocketeer Award for you my friend.

to protect the world from devastation!

[Novakaine]

Yellonet, on 26 July 2015 - 06:46 PM, said:

HBK-4SP

Heh ya think it's easy with tissue paper ammo?
But this is for you.
This is what team work + a good support mech will get you.
Haters gonna hate.
Don't be hatin.

[SmoothCriminal]

@ OP - I can see your annoyance at being caught out of position and without ECM support (especially in an assault) can spell LRM doom. However spend the big bucks on a radar derp module and learn to hill hump/cower behind rocks and LRMs fade into insignificance very quickly. Learn to break locks and rotate out of the way and you should be fine.

[Speedy Plysitkos]

death to all LRMers..

[Davers]

Yellonet, on 26 July 2015 - 04:05 PM, said:

Ok, there's some good tips here, but tbh it all seems to much meta, or gamey, learn the maps, let other players take the hits and grind grind grind to get radar deprevation... If these are really the only viable ways to not get killed my LRM's, it's pretty pathetic.
Basically, what I'm saying (and you are saying) is that LRM's are so easy to use that there are no real player skill that you can have to defeat them but you have to resort to gamey stuff like unlocking tech and using knowledge of how the stupidly small maps are set up.... wow...

LRMs will always be the bane of slow mechs whose pilots do not have good positioning. In a medium, or fast heavy, I don't even really notice if the enemy has LRMs- their damage is like fall damage: it's there but so insignificant I don't worry about it. With a travel time of 1 second per 100 meters, even assault mechs should have time to get in cover. I know you think this is a serious issue, but after you get more games under your belt you will learn how to deal with them.

[Siegegun]

I laugh at this entire thread LOL <--- See? Laughter.

[DrxAbstract]

Thunder Child, on 27 July 2015 - 12:24 AM, said:

DrxAbstract, I'm sorry, I usually try to avoid personal attacks, but you sir, are a Moron.

Noted. Completely pointless, just as your other are assertions are but noted none the less.

Thunder Child, on 27 July 2015 - 12:24 AM, said:

Lower LRM damage to 0.5? Hell, lets do that. And drop Gauss to 5. Same with PPCs. And nerf their speed so they can't hit lights at all. And Lasers are too strong as well, so lets double the heat and burn time.

Nobody is talking about Gauss, PPCs or Lasers. Dont use completely irrelevant comparisons to compensate your clear lack of having anything to actually say.

Thunder Child, on 27 July 2015 - 12:24 AM, said:

The kind of nerfs you are proposing are the sort that would not only make LRMs the absolute worst weapon in the game, but would actually make them so bad that PGI would have to pay people with MC just to use them. Yes, the weapon system needs an overhaul. But if anything, it needs Buffs once the Guidance system has been fixed. Right now, LRMs are a Skill Check. They teach you how to survive the real weapons in this game. They teach you to learn to use cover, they teach you situational awareness, and most importantly they teach you teamwork. All important skills for when you actually start getting good at this game.

I've been here through every iteration of LRMs and have seen what will happen if ECM blackouts are removed, which needs to happen, and for it to be successful then the weapons it directly affects also need to be adjusted. I've also been here long enough to know there's very few maps and positions within those maps that effectively limit LRM usage. Right now LRMs are a joke and teach you nothing any other weapon in the game cant other than bringing them is almost certainly a waste of tonnage unless very specific conditions are met, compared to any other weapon which can be utilized more effectively because they possess a much, much broader set of operating conditions.

Thunder Child, on 27 July 2015 - 12:24 AM, said:

I hate to say this, because it always sounds condescending, but most people really aren't as good as they think they are.

This statement includes the people in here saying 'lolcovergg' as i've personally seen them hammered to dust by the same things they mock others for. Double standards comes with the territory.

Edited by DrxAbstract, 27 July 2015 - 01:01 AM.

[The Mech behind you]

Hahaha this thread is great. So many laughs.

LRMs are destroying the game. They do by getting weaker and weaker over the last years. Also this thread right after the ACH and Scat got released and everyone and their grand mother playing the new stuff which also comes with ECM.

OP, please wait till everone mastered their ACH and the light queue snaps back to 5% and start a 'Lights are destroying the game' thread. You could combine this if you want into a 'LRM Lights are destroying the game'.

Btw, where do you get those teams you're talking 'bout? I want them too! I played this weekend and used all the UAVs that I got from the event rewards. But no bonus C-Bills from teammates lurming those spotted targets

So tell me how you walked away from the team all alone in your assault and then found a target and while you tried to kill it in the middle of an open field you got lurmed to death because he targeted you. Because in the current state of the game there's no other way to get killed by lurms then being separated and in the open.

Heck even sticking to the blob would save you from lurms with all the ECM and AMS around you. And on top of that just walk behind a rock or building (that is bigger than you) and wait till the 'Incoming Missile' warning disappears again.

Edit: Just wanted to write in here before the thread goes to K-town

Edited by Norman Kosh, 27 July 2015 - 02:14 AM.

[Joseph Mallan]

Yellonet, on 26 July 2015 - 02:54 PM, said:

The last few days I've been playing in the rain... of missiles.
I'd say that in half the matches I've played recently, LRM boats have been the deciding factor of which team wins the fight.
In some matches there is literally a constant downpour of LRM's, and as ECM is pretty rare and avoiding LRM's in a slow mech is nigh impossible I'd say that right now LRM's are overpowered.

It just makes for very boring gameplay when you spend several minutes getting into position, then all of the sudden a light mech runs past and spots you, then the rain begins and if you're not near some cover you're dead.

Also, AMS isn't all that effective when you have a hundred missiles coming your way.

Using LRM's shouldn't be as easy to use as it is now, just wait for someone to lock a target, then spam away with missiles.

Either ECM should be made available for many more mech models or the use of LRM's should be made more difficult. I'd say that the latter is the better alternative.

My suggestion would be to make LRM's unable to lock on target unless you have either visual contact with the target or if you have visual contact (think of it as a line of sight data link) with the spotter. This would make spotting for LRM boats more of a skill as you will have to have both the LRM boat and the target in light of sight, also positioning of the LRM mech would become more important.

Saturday was the first time in many months that I was killed by Missiles in my Atlas. The enemy was in a good spot, and I could not get to cover fast enough. Missiles are working as intended... If not actually Under Powered.

[Dino Might]

Greenjulius, on 26 July 2015 - 05:01 PM, said:

6.) Speed - If you are getting hit by indirectly fired LRMs and you're in a light, just run at full speed and most will miss you completely. LRMs are terrible against small, fast targets unless they are TAG'd or NARC'd.

This is misleading at best. If you are a small fast light and they still have lock on you, you will get legged in a heartbeat. Not all the missiles have to hit because you have very little armor, and the bogus tracking (few, but severe course corrections) ensures that most will hit your legs.

[Dino Might]

Thunder Child, on 27 July 2015 - 12:24 AM, said:

Dumbkoff, cannot like your post enough. Play what you enjoy using.

DrxAbstract, I'm sorry, I usually try to avoid personal attacks, but you sir, are a Moron.
Lower LRM damage to 0.5? Hell, lets do that. And drop Gauss to 5. Same with PPCs. And nerf their speed so they can't hit lights at all. And Lasers are too strong as well, so lets double the heat and burn time.

The kind of nerfs you are proposing are the sort that would not only make LRMs the absolute worst weapon in the game, but would actually make them so bad that PGI would have to pay people with MC just to use them. Yes, the weapon system needs an overhaul. But if anything, it needs Buffs once the Guidance system has been fixed. Right now, LRMs are a Skill Check. They teach you how to survive the real weapons in this game. They teach you to learn to use cover, they teach you situational awareness, and most importantly they teach you teamwork. All important skills for when you actually start getting good at this game.

I hate to say this, because it always sounds condescending, but most people really aren't as good as they think they are.

Goddamn, I'm starting to sound like a Tryhard. When did that happen....

Not sure if you've faced DrxAbstract, but he's a light guru. The point is, we'd like LRMs to be a bit higher skill capped, and have some more versatility. Increase their capability to lock and hit enemies. Increase the missile speed. This will ensure more rounds on target. To balance this, we need to reduce some of the impact of each hit.

Why do this? Right now, as stated before, LRMs are total feast or famine. You get a good map with good teammates and no enemy ECM, you obliterate everything. You don't get those, you get 50 damage from your small laser and there's nothing much more you can do. What if the latter situation didn't happen? What if ECM bubble didn't cover half the map, and your LRMs flew fast enough to hit the enemy mech that stayed out of cover for 2-3 seconds at a time? The first situation, where the stars have aligned, would still mean you are most effective, but the second situation would no longer mean you are worthless to your team as anything but a test-fire dummy. What is proposed is a set of buffs and corresponding nerfs to normalize the effectiveness of LRMs - as the game is now, it should be an overall improvement on average, because right now, they are subpar on average.

Also...and this is a personal bias - I think it's bullcrap that i can't juke LRMs in my Locust making a full deflection maneuver at 169 kph. They bend 45-90* to come pin my legs regardless of what I do. They should have a limited turn radius, as I stated earlier in the thread in my long quote that it seems nobody bothered to read.

Edited by Dino Might, 27 July 2015 - 02:36 AM.