157 replies to this topic

[Yellonet]

DuoAngel, on 08 August 2015 - 01:55 PM, said:

So? Guess it's not your first eiither

Dat comeback!

[Bishop Steiner]

DuoAngel, on 08 August 2015 - 01:55 PM, said:

So? Guess it's not your first eiither

actually, it is, which is why your comment made zero sense. Lost in translation, I suppose. But then, I don't speak 1337.

[bad arcade kitty]

it's not lost in translation, it's just an unknown to you idiom, he meant that you were a so fat (here it means 'big') troll that your fat flooded his room through his monitor

[Aresye]

Mystere, on 08 August 2015 - 11:29 AM, said:

What is this, another concerted effort to nerf any and all clan goodness?

The way I see it, everybody blubbers their way through the forums by trying to rationalize any possible advantage to a skill and/or lack of skill instead of tackling the actual issues.

I have two feelings on the matter. On one hand, I wish to remain silent on my true feelings on piloting and facing Arctic Cheetahs because I had to listen to a full year of IS pilots bullsh** trying to explain how the Firestarter didn't have messed up hitboxes and it was my inability as a player to have the skill required to deal with them. Not to mention the countless Firestarter rushes in CW that usually managed to either destroy the objective in one wave, or ended up crippling an entire wave of heavies and assaults by the time the majority of them could be taken out. Revenge is a dish best served on a plate you can't touch.

On the other hand, the us vs. them mentality certainly doesn't help, and we would probably be better off if we all banded together to bring attention to the true problems, perhaps being able to have working hitreg and hitboxes for all mechs much sooner?

I just can't bring myself to do the latter. I'm sorry MWO community, but perhaps knowing the Clans would have a very nimble light one day you could have let off the 12 FS9 rushes in CW, or for the comp players, rabidly defending the Firestarter and the worst offenders of the quirkening by attacking the abilities of the players themselves? To you I say:

This will not the fixed quickly...
You will not enjoy this...
The Arctic Cheetah spam will continue until morale improves.

If you are having issues, please utilize the resources available to you to overcome the true root cause of this issue:

[ClanKiller]

I don't want it to be nerfed, it's not the equipment it carries. Just need the hits that hit to count.

Shooting the legs wont do any good if the hits don't register.

[Pezzer]

Ignoring all of the really unnecessary "shoot the legs u noob" posts, I have to agree, the ACH has REALLY messed up hitboxes. I've had people spectate me as I shot one to hell all over the CT/LT. They went from bright yellow to light orange. After 3+ 25-pt alphas. 75 damage to the front ST/CT of a ACH may not kill it, but it should tear the armor open at LEAST, instead of just dinking it.

The ACH is leggable, but the hitboxes for the entire body are messed up. I've seen gauss not register on obvious leg hits too.

[Master Pain]

I find that the arctic cheetah's torsos don't seem to register the damage as well as other light mechs. Its legs seem to register damage better than the rest of the mech for some reason. There was an overheated ach that i hit with 3 alpha shots from my 7 mpls thunderbolt, I shot him in the ct all 3 times and i didn't even crack his armor.

[Excessive Paranoia]

There is definitely something really wrong with the Cheetah hitboxes, including the legs. On more than one occasion I've stopped to deliver a well aimed alpha with 5 medium pulse lasers from 10m-15m away to a bright red leg of a shut down ACH that had absolutely no effect whatsoever. Again, this was stopped and at "you can't miss" range, yet the leg took no damage at all.

Now, as an almost exclusively light pilot, I feel that all lights need to have their hitboxes addressed since they are generally way to hard to hurt, but there is something seriously wrong when a mech has the ability to ignore large amounts of the damage directed at it, well aimed or not...

EDIT: I would also point out that by now everyone who plays regularly has seen an ACH end up as the last mech standing, only to be completely surrounded and attacked by 4-8 mechs and still withstand 30-60 seconds of massed fire all while only slowly getting whittled down. Not even a 100-ton assault can withstand that kind of fire for so long, yet the ACH seems to do it by default. Claiming that this is working as intended is disingenuous to say the least.

Edited by Excessive Paranoia, 08 August 2015 - 05:17 PM.

[Weztside]

Honestly, I've seen this exact same discussion about almost every half way decent light in the game. If it's relevant, people scream hit box issues. If it's irrelevant, people say nothing. I'm willing to bet most of these posts were made after the OP was rekt by an ACH or FS9. Bias to the core. Never mind that HSR and hit reg still aren't perfect and what you are seeing on screen may not represent what is actually happening. Light mechs just amplify the inherent issues of online fps games. Whats killing me is I keep seeing people offer up circumstancial evidence as proof. Two can play at that game. I was once cored instantly through my CT by a DWF in an ACH. Boop, dead. Aiming is clearly OP here. PGI, pls nerf aiming. I've also had my right leg instantly torn off by one alpha from a Timber while in an ACH. Aiming and logic are OP. The ACH being an excellent light mech is clearly another example of PGI sucking at their jobs. There must be something broken here.There is no way they could have noticed that the FS9 has no real challenger and that they could make a ton of money by introducing one behind a pay wall. It's all so painfully ironic. If the ACH sucked people would claim it was dead on arrival. Since its here and it's great people claim it's broken. Your brain is broken. Let's nerf a mech that is shaking up the status quo. Let's add another useless light mech to my garage to collect dust.

Edited by Weztside, 08 August 2015 - 09:32 PM.

[Dino Might]

I'm not sure if there is a hitbox issue, or if it's server hitreg stuff. One thing I do know is that the ACH is a bit OP in its current form. I have them. I've played them. I've hung them up. They get very boring when you can make so many mistakes and still do well. The combination of factors (all of them good) make it a bike with training wheels.

Fast(ish)
Manueverable (+JJs)
ECM
Lots of energy hardpoints
High mounted hardpoints
Swappable omnipods
Small size
Hitboxes make spreading damage easy
Clan XL
Leg durability quirks (most important) along with a few others
Clan range weapons

Literally in every category in the game right now, it has every check mark in the benefit category, and no drawbacks.
You cannot look at that mech and tell me it's not OP. There is no tradeoff anywhere. Heat is the only potential limitation, and that isn't a problem, even running 7 small pulse.

[Sarlic]

I just love these people saying withn a straigt face that AC is fine.

Bet they're going to try to convince you that a straight banana is fine too.

Edited by Sarlic, 08 August 2015 - 11:34 PM.

[Mcgral18]

Sarlic, on 08 August 2015 - 11:34 PM, said:

I just love these people saying withn a straigt face that AC is fine.

Bet they're going to try to convince you that a straight banana is fine too.

I have no more trouble with them than I do Firestarters when it comes to legging them.


You can argue Quirks and be correct, but damage-taking wise, they seem fine. Just remember, they have stronger legs than FS9s because quirks. Weapons are a touch hotter, but 2 points of heat on an alpha? Not noteworthy (also quirks).

Edited by Mcgral18, 09 August 2015 - 12:04 AM.

[Yosharian]

The problem with the Firestarter comparison (which is apt when talking about hitboxes, definitely) is that a Firestarter doesn't come equipped with ECM and Clan XL.

B-b-b-but Firestarters isn't a valid defense of the Cheetah's hitboxes, is all I'm saying.

I think the Cheetah definitely deserves decent hitboxes but they seem too strong at the moment.

The Cheetah is also overquirked in some respects for a Light with so many other strong aspects.

Edited by Yosharian, 09 August 2015 - 12:55 AM.

[smokefield]

they will "look" at the ac "after" people bought a lot of them. at the moment they "need" to be slightly OP otherwise no one would buy a weak light....I mean..who ever would buy mist lynx now ?

[Sjorpha]

I think it's pretty clear that the AC is unbalanced, too strong as compared to other lights, in a few ways. Not sure how much of that is hitvoxes though, it seems to me that light viability is well predicted by looking at things like damage, heat and speed.

The cheetahs are about as strong as I expected them to be, too strong that is, and I wasn't thinking about hitboxes when I made that guess. It was just a very simple conclusion that taking a firestarter and making it better in every way plus adding ECM would be unbalanced.

I'm not denying that there are hitreg issues, and that those are more extreme on some mechs. But I just wanted to point out that the arctic cheetahs are overpowered by stats alone, you don't need any hitbox issues to make that call.

I admit that I like driving them, but it does feels a bit like cheating.

[Excessive Paranoia]

Weztside, on 08 August 2015 - 09:19 PM, said:

Honestly, I've seen this exact same discussion about almost every half way decent light in the game. If it's relevant, people scream hit box issues. If it's irrelevant, people say nothing. I'm willing to bet most of these posts were made after the OP was rekt by an ACH or FS9. Bias to the core. Never mind that HSR and hit reg still aren't perfect and what you are seeing on screen may not represent what is actually happening. Light mechs just amplify the inherent issues of online fps games. Whats killing me is I keep seeing people offer up circumstancial evidence as proof. Two can play at that game. I was once cored instantly through my CT by a DWF in an ACH. Boop, dead. Aiming is clearly OP here. PGI, pls nerf aiming. I've also had my right leg instantly torn off by one alpha from a Timber while in an ACH. Aiming and logic are OP. The ACH being an excellent light mech is clearly another example of PGI sucking at their jobs. There must be something broken here.There is no way they could have noticed that the FS9 has no real challenger and that they could make a ton of money by introducing one behind a pay wall. It's all so painfully ironic. If the ACH sucked people would claim it was dead on arrival. Since its here and it's great people claim it's broken. Your brain is broken. Let's nerf a mech that is shaking up the status quo. Let's add another useless light mech to my garage to collect dust.

Its posts like this that really make me think that many of those defending the ACH really just don't want to lose the advantage their money has bought them. I don't dispute that it should be an effective counter to the FS9, and it really should be a good mech, but it shouldn't be able to absorb the same volume of fire that an assault can take before going down. And for the record, correcting the hitboxes so that a leg or torso actually takes the proper amount of damage when it is hit is NOT a nerf, but rather a fix.

Edited by Excessive Paranoia, 09 August 2015 - 02:00 AM.

[Moldur]

They are 30 tons, not 35. Their arms and legs pop off.

[Excessive Paranoia]

Moldur, on 09 August 2015 - 01:40 AM, said:

They are 30 tons, not 35. Their arms and legs pop off.

When the hits are registered...

[Kiiyor]

Great hitboxes, great maneuverability, great JJ's, small profile, clan XL.

I don't think the ACH is broken. I think it's physical characteristics make it near impossible to concentrate damage into one of it's torsos, (with lasers especially) and remember, with Clan XL engines, you have a mech that's a third again more survivable than a Firestarter. If it's moving, it's essentially immune to huge damage spikes, unless you have a really steady hand, or catch it moving directly away or towards you - and even then, your aim only has to be off by a degree or two to spread damage from one arm to the other.

It still dies to legging (easier than ever with HSR the way it is, in my experience) yet I almost always see them die after someone has stripped every piece of Armour from their torsos first. People really need to learn to aim for the legs.



In the heat of battle, it's easy to attribute the cause of your frustration to a perceived flaw in game mechanics, but In this case, I don't think there is a flaw - it's just well designed.

[FupDup]

Dino Might, on 08 August 2015 - 09:41 PM, said:

Literally in every category in the game right now, it has every check mark in the benefit category, and no drawbacks.
You cannot look at that mech and tell me it's not OP. There is no tradeoff anywhere.

Sort of like the Stormcrow, Timberwolf, Hellbringer, pre-Clans Shadow Hawk...

I guess that its weakness is simply being a light mech instead of being a heavy or assault...which is actually quite significant in today's game.

Edited by FupDup, 09 August 2015 - 04:31 AM.