235 replies to this topic

[Alistair Winter]

I think we should have public player tiers. I have no idea what tier of player I would be, probably somewhere between 2 and 4. Definitely, definitely not a tier 1 player unless they make tier 1 the largest group. But I still want public player tiers.

Why?

• First and foremost, I want to see that the system is working. Just like it's easy to compare the tonnage disparity between teams after a match, I want it to be easy to compare the player tiers between teams. It means I can get upset if my team of twelve tier 4 players were matched up against twelve tier 2 players. But it also means I can be happy if I know for a fact that both teams have a fairly even distribution of skilled players.
  
• It means we'll finally have some empirical evidence that roflstomps are not always a result of individual skills. If matchmaker successfully puts equally skilled players on both teams, blaming everything on your team being morons isn't quite as easy. It will still happen, of course. But not quite as often, I think.
  
• It'll give me a goal to work for. Right now, I keep an eye on my WLR and KDR, because those are the only tangible goals in the endgame. I couldn't care less about mastering all the mechs in the game or getting all the modules. The actual achievement system doesn't work like it's supposed to. Give me a tangible goal! Something in the horizon to keep my eye on in the endless sequence of random matches.
  
• If it turns out to be a disaster, they can always change it! Making public tiers private is most likely done at the click of a button! But I'd rather try it and remove it rather than never seeing it in action, and just hoping that it works the way they tell us.

Yes, I'm sure there will be some elitism. Yes, I'm sure a few tier 1 players will lord it over other players and talk loudly about having to carry tier 2 players. Yes, I'm sure people will bring it up in discussions on the forum. So what?


This is just a video game for adults who still play with robots. This isn't serious business. Who cares if someone insults my skills or your skills? It's just something to do when you're killing time between activities in life that actually matter. It's just a game.

EDIT: Good suggestion, so I'm including it in the OP:

fat4eyes, on 17 August 2015 - 10:22 PM, said:

A lot of good points made here. I'd like to suggest another way of showing transparency of matchmaking while still hiding individual player tiers: In the match lobby, display the count of players per tier instead of showing the tier of each player:

Red team
Tier 1: 1 player
Tier 2: 7 players
Tier 3: 4 players

Blue team
Tier 2: 10 players
Tier 3: 2 players

Edited by Alistair Winter, 18 August 2015 - 05:57 AM.

[FupDup]

Alistair Winter, on 17 August 2015 - 09:21 PM, said:

This isn't serious business.

YES IT IS

[Mystere]

Meh! I'm voting to keep them private ... and then cap the hell out of every game as early as I can. The tears will be so delicious, and the nerd rage from the stat-hos so epic. <maniacal >

Edited by Mystere, 17 August 2015 - 09:25 PM.

[KharnZor]

There is one answer what will make all happy.
Make it opt in/out
That way nobody can argue. Its the only thing that can be done really if PGI is going to seriously consider it.

[slide]

I have to think about this some more.

I am not sure that the benefits you mention will outweigh the potential rage and abuse towards other players and also at PGI for allowing it to happen. Not to mention all the whine threads about "being matched up against player x, how dare MM do that when my PSR is higher/lower than player x".

Privately I don't have an issue knowing what it is, indeed I would like to confirm or deny my own opinion of myself.

Public is a different issue and there are plenty of people on these forums who will simply dismiss you or pick on you for having anything to say simply because your PSR is below their's.

Public PSR might create more conflict than it could solve.

[KharnZor]

slide, on 17 August 2015 - 09:35 PM, said:

I have to think about this some more.

I am not sure that the benefits you mention will outweigh the potential rage and abuse towards other players and also at PGI for allowing it to happen. Not to mention all the whine threads about "being matched up against player x, how dare MM do that when my PSR is higher/lower than player x".

Privately I don't have an issue knowing what it is, indeed I would like to confirm or deny my own opinion of myself.

Public is a different issue and there are plenty of people on these forums who will simply dismiss you or pick on you for having anything to say simply because your PSR is below their's.

Public PSR might create more conflict than it could solve.

You can bet it will. That's why it should be player choice if they want their names out there

[Alistair Winter]

KharnZor, on 17 August 2015 - 09:34 PM, said:

There is one answer what will make all happy.
Make it opt in/out
That way nobody can argue. Its the only thing that can be done really if PGI is going to seriously consider it.

This would remove the most important aspect for me, namely transparency. It means you have no idea what tier your teammates are, or your enemy teammates.

People would still be able to work towards tier 1, which is nice. But I'd like to see the system work first. And if a tidal wave of tears hits Canada, they can let people opt out.

slide, on 17 August 2015 - 09:35 PM, said:

Public is a different issue and there are plenty of people on these forums who will simply dismiss you or pick on you for having anything to say simply because your PSR is below their's.

So what? I don't care if they do. I don't need approval from strangers on the internet. If people are rude on the forum, I add them to my 'ignore' list and I move on.

It's just a game. Who cares?

[KharnZor]

Alistair Winter, on 17 August 2015 - 09:37 PM, said:

This would remove the most important aspect for me, namely transparency. It means you have no idea what tier your teammates are, or your enemy teammates.

People would still be able to work towards tier 1, which is nice. But I'd like to see the system work first. And if a tidal wave of tears hits Canada, they can let people opt out.

I meant opt in/out for public viewing. You should of course be able to view it privately

[Dimento Graven]

KharnZor, on 17 August 2015 - 09:39 PM, said:

I meant opt in/out for public viewing. You should of course be able to view it privately

Totally agree:

You should ALWAYS be able to see it privately, and should be able opt in or out for public viewing, AND, I did not know that moose collisions were so prevalent in Canada, thank you for the info.

[Kiiyor]

I dunno... I'm predicting a rash of "you can't comment on this, you tier 3 scrub" arguments in threads, or "you can't comment on this mr tier 1, you're the 1%".

I'm not sure.

[Alistair Winter]

Kiiyor, on 17 August 2015 - 09:48 PM, said:

I dunno... I'm predicting a rash of "you can't comment on this, you tier 3 scrub" arguments in threads, or "you can't comment on this mr tier 1, you're the 1%".

I'm not sure.

At this point, I'm starting to wonder if the biggest problem is the small number of trolls or the vast majority of really sensitive people who get offended when someone insults their skills in video games.

The weird part is that most of the people on the MWO forum are adults. I don't get how anyone is so afraid of being called a tier 3 scrub by someone on the internet.

[KharnZor]

Alistair Winter, on 17 August 2015 - 09:50 PM, said:

At this point, I'm starting to wonder if the biggest problem is the small number of trolls or the vast majority of really sensitive people who get offended when someone insults their skills in video games.

The weird part is that most of the people on the MWO forum are adults. I don't get how anyone is so afraid of being called a tier 3 scrub by someone on the internet.

Because its the internet and everyone knows internet robots are serious business.

[Dimento Graven]

Kiiyor, on 17 August 2015 - 09:48 PM, said:

I dunno... I'm predicting a rash of &quot;you can't comment on this, you tier 3 scrub&quot; arguments in threads, or &quot;you can't comment on this mr tier 1, you're the 1%&quot;.

I'm not sure.

That won't ALWAYS be an invalid argument however...

[Kiiyor]

Alistair Winter, on 17 August 2015 - 09:50 PM, said:

At this point, I'm starting to wonder if the biggest problem is the small number of trolls or the vast majority of really sensitive people who get offended when someone insults their skills in video games.

The weird part is that most of the people on the MWO forum are adults. I don't get how anyone is so afraid of being called a tier 3 scrub by someone on the internet.

I'm not afraid of it, i'm just aware of the nature of the vocal minority.

I know we shouldn't be building for the lowest common denominator, but the thought of some of the ultratrolls getting their cheeto dust stained mitts on more ammunition gives me pause.

I'm an adult, and I'm fairly certain I have a fairly thick skin (I pilot Awesomes, lol), but many other players don't.

[Felbombling]

XVM in World of Tanks has helped to create a very toxic environment, which is basically a program that displays number of games played, winning percentage and a scoring system 'score' of sorts in the form of a Win8 rating. The only thing I can say it has brought to the game is a rash of insults BEFORE the games even start. The elitism is extraordinary in some matches... before, during and after. I like to think this community is different in a good way, but I'm probably kidding myself.

I'd like to know my score, but I think we should strive to keep it as an opt in/out option for the players.

[Kiiyor]

Dimento Graven, on 17 August 2015 - 09:55 PM, said:

That won't ALWAYS be an invalid argument however...

True, but I'd rather someone be attacked based on the merits of their argument than be dismissed offhand based on their skill rating.

[Dimento Graven]

Kiiyor, on 17 August 2015 - 10:00 PM, said:

True, but I'd rather someone be attacked based on the merits of their argument than be dismissed offhand based on their skill rating.

I understand the concern, but sometimes the merits of the argument from someone who is unable to show expertise is questionable.

If an argument has actual merit, it will stand on its own regardless of the skill ranking of the individual making it.

[Alistair Winter]

Kiiyor, on 17 August 2015 - 09:58 PM, said:

I'm not afraid of it, i'm just aware of the nature of the vocal minority.

I know we shouldn't be building for the lowest common denominator, but the thought of some of the ultratrolls getting their cheeto dust stained mitts on more ammunition gives me pause.

I'm an adult, and I'm fairly certain I have a fairly thick skin (I pilot Awesomes, lol), but many other players don't.

But as a man of science, think of the data!

The data!

[Dimento Graven]

StaggerCheck, on 17 August 2015 - 09:59 PM, said:

XVM in World of Tanks has helped to create a very toxic environment, which is basically a program that displays number of games played, winning percentage and a scoring system 'score' of sorts in the form of a Win8 rating. The only thing I can say it has brought to the game is a rash of insults BEFORE the games even start. The elitism is extraordinary in some matches... before, during and after. I like to think this community is different in a good way, but I'm probably kidding myself.

I'd like to know my score, but I think we should strive to keep it as an opt in/out option for the players.

MWO has something similar, it's only private, but anyone can create a custom screenshot link showing the values of whatever it is...

Kiiyor, on 17 August 2015 - 09:58 PM, said:

...

I'm an adult, and I'm fairly certain I have a fairly thick skin (I pilot Awesomes, lol), but many other players don't.

And it's those 'thin skinned' individuals that should never visit ANY internet forum EVER!

If you have thin skin, and aren't capable of giving at least as good as you get, STAY AWAY, stay VERY FAR away...

[El Bandito]

I have no issue with public display of my skill rating. I have survived the madness of pug queue and beaten the MM. I have nothing to fear.