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Man, Bt Characters Are Such Noobs. (¬_¬)

Balance Gameplay Skills

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#1 El Bandito

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Posted 09 August 2015 - 03:35 AM

Can't even alpha in the same place at 200 meters. They really should L2P. :ph34r:

From "Blood Legacy" by Michael A. Stackpole

Quote

As dark smoke poured from the hole in the Executioner's chest, Phelan leaped his 'Mech up onto the ridge line he'd been using for cover to bring his autocannon into play. Vlad turned his 'Mech to meet Phelan head-on. Without a second's hesitation, all weapons oriented on their targets. At 200 meters, the two warriors let everything fly.

Phelan's paired flights of missiles shot from the Lone Wolf's shoulders, drawing gray contrail lines in the air. Missiles chipped away at the armor over the Executioner's heart and blasted armor from its right leg. More missiles poured through the hole in its right side and yet others chopped into the armor at the 'Mech's left shoulder.

Bracketed by the missile tracks, the trio of pulse lasers found their target easily. One drilled a hole through the Executioner's right arm, evaporating its last armor. The second sent a stream of molten ceramic coursing down the 'Mech's left leg. The last blasted a staggered line of holes down the 'Mech's face in a crude parody of Vlad's own scar.

Phelan's autocannon tracked poorly and ripped away all but the last bit of armor on the Executioner's right leg. The Gauss rifle's argent sphere pulverized the armor on the 'Mech's left arm, sending jagged sheets of it to the sand. Though the fire laid much of the arm bare, it did not destroy the Executioner's own Gauss rifle.

Vlad's return fire rattled and shook the Lone Wolf, leaving Phelan feeling like a rock being shaken in a tin can. The first Gauss rifle slug blasted into the Lone Wolf's left arm, snapping the limb off at the elbow and spinning the 'Mech to the left. Phelan's Gauss rifle careened off to explode down in the trench he'd previously used for cover.

With his altered priorities in place, the Executioner's battle computer cycled through his lasers before it got to his remaining Gauss rifle. The pulse laser in the shattered right breast stitched a half-dozen steaming holes in the Lone Wolf's right leg. The other two pulse lasers both melted a deep hole in Phelan's right flank. The Executioner's large laser lanced its red beam through the left side of the Lone Wolf's chest as Phelan brought his machine back under control and turned it to face Vlad.

The Executioner's right-arm Gauss rifle spat out a hunk of metal about thirty centimeters in diameter. Nothing more than a silver blur, it shot straight into the middle of the Lone Wolf's chest. Phelan's teeth smashed together as the whole torso pitched up, jamming him down into the command couch.


Then again, "Both combatants had alphaed each other's CT and cored it", would have been too short. :P

Edited by El Bandito, 09 August 2015 - 06:47 PM.


#2 stjobe

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Posted 09 August 2015 - 03:57 AM

Clearly those two were no-skill steering-wheel underhive scrubs, not elite Merc Corp CW-warriors, or their weapons would all have converged instantly.

But seriously yeah. It's saddening how far from "a BattleTech game" this game is. And infuriating that it seems to only get further and further instead of at least trying to get closer.

No heat penalties except shutting down at 100%.
Instant convergence.
Pin-point accuracy.
ECM being totally bass-ackwards.
1/3 of weapons being FLD, 2/3 spreading their damage, 1/3 of which are hard-countered by ECM.
Modules, quirks, and Ghost Heat to try unsuccessfully to combat the above points.

#3 Hit the Deck

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Posted 09 August 2015 - 04:21 AM

Quote: The Executioner's right-arm Gauss rifle spat out a hunk of metal about thirty centimeters in diameter.

That's naval gun's territory. Stackpole can't into physics?

Edited by Hit the Deck, 09 August 2015 - 04:22 AM.


#4 Paigan

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Posted 09 August 2015 - 04:26 AM

View PostHit the Deck, on 09 August 2015 - 04:21 AM, said:

Quote: The Executioner's right-arm Gauss rifle spat out a hunk of metal about thirty centimeters in diameter.

That's naval gun's territory. Stackpole can't into physics?

The average SciFi author has no idea what he's talking about.
E.g. thinking that "bigger" lasers are more powerful (similar with gauss projectiles), etc.

Also a stick to aim weapons is ridiculous, etc etc.


Oh and while I'm at it: the whole idea of Mechs per se. But that's another story...

Edited by Paigan, 09 August 2015 - 04:26 AM.


#5 FupDup

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Posted 09 August 2015 - 04:28 AM

This is what those book pilots looked like during battle:

Posted Image

Edited by FupDup, 09 August 2015 - 04:29 AM.


#6 bad arcade kitty

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Posted 09 August 2015 - 04:39 AM

View PostHit the Deck, on 09 August 2015 - 04:21 AM, said:

Quote: The Executioner's right-arm Gauss rifle spat out a hunk of metal about thirty centimeters in diameter.

That's naval gun's territory. Stackpole can't into physics?


stackpole hates clans and cannot into the plot

anyway it's an accurate number, that's from thurston's jade falcon trilogy

The Mad Dog was under no such constraints. It carried only two weapons, Gauss cannons that would spit out a melon-sized ball of hardened steel at Mach 2 every ten seconds.

#7 LORD ORION

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Posted 09 August 2015 - 04:56 AM

Hi... I'm your targeting computer

Posted Image

Edited by LORD ORION, 09 August 2015 - 04:56 AM.


#8 Jman5

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Posted 09 August 2015 - 05:14 AM

You guys laugh, but I bet if you slowed down and did a blow by blow analysis, this isn't far from the truth. Except instead of hitting one component with your laser blast, you hit three.

#9 Kiiyor

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Posted 09 August 2015 - 05:23 AM

View PostHit the Deck, on 09 August 2015 - 04:21 AM, said:

Quote: The Executioner's right-arm Gauss rifle spat out a hunk of metal about thirty centimeters in diameter.

That's naval gun's territory. Stackpole can't into physics?


He IS into physics - the wrong ones.

"Phelan urged his mech forwards, but his venerable war machine stood on some moderately soft ground and was left flailing as it sank to the knees".

Real physics aren't nearly as dramatic, but I feel as though they are missing an attempt at comedy.

"His Gauss rifle spat out a hunk of metal about half the size of a pinky finger. After it punched through the chest of the enemy mech in front of him, it continued through the mountain behind that and decapitated a local law enforcement officer."

#10 bad arcade kitty

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Posted 09 August 2015 - 05:25 AM

View Postgh0s7m3rc, on 09 August 2015 - 04:56 AM, said:

Phelan should've customized his mech according to meta... :lol:


i would love to see the face of felan when his beloved wolfhound would meet a streakcrow :3

#11 El Bandito

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Posted 09 August 2015 - 05:48 AM

View PostJman5, on 09 August 2015 - 05:14 AM, said:

You guys laugh, but I bet if you slowed down and did a blow by blow analysis, this isn't far from the truth. Except instead of hitting one component with your laser blast, you hit three.


They didn't even torso twist or arm block. Such noobs. :P

In MWO though, magic happens.

Edited by El Bandito, 09 August 2015 - 05:51 AM.


#12 Kiiyor

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Posted 09 August 2015 - 06:06 AM

View Postbad arcade kitty, on 09 August 2015 - 05:25 AM, said:


i would love to see the face of felan when his beloved wolfhound would meet a streakcrow :3


Or any mech with a 30+ point alpha. The books would have been WAAAAAAAY different.

Way of the Clans, by Robert Thurston said:


Aidan maneuvered his 'Mech a step backward and to the right. His instinct proved correct, as Peri's first shots went wide to the left. He had no time to instruct his computer to calibrate, but he suspected those shots would have missed him even if he had kept his 'Mech standing still.

Crashing into his ears like an attack vehicle came Joanna's voice: "Poor start, the two of you. These are awesome machines, even ones as light and stripped-down as these. You can do better. Cadet Peri, use some sense. Do not shoot for the mere sake of shooting. Cadet Aidan, I do not want to see any strategic retreats. That is not the way of the Clan. Not until all aggressive tactics have been tried."

Aidan took her words to heart, and throttled his mech forward towards his enemy. His opponent's weapons finished cycling first however, and before Aidan could register surprise, a comically large hole appeared in the center torso of his machine, before both arms detached and windmilled spectacularly through the air. His last view was of the ground hurtling towards his cockpit, before the impact drove his consciousness away in a shower of sparks and confusion.

Ter Roshak leaned in towards a stunned looking Joanna. "I told you things had changed since closed beta. It's all about the Alpha."
He chuckled derisively at her confusion and slapped some shades on his face, before turning away.
"Remind me to fit your mech with a steering wheel, n00b."



#13 bad arcade kitty

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Posted 09 August 2015 - 06:15 AM

View PostKiiyor, on 09 August 2015 - 06:06 AM, said:


Or any mech with a 30+ point alpha. The books would have been WAAAAAAAY different.


well, afaik streakcrows don't even break the rules of tt unlike pinpoint alphas :ph34r:

#14 Fate 6

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Posted 09 August 2015 - 07:37 AM

Of course BT characters are noobs. They are piloting massive robots that should, because of their density, float. Anyone intelligent would drive a tank.

#15 dario03

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Posted 09 August 2015 - 07:40 AM

Even if they did alpha the same spot they wouldn't do much. Just look at some examples of stock builds...such pro, much wow...

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...b#i=144&l=stock
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...ab#i=11&l=stock
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...ab#i=37&l=stock
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...ab#i=53&l=stock

Then again looking at that impressive stock armor without it being doubled, maybe those mechs should crumble to the ground from a slight breeze...

Edited by dario03, 09 August 2015 - 07:46 AM.


#16 -Vompo-

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Posted 09 August 2015 - 07:41 AM

From what that story tells us they probably should start throwing stones so they would actually hit what they are aiming for.

This is probably again one of those increase ttk threads in disguise or it is a harmless joke about how ridiculously inaccurate the mechs are in the books. If it is about ttk I don't want us to have every fight determined by rng alone. If we cannot control whether we hit a leg or the head from 200m what's the point of having players do any of the shooting in the first place. We could just run around while ai would do all the shooting for us.

Edited by VompoVompatti, 09 August 2015 - 07:43 AM.


#17 Gas Guzzler

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Posted 09 August 2015 - 07:52 AM

Yes, sci-fi book fluff totally applicable to an FPS.

That would be like saying Gandalf should only use worth while magic like 3 times in a lord of the rings game because he barely ever does in the books.

Also all those star wars games full of "dark jedi". What the hell is that crap? There is only supposed to be 2 sith lords. But what would be the fun in that if you couldn't fight lightsaber wielding opponents all the time.

#18 El Bandito

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Posted 09 August 2015 - 08:03 AM

View PostVompoVompatti, on 09 August 2015 - 07:41 AM, said:

From what that story tells us they probably should start throwing stones so they would actually hit what they are aiming for.

This is probably again one of those increase ttk threads in disguise or it is a harmless joke about how ridiculously inaccurate the mechs are in the books. If it is about ttk I don't want us to have every fight determined by rng alone. If we cannot control whether we hit a leg or the head from 200m what's the point of having players do any of the shooting in the first place. We could just run around while ai would do all the shooting for us.


Personal preferences aside, RNG--especially controlled RNG with delayed convergence--will not actually affect skill all that much. In every popular game with RNG, no matter the type--be it TCG, TT, FPS, RPG, MOBA, skilled player will always perform better than non-skilled ones.

The non-skilled ones actually tend to cry about RNG the loudest.

Edited by El Bandito, 09 August 2015 - 08:10 AM.


#19 Ano

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Posted 09 August 2015 - 08:03 AM

View Poststjobe, on 09 August 2015 - 03:57 AM, said:

But seriously yeah. It's saddening how far from "a BattleTech game" this game is. And infuriating that it seems to only get further and further instead of at least trying to get closer.


I know there are lots of things which could be better, but do you geniuinely think the game would be better if, having locked your crosshairs over your opponent's CT at 200m, you hit your alphastrike shortcut and your ordinance went flying randomly in all directions?

Convergence taking some time to ... er ... converge (as I believe it did way back in beta, which I wasn't a part of) seems like something that I wouldn't mind experimenting with -- given that I wasn't around when it was a thing. But having my weapons just fire here, there and everywhere even AFTER I'd allowed the necessary time for aiming and "convergence" sounds like something I'd find hugely frustrating, personally.

#20 -Vompo-

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Posted 09 August 2015 - 08:11 AM

View PostEl Bandito, on 09 August 2015 - 08:03 AM, said:



RNG, especially controlled RNG will not actually affect skill all that much. In every popular game with RNG, no matter the type--be it TCG, TT, FPS, RPG, skilled player will always perform better than non-skilled ones.

It is the non-skilled ones tend to cry about RNG the loudest.


Having next to no level of control where your shots will land is not something I'd call controlled rng. 200m in this game is almost touching distance and shots hit legs, arms and torso without some crazy evasive action is not controlled.

Of course skilled players would do better than bad but luck would start playing such a major role in the fights that it would be just sad. Also if we wish to hit all over a mech from 200m we are lucky to hit a city block from 1000m. You'd might hit a friendly standing 200m from the enemy you are firing at.





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