170 replies to this topic

[Pjwned]

Bishop Steiner, on 02 September 2015 - 02:44 PM, said:

so..where does he tell us to form a player council, again? Also.... I've been waiting for over a year for the community to actually agree on anything about ECM. I'm sure Russ is too.

It's not our god damn job to balance the game, whereas it literally is in the case of PGI staff, so if Russ (or Paul) actually is waiting for the community to agree on something (which serves as an excuse to do absolutely nothing?) then that sure sounds like he's not doing his damn job.

Aside from that, many people agree that ECM is overpowered, and most of the indecisiveness is exactly how to nerf it, although a lot of people (read: mostly scrubs & bads) will also bring LRMs into it even though the only change they need is to not be hard countered by the jesus box.

Edited by Pjwned, 02 September 2015 - 03:02 PM.

[Livewyr]

Commentary on the MWO player base:

Post an idea for discussion to address an issue in the game; get maybe 15 views over an hour.
Post an (ultimately pointless) angry rant; get 8 viewers within a minute, and a response within 5.

[Bishop Steiner]

Pjwned, on 02 September 2015 - 02:59 PM, said:

It's not our god damn job to balance the game, whereas it literally is in the case of PGI staff, so if Russ (or Paul) actually is waiting for the community to agree on something (which serves as an excuse to do absolutely nothing?) then that sure sounds like he's not doing his damn job.

Aside from that, many people agree that ECM is overpowered, and most of the indecisiveness isexactly how to nerf it, although a lot of people (read: mostly scrubs & bads) will also bring LRMs into it even though the only change they need is to not be hard countered by the jesus box.

Does that address any of the points I made, or the OP, even? I'm pointing out flaws in the allegations. Don't shoot the messenger.

Most people do agree that. Not what is being discussed.

Also, as for who job it is.....the sainted Forumites in question insisted, along with their cult of jocksniffers, they could do it better. Russ called them out on it.

Edited by Bishop Steiner, 02 September 2015 - 03:06 PM.

[Deathlike]

Livewyr, on 02 September 2015 - 03:01 PM, said:

Commentary on the MWO player base:

Post an idea for discussion to address an issue in the game; get maybe 15 views over an hour.
Post an (ultimately pointless) angry rant; get 8 viewers within a minute, and a response within 5.

You knew this was coming...

Welcome to MWO.

[XxXAbsolutZeroXxX]

Livewyr, on 02 September 2015 - 02:53 PM, said:

They take it a step further with RNG. Ever have a shell hit where you were pointed? (Even at close range...)

Livewyr, the topic here is reticle sway.

Why are you talking about collision detection? There's no connection between these two topics that makes sense here.

That's my main issue with some of the naysayers. Their entire perspective seems based around avoiding facts rather than addressing them. If someone brings up a relevent point that contradicts something you said, you try to change the topic rather than respond in some misguided and irrational forum of circular logic.

The relevent point here is its not that hard to engineer a mechanism that elevates or depresses a gun barrel in response to changing altitude and orientation of a mech or battleship eliminating reticle sway to some degree. From an engineering perspective your claim that reticle sway should exist is purely arbitrary.

Will you respond to this honestly, or will you try to change the topic to el nino, sasquatches in nigeria, camel brokers in canada, hit detection or something that is completely irrelevent to get around the fact that nothing you said in your OP is valid, and you yourself don't care enough to make a legitimate effort to keep yourself informed or educated on the topics you try to discuss on these forums?

This is why I wish Russ and PGI would ignore the forums completely. When they show that they pay attention to what people here say, Livewyr and the other crazies *suddenly* become active again and ruin the forums with their whargarbl.

Edited by I Zeratul I, 02 September 2015 - 03:09 PM.

[Livewyr]

Bishop Steiner, on 02 September 2015 - 02:59 PM, said:

Your propaganda is flawed. We had a small number of self appointed jock sniffers lapping up Roland's slop, along with a few other vague proposals (Roland's was most detailed, yet when questioned about several flaws, the Diva mentality came to light instead of answers)

A handful of Forumwarriors appointing themselves spokepeople for the community ain't a community council.

Try again, counselor.

The reason we were contacting Russ was so he could set up a Poll to select the council from the various volunteers. (You know, since PGI decided polls were a bad idea in a **** game.

(Not all of us agreed with Roland's, or Homeless's ideas... including me.)

You sound very bitter about the whole affair...

[Bishop Steiner]

Guessing you weren't getting enough action ranting on Reddit? Could always go back to playing Star Citizen I suppose.....oh ....wait. OK, well there's always the MWO Rant section on their forums. Enjoy.

[Odium]

Most of what OP said is true and I feel the same about many of the points. There are good things about this game though. All games have good and bad. Once the bad starts to outweigh the good then it is time to move on.

Most of these Free to Play game companies, PGI especially, seem to move very slow to actually fix things. I am not sure what the deal is. Steam, Blizzard, and other top companies seem to get stuff fixed much faster. I admit of course they can throw money at a problem but even still PGI seems to move at a snails pace.

[Livewyr]

Deathlike, on 02 September 2015 - 03:03 PM, said:

You knew this was coming...

Welcome to MWO.

Of course I knew it was coming, why do you think I did it? (Doesn't improve my health at all... must have been for the amusement. )

[Bishop Steiner]

Livewyr, on 02 September 2015 - 03:04 PM, said:

You sound very bitter about the whole affair...

LOL.

Might want to go reread your OP, champ.

[Wintersdark]

Livewyr, on 02 September 2015 - 02:34 PM, said:

I had a much longer, much more venomous post written up, but the browser crashed... how fortunate.

So here you are.

Quirks: As expected, they created a series of must have mechs, reduced variety drastically, and reduced TTK (unless you were one of the super quirked ones with 30-80 additional hit points)

Good thing they're being stripped out and redone this month.

Quote

Knock downs: The lack of these are what cause light mechs to just leave the throttle open regardless of anything, giving them all of the advantages of speed (hard target, lag shield, engagement range control, etc...) without any of the risks (what happens to any metal construct that runs into a mountainside or another metal construct traveling 95 miles per hour.)
Arcade Level: Call of Duty

A problem, and if lights where dominating the queues it'd be a big one. As its stands, just an immersion disappointment.

Quote

Convergence: Mechs look like they are pounding ground (shoulders move and everything) and yet the lasers and guns all perfectly line up with with the reticle at all. Even Call of Duty and Battlefield have weapon sway tied to movement, can you not even do a reticle sway?

A definite issue. Convergence is and has been forever a huge problem! With that said, everyone has different ideas of how it should work, so that's no help.

Quote

Economy: This game economy makes no sense. There is no spending required, only surplus gain. (The rate of gain being too good or poor depends on the patience of the individual.)
A socialist's wet dream: Doing whatever you want, with no costs. (Really Free!)
People are going to run out of things to buy.

Its not great, but not bad either. Run out of things to buy? I buy mechs with real money all the time, and never have anywhere near enough c-bills... And I've been playing since 2012.

Quote

Advancement: There is little advancement in this game.
New Player:
You pick a mech. (ANY MECH YOU CAN PAY FOR)
You get it to standard. (Mastered efficiency)
Veteran player:
You pick a mech. (ANY MECH YOU CAN PAY FOR)
You get it to standard. (Mastered efficiency
)Can you spot the difference?

And this is one of the best things about MWO.

Losing in a PvP game to someone not because he's better than you, but simply because he's played longer sucks... And power through play time would benefit me. I LIKE how anplayer can go from brand new to 100% of non-skill based effectiveness in a reasonably short time.

This is exactly as it should be. Want to win? Win by being better, not by some crutch.

Quote

Community Warfare Title, now with mechbays!: And if I don't?

Community Warfare:
No reason to take planets.
No map variety. (Left, right, or maybe middle gate.)
No Diplomacy. (-MS- chooses faction based on the mechbays at level 6, or a whim.)
Boils down to a public queue with pure-tech dropship game mode.

CW does need more.

Quote

ECM: This abomination is an "information warfare" god mode, with on/off switches.
On:
Attaching it to your mech.
Having more around than the counters.
Off:
BAP (more than ECMs)
TAG (facetank them, with a red line leading back to you.)
NARC (hope there is only one ECM)

Information Warfare:
Have ECMs (or have more ECMs than the enemy.)
Blob around until you find them.

I don't think anyone thinks ECM and infowar are good. Russ doesn't think they are good. But again, there is zero consensus on what to do to improve it.

Quote

LRMs: Feast or Famine
Feast:
No cover within 200 meters.
No ECM. (Or more local BAP than their ECM)
Target is potato.
Famine:
Cover available.
Target has ECM (or multiple ECMs)
Target is not potato.

Yeah, LRMs are pooched because infowar is pooched.

I wonder if PGI is looking at overhauling info war with their talk of sensor changes on the rebalance?

Quote

I could go on, but I think I'll end with this:
I've offered comprehensive suggestions to tackle all of these issues. I've seen dozens, if not hundreds of reasonable suggestions for fixing these issues- however if it is not easy, or within the warped vision of the creator (ECM) it is just swept under the rug as though it will go away.


Russ Bullock, I've not forgotten the player council you promised almost a year ago. It is pity that you have.
http://mwomercs.com/...64#entry3715964

Player council was never promised. Russ said he'd listen if there was player consensus on what to do. There isn't, and hasn't been.

Your suggestions are as meaningless as everyone else's. What makes you right and them wrong? It's good for discussion, but you can't expect PGI to follow your posts in particular and jump to do everything you suggest.

I'd wait till after the changes this month before ranting excessively.

[KharnZor]

Livewyr, on 02 September 2015 - 03:01 PM, said:

Commentary on the MWO player base:

Post an idea for discussion to address an issue in the game; get maybe 15 views over an hour.
Post an (ultimately pointless) angry rant; get 8 viewers within a minute, and a response within 5.

I remember your ham fisted crusade against ecm. You didn't care who you shat on in your quest to jam your opinion down everyone's throat.
But by all means continue to post garbage like in the quote there, i'm sure you'll be taken seriously by some poor sod

[Vlad Ward]

Couldn't get past the "Quirks reduced Mech variety" line. Pity that was right at the top.

Before quirks, there was 1 best Mech. Maybe it was Cataphract. Maybe it was Highlander. Maybe it was Victory. It depends on what patch version you're playing on. Comp games consisted of putting those Mechs, and as many mini-versions of those Mechs on a team as possible (to meet league weight restrictions).

After quirks, there are several comparable Mechs. Some trade better hitboxes for better weapon efficiency. Overall they're pretty similar. Most important thing is there is more than one of them.

Quirks were the best thing this game has ever done to encourage build variety at the competitive level.

Also community council was an awful idea. So glad that didn't go anywhere. This is coming from a bona fide forum hero, too.

[Bishop Steiner]

Wintersdark, on 02 September 2015 - 03:05 PM, said:

Good thing they're being stripped out and redone this month.

A problem, and if lights where dominating the queues it'd be a big one. As its stands, just an immersion disappointment.

A definite issue. Convergence is and has been forever a huge problem! With that said, everyone has different ideas of how it should work, so that's no help.

Its not great, but not bad either. Run out of things to buy? I buy mechs with real money all the time, and never have anywhere near enough c-bills... And I've been playing since 2012.


And this is one of the best things about MWO.

Losing in a PvP game to someone not because he's better than you, but simply because he's played longer sucks... And power through play time would benefit me. I LIKE how anplayer can go from brand new to 100% of non-skill based effectiveness in a reasonably short time.

This is exactly as it should be. Want to win? Win by being better, not by some crutch.

CW does need more.


I don't think anyone thinks ECM and infowar are good. Russ doesn't think they are good. But again, there is zero consensus on what to do to improve it.

Yeah, LRMs are pooched because infowar is pooched.

I wonder if PGI is looking at overhauling info war with their talk of sensor changes on the rebalance?



Player council was never promised. Russ said he'd listen if there was player consensus on what to do. There isn't, and hasn't been.

Your suggestions are as meaningless as everyone else's. What makes you right and them wrong? It's good for discussion, but you can't expect PGI to follow your posts in particular and jump to do everything you suggest.

I'd wait till after the changes this month before ranting excessively.

pssssst...don't confuse things with facts and logic.

[Elizander]

Bishop Steiner, on 02 September 2015 - 03:04 PM, said:

Guessing you weren't getting enough action ranting on Reddit? Could always go back to playing Star Citizen I suppose.....oh ....wait. OK, well there's always the MWO Rant section on their forums. Enjoy.

Didn't they shut that down?

[Evan20k]

[Bishop Steiner]

Elizander, on 02 September 2015 - 03:08 PM, said:

Didn't they shut that down?

did they finally? I stopped visiting it after a while, the amusement factor of the idiocy had a short self life. Much like this topic, lol.

[Deathlike]

Elizander, on 02 September 2015 - 03:08 PM, said:

Didn't they shut that down?

You cannot actually post anything MWO related there.

[Alistair Winter]

I agree with most of the stuff in the OP. But I still think this is a good game.

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[Livewyr]

Wintersdark, on 02 September 2015 - 03:05 PM, said:

Player council was never promised. Russ said he'd listen if there was player consensus on what to do. There isn't, and hasn't been.

Considering PGI removed the ability to create polls... how was there supposed to be a consensus on anything? Hard to hammer out an agreement when you do not have the tools to start with...

Huge oversight? Diabolical plot? You decide.

Wintersdark, on 02 September 2015 - 03:05 PM, said:

Your suggestions are as meaningless as everyone else's. What makes you right and them wrong? It's good for discussion, but you can't expect PGI to follow your posts in particular and jump to do everything you suggest.

I'm guessing you read too hastily to catch this part:
"I've offered comprehensive suggestions to tackle all of these issues. I've seen dozens, if not hundreds of reasonable suggestions for fixing these issues-..."