131 replies to this topic

[Raggedyman]

Mister Blastman, on 18 September 2015 - 07:15 AM, said:

You gotta be a total jerk to report someone for calling out the co-ordinates of someone that purposefully shut down to drag the clock out several minutes just to avoid dying.

Becoming a jerk to deal with a jerk increases, not decreases, the amount of jerkyness
It may very briefly make you feel groovy but it sets a precedent of 'jerky behavior is acceptable if you can justify it, even if it's against the TOC"
You're basically going through the same mental process as the jerk that powered down has done

Two wrong do not make a right
Two jerks does not decrease the amount of jerks
Two breaches of the TOS and Code of Conduct do not help make the game a better place

If you see it then report it, and be patient.
Find them, kill them, next round.

[Mudhutwarrior]

Mister Blastman, on 18 September 2015 - 11:37 AM, said:

You bet I'm one of the 64. Do you not remember what you said? The sixty four. We all know what you meant by that. You bet--I anted up. And now you are trying to back out of the bet. Do not dare make such reckless, serious accusations if you aren't willing to own up and stand by them. Ante up or cease immediately.

I bet based on the leader of the 66ah who was a big time poster here and always took the same position you did. Just following along with very similar patterns of posting. As I cannot prove you are and you cannot prove your not. You argument is a ridiculous diversion from the facts of your own posting. You do not care about the rules and will twist them then justify it as needed. That is one step away from the poster from 66ah who felt the same as you do on this subject. He could decide not PGI. He found out that wasn't the case. Who is next?

[Raggedyman]

Mister Blastman, on 18 September 2015 - 07:53 AM, said:

It is one thing if the last pilot tries to flank, never shuts down and picks off the enemy one by one--it is another to run off and hide like a coward. Moderation action or not, reporting their position is the only honorable outcome to deal with cowardice. Dishonor is not met with honor.

You're argument is that powering down wastes the manys time.
Fine, lets roll with that.
If someone is wasting the majorities time then it's okay to give out the co-ordinates
Agreed?

Cool.

Except that the example of one last guy taking on the enemy team is seen by many as wasting time, as they are unlikely to win. So their co-ordinates get given out, using your own reasoning.
I've seen it happen again and again and again.
Each time the thought process given is "they are wasting our time so we can break the CoC"

[Mister Blastman]

Mudhutwarrior, on 18 September 2015 - 11:44 AM, said:

I bet based on the leader of the 66ah who was a big time poster here and always took the same position you did. Just following along with very similar patterns of posting. As I cannot prove you are and you cannot prove your not. You argument is a ridiculous diversion from the facts of your own posting. You do not care about the rules and will twist them then justify it as needed. That is one step away from the poster from 66ah who felt the same as you do on this subject. He could decide not PGI. He found out that wasn't the case. Who is next?

You are walking a thin line, Sir. Throw your coin in the pot. We can prove it when the next sixty four come out. If I'm not on the list, I win and you pay up. If I am--well, then you're rich.

I know I won't be. Your turn. Put your coin where your big mouth is.

With all the medical debt my family is in I could use it right about now.

Raggedyman, on 18 September 2015 - 11:46 AM, said:

You're argument is that powering down wastes the manys time.
Fine, lets roll with that.
If someone is wasting the majorities time then it's okay to give out the co-ordinates
Agreed?

Cool.

Except that the example of one last guy taking on the enemy team is seen by many as wasting time, as they are unlikely to win. So their co-ordinates get given out, using your own reasoning.
I've seen it happen again and again and again.
Each time the thought process given is "they are wasting our time so we can break the CoC"

I never said give out co-ordinates of someone fighting. If you bothered to read everything I said in this thread--some of it full of illustration--you would see I never once have advocated such a thing.

However... cowards that shut down... that's a different story altogether. I'm not saying "I" do it, I'm arguing "for" it.

[Mudhutwarrior]

Mister Blastman, on 18 September 2015 - 11:47 AM, said:

You are walking a thin line, Sir. Throw your coin in the pot. We can prove it when the next sixty four come out. If I'm not on the list, I win and you pay up. If I am--well, then you're rich.

I know I won't be. Your turn. Put your coin where your big mouth is.

With all the medical debt my family is in I could use it right about now.

Sorry for your troubles and I hope your family get's relief. For the rest I am relying on your own posts as I am sure anyone else who reads this thread will too. You admitted and defended breaking the rules at your discretion. Let your character speak for you rather than finding a place to play victim status as cover. Nuff said.

[MechWarrior5152251]

I will always report the dikc's position.

[Raggedyman]

Mister Blastman, on 18 September 2015 - 11:48 AM, said:

I never said give out co-ordinates of someone fighting. If you bothered to read everything I said in this thread--some of it full of illustration--you would see I never once have advocated such a thing.

However... cowards that shut down... that's a different story altogether. I'm not saying "I" do it, I'm arguing "for" it.

"the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few."

As per my post: if the needs of the many (the enemy team and the dead players) outweigh the needs of the few (the one player left, who people think can't win) then by your statement it's fine to report the last man standing to get the game over with.

Unless the needs of the many don't outweigh the needs of the few.

"I'm not saying "I" do it, I'm arguing "for" it"
"reporting their position is the only honorable outcome to deal with cowardice."

So you don't break the rules but you are perfectly happy to encourage others to do it?
Is that cowardice, dishonorable behavior, hypocrisy, or cobblers?

Edited by Raggedyman, 18 September 2015 - 11:58 AM.

[Mudhutwarrior]

MechWarrior5152251, on 18 September 2015 - 11:55 AM, said:

I will always report the dikc's position.

We will add you to the list , thanks.

[Mister Blastman]

Raggedyman, on 18 September 2015 - 11:57 AM, said:

"the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few."

As per my post: if the needs of the many (the enemy team and the dead players) outweigh the needs of the few (the one player left, who people think can't win) then by your statement it's fine to report the last man standing to get the game over with.

Unless the needs of the many don't outweigh the needs of the few.

"I'm not saying "I" do it, I'm arguing "for" it"
"reporting their position is the only honorable outcome to deal with cowardice."

So you don't break the rules but you are perfectly happy to encourage others to do it?
Is that cowardice, dishonorable behavior, hypocrisy, or cobblers?

Rules and honor are two different things. If you don't understand the meaning of honor and cowardice and the ills cowardice brings to the field, there is nothing more I can say to help you.

I said what I said in this thread and I stand by it. I stand by exactly what I said because I believe it to the core.

[AssaultPig]

Raggedyman, on 18 September 2015 - 11:42 AM, said:

Becoming a jerk to deal with a jerk increases, not decreases, the amount of jerkyness
It may very briefly make you feel groovy but it sets a precedent of 'jerky behavior is acceptable if you can justify it, even if it's against the TOC"
You're basically going through the same mental process as the jerk that powered down has done

Two wrong do not make a right
Two jerks does not decrease the amount of jerks
Two breaches of the TOS and Code of Conduct do not help make the game a better place

If you see it then report it, and be patient.
Find them, kill them, next round.

this only makes sense if you think that the ToC is some kind of moral authority

people shutting down at the end of a lost match to grief/troll/waste time are cowardly and unsporting; there's not some moral fault in calling that behavior out

[Cementi]

Simple solution.

When there is only one mech alive on your team there should be a vote option to reveal his location. If the team says no then he can do as he wishes (likely only going to be a majority on this if he is actively moving and trying to accomplish something). If however the team votes to reveal him he shows up on the map regardless of line of sight or locks so that the other team can find and remove him with a minimum of peoples time wasted.

If the coding isnt too tough problem solved.

[Raggedyman]

AssaultPig, on 18 September 2015 - 12:09 PM, said:

this only makes sense if you think that the ToC is some kind of moral authority people shutting down at the end of a lost match to grief/troll/waste time are cowardly and unsporting; there's not some moral fault in calling that behavior out

I don't think they are a moral authority, I think they are the core rules that are in operation and that once they start becoming optional things get messy very quickly.

If someone power downs then by all means chew them out for that behaviour. I have no problem with that what so ever and have done it on a number of occasions as I give not one fig for them or their damn annoying behaviour.

All I ask is that people don't break the rules when doing so, because once you start picking and choosing the rules that you follow it creates a horrible environment and rapidly degenerates the whole playing environment. You end up where player A gets their coordinates given out by Player B because Player B has decided that they are the only important person in a 24 participant round and Player A is doing it wrong.

[Raggedyman]

Mister Blastman, on 18 September 2015 - 12:06 PM, said:

Rules and honor are two different things. If you don't understand the meaning of honor and cowardice and the ills cowardice brings to the field, there is nothing more I can say to help you. I said what I said in this thread and I stand by it. I stand by exactly what I said because I believe it to the core.

Oh you wonderful arbiter of honour and morality. I'm sure the weather must be wonderful up there and I apologise for ever questioning you about your wonderful words and how they actually pan out. I guess I just don't have magnificent a core as you.

[Mister Blastman]

Raggedyman, on 18 September 2015 - 12:26 PM, said:

Oh you wonderful arbiter of honour and morality. I'm sure the weather must be wonderful up there and I apologise for ever questioning you about your wonderful words and how they actually pan out. I guess I just don't have magnificent a core as you.

The weather is nice here! The sun is shining bright in the sky, the leaves are swaying gently in the breeze. If I sit on my brick steps and bask in its supple glow and look closely I see white tufts topple through the air as small insects buzz through it with random abandon.

It is a happy place.

[Cementi]

Figured I would put up a poll with my possible solution in the actual *gasp* suggestion section of the forums.

If anyone is interested http://mwomercs.com/...ers-a-solution/

[Mystere]

Cementi, on 18 September 2015 - 12:15 PM, said:

Simple solution.

When there is only one mech alive on your team there should be a vote option to reveal his location. If the team says no then he can do as he wishes (likely only going to be a majority on this if he is actively moving and trying to accomplish something). If however the team votes to reveal him he shows up on the map regardless of line of sight or locks so that the other team can find and remove him with a minimum of peoples time wasted.

If the coding isnt too tough problem solved.

Voting? Are you serious? Given many of the players I have encountered, that suggestion is a sure way to officially grief the last player.

Edited by Mystere, 18 September 2015 - 12:53 PM.

[Mechwarrior Buddah]

InRev, on 18 September 2015 - 08:18 AM, said:

allowing conquest points to hit 750

hasnt it already been established that this IS NOT punishable? I can post a pic for it if youd like

AssaultPig, on 18 September 2015 - 12:09 PM, said:

this only makes sense if you think that the ToC is some kind of moral authority

people shutting down at the end of a lost match to grief/troll/waste time are cowardly and unsporting; there's not some moral fault in calling that behavior out

Thatd be an issue as its not against ToC to shut down if it might net you a win.

[Jugger Grimrod]

Lightfoot, on 18 September 2015 - 04:25 AM, said:

There are tactical reasons to power down, though they probably last no more than a minute. I did this to get a clean back-shot on my target inside the HPG structure last week. They ran right past me and I got a quick kill.

'All Dead or Fled', is probably what you want. After 2 minutes shutdown the mech is counted as 'Fled'. They could even get a mark, K/D/F. Makes it an honor issue as well.

I like this. Powering down to avoid detection and setup a possible ambush/kill, I do not have a problem with. Powering down to 'kill the clock'... might as well self-destruct for all the good it does.

[Vlad Ward]

Wow.

You guys are either very young or very bored. Likely the latter.

No one gives a **** about moral absolutes, and there's no way PGI is going to add a new loss condition for this.

If a dude is intentionally being a **** and powering down facing a wall to ruin your day? Call it out. Or dont. The vast majority of people won't care. PGI will enforce it if they want, but they probably don't give half a **** either.

Someone powered down "tactically" but still in the game? Poke for signs of life. Call them a raging moron if it makes you feel better. Probably shouldn't call them out, but the end of the day the give-a-****-o-meter is running on fumes for just about everyone outside of the forum justice crowd.

Edited by Vlad Ward, 18 September 2015 - 03:07 PM.

[Mudhutwarrior]

Vlad Ward, on 18 September 2015 - 03:01 PM, said:

Wow.

You guys are either very young or very bored. Likely the latter.

No one gives a **** about moral absolutes, and there's no way PGI is going to add a new loss condition for this.

If a dude is intentionally being a **** and powering down facing a wall to ruin your day? Call it out. Or dont. The vast majority of people won't care. PGI will enforce it if they want, but they probably don't give half a **** either.

Someone powered down "tactically" but still in the game? Poke for signs of life. Call them a raging moron if it makes you feel better. Probably shouldn't call them out, but the end of the day the give-a-****-o-meter is running on fumes for just about everyone outside of the forum justice crowd.

How you play a game relates directly to how one lives their lives. If you ever wonder why the planet is the way it is today just read your own post.

Bending the rules to suit is a short path to cheating overall. Its the same slope. At some point someone needs say stop or at a minimum point out how low character it is. Your as bad as the elites here on the forum for the past couple of years telling us how cheating wasn't possible or they never saw it themselves. Come to find out it was them doing then justifying it to themselves and those around them. It's everywhere now as the article below shows. It started when little twists of the rule became acceptable and common place and down the slope everyone went. No honor with the small thing then no honor with the big one.

http://www.businessi...scandal-2014-12

"According to a recent article on The Daily Dot, Beck followed his own dismissal by releasing a list of people he believes are cheating — as much as 40% of professional players, he says — with top tier gamers among them. "