58 replies to this topic

[Bishop Steiner]

There are other factors being discussed in other threads about things people feel skew PSR stats, but here is a pretty obvious one, to me:

Some of us are specialists. Even though a guy like Audivo is still stinking deadly in anything, he is WAY deadlier in Lights, (or so it seems). Likewise, while I feel Tier 3 is probably about right fo rme, my Threat Factor as an opponent in a Hunchback or Centurion is markedly higher than if I am in an Assault or Light Mech.

This I think can and will cause some disparities. And while they may "average" out over time, if for instance, I'm really a Tier 2 Medium jock (not saying that I am, but I do think I am pretty dang good in them) it's a little unfair to me, and my prey, to be counted as Tier 3 because of my other mechs, and thus, I drop in my HBK, and get to hunt Noobs and Scrubs.

Thoughts?

[Lugh]

Absolutely. I am a monster in a Dragon, Heavy Metal, Timber Wolf, Dire Wolf, Warhawk, Atlas, Hunchback, Stormcrow or Nova, but in an Artic Cheetah? I am meh at best.

[Ghogiel]

New players aside I really don't think there is much between T2-4 since the main factor is just the amount of games played. Just play loads and the bar will fill up to max T1 eventually.

[Mister Blastman]

I really think they should go further and break them up my 'mech chassis. Back in the day when I tried hard there came a time I could never run my BJ-1 with AC/20 because it expected me to carry due to my overall medium Elo.

Sometimes we just want to have fun, right?

So I don't really want to go back to weight class alone, I'd rather do chassis model.

[627]

look at it this way, your PSR is your overall skill as mechwarrior - when you find someone with tier 3, you can either think "hey, a jack of all trades, good pilot in all the mechs" or instead you say " whoa, that's an elite medium jock, better wait till he drops in something else."

And now you have a tier 1 and all your thoughts are something in the line of " well... sh!t. He's superior no matter what mech he is in."

Edited by 627, 22 September 2015 - 01:07 PM.

[LT. HARDCASE]

I've always wanted a chassis based system, while weight class is definitely better than an overall score.

[Sarlic]

Like the previous thread we discussed about. I think PGI should break it down per weight class.

[Bishop Steiner]

Ghogiel, on 22 September 2015 - 01:03 PM, said:

New players aside I really don't think there is much between T2-4 since the main factor is just the amount of games played. Just play loads and the bar will fill up to max T1 eventually.

I have over 20k matches.... I should be higher than tie 3 by that reasoning.

[Deathlike]

Considering that PGI decided to consolidate them all into one #, regardless of class, group/solo, and whatnot...

At this point, I don't really care. They didn't see fit to adjust the metrics or anything like that before... I don't see it happening.

[Bishop Steiner]

Mister Blastman, on 22 September 2015 - 01:03 PM, said:

I really think they should go further and break them up my 'mech chassis. Back in the day when I tried hard there came a time I could never run my BJ-1 with AC/20 because it expected me to carry due to my overall medium Elo.

Sometimes we just want to have fun, right?

So I don't really want to go back to weight class alone, I'd rather do chassis model.

I can see that, but Weight Class seems a reasonable compromise for input work.

[Lorian Sunrider]

I think by weight class is absolutely needed.

While we don't know if its purely match score or whatnot that calculates PSR, my KDR is absolutely horrid in most of my favourite lights but the average damage is pretty good. Put me in my mediums and heavies and my KDR skyrockets.

[Ghogiel]

Bishop Steiner, on 22 September 2015 - 01:34 PM, said:

I have over 20k matches.... I should be higher than tie 3 by that reasoning.

Nah by that reasoning you still need to play more though. If you didn't need to play more you'd be T1. See?

[AlphaToaster]

I think not only mech weight should be a factor but also the max alpha/ avg dps on the mech.

So you can take an under armed mech, or say, the stock loadout, and lower your PSR, vs if you ran a straight meta oriented build on it.

It's moving toward a BV system, but a mech with DHS would be a higher rating than one without. It could be a ratio of mech weight to weapon alpha. Would need to be adjusted for each weight class but that's the general idea.

What will happen I think is we'll see upper teir players running around in stock mechs for fun, accepting the challenge against lower teir players still learning their meta builds.

With the current PSR, only a masochist would risk using a stock loadout in their current teir vs customized mechs piloted by same teir players. That guy has his fun in other ways than winning......

A stock teir might even form, at the bottom bottom of teir 5. Way down there under the trial champions would be the stock teir.

Edited by AlphaToaster, 22 September 2015 - 01:50 PM.

[Roadkill]

Frankly, they should be broken up by Mech. Yeah, yeah, it'll take longer for stats to settle, blah blah blah. Who cares? I'd greatly prefer accuracy over speed.

The people you care about are the ones who play 1000s of games. Their stats will settle correctly and be far more accurate if they're split out by at least chassis if not variant.

[Roadkill]

627, on 22 September 2015 - 01:06 PM, said:

look at it this way, your PSR is your overall skill as mechwarrior - when you find someone with tier 3, you can either think "hey, a jack of all trades, good pilot in all the mechs" or instead you say "whoa, that's an elite medium jock, better wait till he drops in something else."

The problem is that with the current system you have no idea.

I have 150+ Mechs, the vast majority of them fully unlocked. (Not counting Clans, where there's usually no point in leveling up the non-Prime variants. Sometimes, but not usually.)

My PSR might be Tier 3.

Then you have this other guy and the only Mech he plays is the Catapult. He just freakin' LOVES the Catapult. He has 10,000 games in the damn thing.

He might be Tier 3.

Then this new Mech comes out. Looks kinda like a Catapult, but with arms. And no missile ears. But it at least has the same torso. Maybe it plays kinda like a Catapult, the other guy thinks... I'll give it a try!

Me and my Pokemech addiction are trying it for sure.

You drop in a game with both of us. We're both T3. What are you supposed to think? Which one of us is likely to be more useful?

T3. That's all you got. Basically, you're clueless.

[Suko]

Yes, we need PSR by weight class, or better yet, by chassis.

My skill in light mechs is down right horrific. Mediums I'm "meh", but Heavies and Assaults are where I shine. It makes me much less likely to try getting better in Mediums and Lights knowing that I will be going up against the same skill level of player, while my skill is effectively reduced due to my unfamiliarity with the chassis.

[Krivvan]

Bishop Steiner, on 22 September 2015 - 01:00 PM, said:

Some of us are specialists. Even though a guy like Audivo is still stinking deadly in anything, he is WAY deadlier in Lights, (or so it seems).

And he's in Tier 1 where he should be. Honestly, those players who are really, really amazing in one playstyle generally can at least competently play other playstyles since many fundamentals are shared (I'm saying this as someone who is also a specialized Light pilot). It's not too big a deal, but yeah, PSR separated by weight class would be more preferable.

Edited by Krivvan, 22 September 2015 - 02:06 PM.

[Bishop Steiner]

Krivvan, on 22 September 2015 - 02:03 PM, said:

And he's in Tier 1 where he should be. Honestly, those players who are really, really amazing in one playstyle generally can at least competently play other playstyles since many fundamentals are shared. It's not too big a deal, but yeah, PSR separated by weight class would be more preferable.

Yeah, there are a handful of guys I don't think anyone with 2 braincells had to ask.... you. Adi, etc.

Only drawback to this? Only thing worse than unconfirmed LEET Status Dbags, is the number of LEETS using confirmed status to act like even bigger Dbags.

And no, not calling you or Adi a Dbag. Or even your units....but I think you know the type of players I'm talking about.

[Agent 0 Fortune]

I like the idea of separate categories for weight class. I’d go so far as to add faction as well (clan/IS).

However I can see why PGI chose not to. I think if they do, they would need to decouple 3/3/3/3. I believe the formula they are using for PSR is biased towards damage done, and I think the upper tiers will have a higher population of Assault mechs would would impede the matchmaker, and delay games 'safety valves' open.

But if the upcoming re-balancing is successful and there is greater parity for various weight classes, then I think separate categories for weight classes will be very beneficial because the difference between chassis will be primarily pilot capabilities, not game-balance.

[crashlogic]

Lugh, on 22 September 2015 - 01:02 PM, said:

Absolutely. I am a monster in a Dragon, Heavy Metal, Timber Wolf, Dire Wolf, Warhawk, Atlas, Hunchback, Stormcrow or Nova, but in an Artic Cheetah? I am meh at best.

What he said...and not just by weight class, by chassis. My abilities are very different in a jenner than they will be in a Jenner IIC, or than they are in a Direwhale (in fact assaults as a concept elude me).