99 replies to this topic

[MarsThunder]

As to the clans-vs-IS weapons rebalance I suppose the right way is to keep the current state (that is close enough to the lore), forbid mixed clans/IS teams and reduce clans team size to 10 (or so) that would be also close enough to the lore (clans have less human resources than IS).

Edited by MarsThunder, 14 October 2015 - 03:03 AM.

[Tahribator]

These changes are mostly positive. I'm especially curious about how the laser damage reduction at range will turn out. Props to PGI for listening to feedback.

I really really hope the quirks in the PTS1 are also being overhauled completely behind the scenes. Most of them did not make any sense.

[Dracol]

Much better pre-PTS communication. Thank you PGI.

The increase in equipment/weapon health was a surprise to see. One of the initial concerns about quirks that increased structure was that equipment would get destroyed very easily still leaving a mech weaponless but with a arm still hanging on. The increase in health will make those structure quirks more meaningful now. Nice seeing feedback from the community implemented.

[GothicVash]

i still think the best way to solve the clan balance issue with them being overpowered. is to have all weapons in the game be as powerfull and long range as they should be. (mainly applys to ppc's and the uac5 actually shooting faster like its supposed to imo) but have 2 ques one for is and one for clan. is drops 12 mechs at a time and clan drops 5 to 8 (in lore they drop in 5's) also for group ques only allow one type of mech is or clan.. i know its harder to implement and not really a bandaid solution but more of an actual fix that will keep everyone happy imo..

2nd thought
i am really interested to see how targeting and the ecm changes will work out i do enjoy lrm boating so i will be testing that out i think if im understanding it correctly it should be good fun now.

[Lugh]

Team Chevy86, on 13 October 2015 - 06:50 PM, said:

I'm about %99.9 certain that means the max effective range. So your base ERml is 405m, add %40 to that makes it do damage out to 567m, rather than 810. A %40 nerf to it's base range would be ridiculous...
I wouldn't call it heavy handed.. But %40 seems high

Either way its far too much. Couple that with reductions in heat dissipation and the clans no longer have a 'long range game advantage'

So you get one shot at max range (which is doing far less damage as well now) then Viola You are in the sweet spot for IS brawling with LPL shooting faster, cooler and more often.

That sound of taps playing is for the 'superior' clan mechs...

Edited by Lugh, 14 October 2015 - 05:52 AM.

[Darwins Dog]

I'm willing to give everything the benefit if the doubt. It looks like it will bring the game in to closer ranges which is a good things in my book.

Infotech is a good start. It gives lights a better purpose in the game. It may not be realistic, but that doesn't bother me. Realism and giant robots don't mix that well to begin with.

ECM changes are great. I will be interesting to see how they mix with the overall changes to the game.

[Freeman 52]

I couldn't be happier with these proposed changes. The variable sensor ranges, ecm shift from denial to delay, and the removal of spurious information feedback mechanics like the flashing reticule on a non-targeted mech will make this game vastly more interesting for me. The entire infotech group of changes can single-handedly make this game tactical by default instead of by choice, and teach new players the kinds of skills that experienced groups use anyway - hit R, communicate, scout, coordinate movement - instead of the tragically common "shoot blindly and kill kill kill".

I can't wait to test the changes!

[Dubious]

Just to be Devil's advocate on the non-targeted mech penalties, I feel like an unintended consequence of this will be a major and painful hit to brawlers. This makes a lot of sense in the long range "information war" setting, but in a close up brawl setting especially with multiple enemies, targeting is often an afterthought. If this is changed, I would be highly in favor of weapon convergence working automatically perhaps under a certain (very short) range, or automatically working on "targetable" mechs if the right amount of time has gone by. Probably one of the funnest things that happens is this game is coming out on top in a lop-sided brawl, but this change would make brawling really difficult for the outnumbered MechWarrior.

[Veev]

Lasers will not do full damage when striking a ‘Mech that is not target-locked from a range greater than 60% of the Laser’s Maximum Range.

WTF does it matter if a direct fire weapon is locked or not, this should not have any bearing on damage output.

I still did not read anything about fixing the rewards system to encourage more Role warfare, until you start thinking about more than raw damage output from a reward standpoint nothing will change about how the game is played.

[Stah]

Darwins Dog, on 14 October 2015 - 06:04 AM, said:

I'm willing to give everything the benefit if the doubt. It looks like it will bring the game in to closer ranges...

...where Clan warrior will be sliced by more effective IS weapon. Indeed.

[Slavv]

Chiao, long.

[Rattler85]

Veev, on 14 October 2015 - 06:48 AM, said:

Lasers will not do full damage when striking a ‘Mech that is not target-locked from a range greater than 60% of the Laser’s Maximum Range.

WTF does it matter if a direct fire weapon is locked or not, this should not have any bearing on damage output.

I still did not read anything about fixing the rewards system to encourage more Role warfare, until you start thinking about more than raw damage output from a reward standpoint nothing will change about how the game is played.

Agreed. An ERPPC or any other weapon hitting a target should do the same damage whether or not a target has been locked onto.

Also the reduced sensor ranges are not good.

I think the reduced ecm range is good also that it will only delay lock on when in LOS of an Opfor.

Edited by Rattler85, 14 October 2015 - 08:14 AM.

[Greyhart]

generally I like the changes and where they are heading. Looks like they are trying to encourage brawling and targeting.

they are trying to discourage standing behind a rock and poking out to do a reflex shot on the person standing behind a rock some 700m away. This I can get behind this.

as to the reduced damage doesn't make sense, well a lot of battletech doesn't make sense i.e. why doesn't a direwolf sink into the ground. It makes good game sense to stop people from sitting back and poking. This is after all mechwarrior not squint warrior. also how do you know that a single laser is not a combination of smaller lasers focused on a point and without the target info the computer can't get all those tiny lasers focused right.

I don't know if the values or the ideas are right but then again no one does. If only there was a way to test them on some sort of test server and give feed back on some sort of forum.

[stjobe]

Without having tested these changes, I'd like to go on record as saying I like the way they look.

ECM change is fantastic - no more hard-counter to LRMs everything.

Heat sink changes are... okay; I'd much rather have seen a test where all DHS actually are D, not a-bit-less-than-2xS. SHS, who cares. Nobody runs them and they can't be made good without drastic measures (i.e. not small changes).

Laser range changes are interesting, especially the "won't do full damage at range without lock"; should make for a reduction in the long-range game.

Clan laser nerf - yes, sorry Clanners, but it's needed.

All in all, I'm actually looking forward to test this out - and for those of you who know me, that's a rather unusual situation for me to be in these days

Edited by stjobe, 14 October 2015 - 08:36 AM.

[Stah]

stjobe, on 14 October 2015 - 08:35 AM, said:

Clan laser nerf - yes, sorry Clanners, but it's needed.

Said like you really have no understanding, what the Clan Technology is.

[Mcgral18]

Stah, on 14 October 2015 - 09:39 AM, said:

Said like you really have no understanding, what the Clan Technology is.

For balance, CoreRule ignore.

[Stah]

Greyhart, on 14 October 2015 - 08:26 AM, said:

they are trying to discourage standing behind a rock and poking out to do a reflex shot on the person standing behind a rock some 700m away. This I can get behind this.

Indeed?
Do you really think, this will cure game against super-speed PPC/TwinGauss snipers?
Do you really believe, this will make solution against LRM boats?

No and - ok, no. LRM boats' position will move to medium or even lights, striking at 800-900m, where you cannot shoot direct fire from your assault, so your beamers are half-useless. Add ECM here - oops! Now yo see me, now you don't.

[Stah]

Mcgral18, on 14 October 2015 - 09:43 AM, said:

For balance, CoreRule ignore.

So, good-bye Battletech, hello "just another pew-pew FPS"?
If it is so, I'm out - point me the exit. "I'm too old for this s... hit" ©

[Kraftwerkedup]

Mcgral18, on 14 October 2015 - 09:43 AM, said:

For balance, CoreRule ignore.

I hate/love that.

Part of me, the part that plays Megamek with all the boxes ticked, thinks thats a pretty damned balanced game, and more of the optional and deep "level 3" rules would go a long way to helping fix MWO. Then the other part of me realizes PGI is pretty incompetent and that we wont get complex and deep rules from the TT, so throw out every TT rule and just make the damned game more than minimum viability as a product.

Stah, on 14 October 2015 - 09:54 AM, said:

So, good-bye Battletech, hello "just another pew-pew FPS"?
If it is so, I'm out - point me the exit. "I'm too old for this s... hit" ©

I feel you. I do. I want a Battletech FPS too.

PGI cant deliver that. Period.

I think that ship has sailed, and we need to focus on what is realistic. Making MWO as good as it possibly can be. Battletech was abandoned before Closed Beta even ended.

[SirSlaughter]

Seem good changes that are worth a try