285 replies to this topic

[Rampancy]

Cranial Enigma, on 14 October 2015 - 04:25 PM, said:

So far I am having trouble trying to figure out how they coded the laser range changes. Because right now it is better to not press R and lock on, because by doing that it will lower your laser range to 60% of what it is if you are not aiming at your target. I have no clue why it is doing this since from the explanation it should only affect maximum range, but if you are locked onto an enemy and start firing at that enemy over the hill you will have lost 40% of your range by not looking at the enemy you were originally locked on. Here are some screenshots from my mist lynx since I wanted to see how it was affected. (using Clan medium pulse lasers with both modules range/cooldwon).

(Edit): Had to relook at the PTS changelog, its not specifically for maximum range, its for optimal range. So if you are a laser boat....... never press R if you are sniping.

Locked at the atlas


Locked onto the atlas looking at the jenner


Up close views on the weapon ranges

Spoiler

...If you are not locked onto a target, you do not get your full range. So if you're sniping, you should absolute press R.

Not sure what you're confused about. This was pretty explicitly stated.

[Tombstoner]

Dino Might, on 15 October 2015 - 08:04 AM, said:

I hear ya, but there is some space magic that gives us a collimated beam that is probably about a foot in diameter, at least. I'm just going on graphics here. If lasers only did their damage in 1mm radius areas, you'd be hard pressed to ever hurt anything in a mech, because there's a ton of empty space, and not everything you touch would be the critical juncture of an actuator or ammo feed. I assume that the lasers have to have a fairly large point of impact area and still do appreciable damage. Given this, the beam, while somewhat focused, is mostly reliant on the collimation in the tube to keep from dispersing too much. To the point, if you didn't add a focus lens on the end of it, and just had a collimated beam, you would have a slightly larger point of impact area than your collimator tube (assuming imperfect alignment of all rays). Add focusing lens that focuses out at extreme distance (infinity for all intents and purposes), and now you've got a beam with the same diameter as your tube and it's not going to disperse to any significant degree.

If you need such drastic focusing elements on the ends of the laser barrel, such that adjustment would take whole seconds to go from 600m to 300m, then why the hell do you have a collimator tube at all? It's obviously not working. Why not just pump all the light through fiber optic and you can ditch the big tube so your laser emitters can be tiny. One critical slot for a medium laser? Hah, more like one critical slot for 100 medium lasers.

Given the space magic that is already lore, I supposed the logicial conclusions of that space magic, and they convince me that this focusing stuff for ghost damage is stretching magic space reality way too hard.

I do give them points for trying, though. I appreciate that there is at least some reason, however far-fetched and inconsistent with the other elements of the lore it may be.

My biggest gripe about this change is going to be the unintended consequences for mechs that were not a big problem to begin with. That Panther with its 4 mpulse...gotta get that thing nerfed, too. That's all I see in the highest tier comp teams...

I know you know lasers are focused internally and have nothing to do with the targeting computers ability to maximize time on target. thats what does the damage. Many people do not and think the magnifying analogy works.

This proposed rule change demonstrates a lack of understanding. But hey this is the team that gave us ghost heat and magical level of trueness. accuracy + precision = trueness. all i can hope for at this point are scifi energy shields.
hey it could be lost tech.....and that wouldn't violate the rules in any way....

[Lugh]

RampancyTW, on 15 October 2015 - 08:44 AM, said:

...If you are not locked onto a target, you do not get your full range. So if you're sniping, you should absolute press R.

Not sure what you're confused about. This was pretty explicitly stated.

And if you are in an Assault or heavy sniping expect to start working at less than 700m at full effectiveness.

For lasers.

But HEY if you can deal with the fact that you will NEVER EVER GET A HIT INDICATOR FOR PPCS AND BALLISTICS beyond those ranges you are now KING SNIPAH!!

[Splatshot]

So like 10 people play this game, and now they want to enable more random hidden rules, that unless you pay attention you will never figure out.

I truly wonder if they are shooting to see if they get the player base lower that is already is.

Lots of good games are coming out...and its in the never spend money time at MWO. (Sept - Dec).

Back to AW, i'll check back in a couple months.

FYI - Clan are supposed to be better than IS, making them even is wrong and then just another Robot game.

[SaltBeef]

Could not get a PTS Match but tested in the Testing Grounds. Was Kind of Nice to mouse over the Timber wolf and Not see a Sea of RED Negative quirks. Stock timber minus the Mgs felt OK but then again I always target before I fire anyway. As I said before I agree with all of the Changes minus the Constant Clan Nerf Hammers. 40 percent seems a little eccessive but with PGI it seems always overdone against the Clan mechs. The Stalker +150 sensors are a beast and that thing is going to be a missile boat nightmare again...not saying that that is a Bad thing. Black night 4 LL 4 Med feels like a Clan mech Heat wise with the LL chained and Meds grouped. Fires them a hell of a lot faster than the Clans can before getting hot though. Misinformation about Lasers spread on the forum after the change. IS does not have longer range Lasers to 1480 like some posted in the forums. See below not as Bad as some were leading me to believe but still makes them weaker than before and w/o PP damage minus Guass and ER PPC. Have to pause to cool more which stinks.

Clan ER LL Max Range 1184. Optimal 740
Clan ER Med Max Range 648 Optimal 405
IS LL Max Range 900 Optimal 450
ISER LL Max Range 1080 Optimal 675
IS med Max 540 Optimal 270

Edited by SaltBeef, 15 October 2015 - 09:56 AM.

[Sjorpha]

Lugh, on 15 October 2015 - 09:19 AM, said:

But HEY if you can deal with the fact that you will NEVER EVER GET A HIT INDICATOR FOR PPCS AND BALLISTICS beyond those ranges you are now KING SNIPAH!!

No problem. I can absolutely deal with that fact, it's not like the mech dies any less because my reticule doesn't flash. Or in group drops I can have a friend be a dedicated scout for my sniping, or work with a brawling frontline feeding me targets. Actual teamwork, very refreshing.

[Lugh]

Sjorpha, on 15 October 2015 - 09:35 AM, said:

No problem. I can absolutely deal with that fact, it's not like the mech dies any less because my reticule doesn't flash. Or in group drops I can have a friend be a dedicated scout for my sniping, or work with a brawling frontline feeding me targets. Actual teamwork, very refreshing.

But you'll never be able to tell the difference between a hit and the PPC / AC round passing between an arm and the torso...

There's a lot very wrong with that...

[Sjorpha]

Splatshot, on 15 October 2015 - 09:31 AM, said:

So like 10 people play this game, and now they want to enable more random hidden rules, that unless you pay attention you will never figure out.

HYPERBOLE IS AWESOMESAUCE!

There are more than 100 active players in my little CW unit alone, not one of the bigger units, the game game has thousands of players and I see lots of people liking the changes.

[Splatshot]

Sjorpha, on 15 October 2015 - 09:38 AM, said:

HYPERBOLE IS AWESOMESAUCE!

There are more than 100 active players in my little CW unit alone, not one of the bigger units, the game game has thousands of players and I see lots of people liking the changes.

I am very happy that you have a successfully CW unit, that takes work.

Of all the people I played with since closed beta 2-5 still actually play.

When your entire clan/group has an average age of 40+ its a little different, we tend do to other things that will take up our time, so unless the game is good we leave and play something else with our limited time.

Edited by Splatshot, 15 October 2015 - 09:44 AM.

[Sjorpha]

Lugh, on 15 October 2015 - 09:38 AM, said:

But you'll never be able to tell the difference between a hit and the PPC / AC round passing between an arm and the torso...

There's a lot very wrong with that...

No, there is nothing wrong with that at all.

First of all its realistic, why would my computer know I've hit a mech if it's not targeted? It might just be a rock as far as the computer is concerned.

And second there are several visual cues to hitting in this game. Weapon explosions for ballistics, blue fire flash and ecm disruption/targeting reveal for PPCs, damage glow for lasers, torso shake for impact weapons and so on. And if I can't tell if I hit every time then maybe making a competent guess is a valid new skill to develop.

[Mystere]

Gas Guzzler, on 14 October 2015 - 09:03 PM, said:

Nerfing to be balanced with relatively unquirked IS mechs is how it should be. Why do you think you deserve OP mechs? Because you are such a special snowflake?

I will just be brutally frank. It looks pretty obvious to me that the obviously incoming Clans were not even a factor when balancing was first designed in MWO. Otherwise, we would not be getting any of these band-**** masquerading as "Clan vs. IS balance".

[Sjorpha]

Splatshot, on 15 October 2015 - 09:43 AM, said:

I am very happy that you have a successfully CW unit, that takes work.

Thank you, yes it does take a lot of work. I am of course hoping that everyone finds a nice group to play with and has as much fun as possible with the game.

Quote

Of all the people I played with since closed beta 2-5 still actually play.

When your entire clan/group has an average age of 40+ its a little different, we tend do to other things that will take up our time, so unless the game is good we leave and play something else with our limited time.

That is very sad, I'm completely with you that many horrible episodes have driven old players away, it's a problem.

But my problem with your other post was that every time PGI does something there are a number of people posting stuff like "You'll drive away your last players!" or "I'm quitting!" and so on, without really arguing constructively. It's getting really old and I kinda wish that people who want's to leave just went ahead and did so without the drama.

[Mystere]

Rushin Roulette, on 14 October 2015 - 11:13 PM, said:

"If you dont want to test it, then dott complain if players who do test it find it manageable... download the test server client yourself, get some actual practical experience instead of that pathetic no knowledge theoretical crap and leave some real feedback"

Just to be fair, there are at least a few people playing MWO who in real life are highly paid analysts who process giga/terabytes of data produced by someone else. You'd be shocked at how much such alleged "no knowledge theoretical crap" analysts are valued and paid.

And what about those who produced the data, you may ask? They're the everyday employee paid a normal salary.

[SaltBeef]

TDR favoritism again Sensor Range plus 200

TimberWolf Sensor Range only plus 100 and the JJ S varient gets no sensor boost.


As a matter of fact all IS mechs got Double or more sensor Range ....Yet another Clan whackjob.

[Mystere]

KuroNyra, on 15 October 2015 - 01:06 AM, said:

I really don't like that. But let's see how it goes.
A good old shitstorm managed to destroy the PPC and LRMS. So why not that system?

Shh! Now is not the right time to talk about organizing such a thing. Have patience, padawan. Have patience.

Edited by Mystere, 15 October 2015 - 10:17 AM.

[Mystere]

Marmon Rzohr, on 15 October 2015 - 03:50 AM, said:

Information Warfare MUST affect firepower directly in order to have a significant impact in the game.

Assuming the change I made above is what you meant, then I disagree. Why not have IW directly affect accuracy, targetting, and "visibility" instead of firepower?

[Lugh]

Sjorpha, on 15 October 2015 - 09:43 AM, said:

No, there is nothing wrong with that at all.

First of all its realistic, why would my computer know I've hit a mech if it's not targeted? It might just be a rock as far as the computer is concerned.

And second there are several visual cues to hitting in this game. Weapon explosions for ballistics, blue fire flash and ecm disruption/targeting reveal for PPCs, damage glow for lasers, torso shake for impact weapons and so on. And if I can't tell if I hit every time then maybe making a competent guess is a valid new skill to develop.

Which often fire off the wrong effect for near misses as well as mech hits. The same Sparks fly up from giant trees and buildings as they do from mechs. And they make the same sounds.... so yeah there is that too.

The more competent guesses you end up having to accustom yourself too, the slower your firing rate becomes. Because if you EVER did real shooting, you should know that GUESSING at any time means you have utterly failed.

[sycocys]

Mystere, on 15 October 2015 - 10:23 AM, said:

Assuming the change I made above is what you meant, then I disagree. Why not have IW directly affect accuracy, targetting, and "visibility" instead of firepower?

Lessening the "accuracy" is pretty much exactly what it is doing with the laser range dynamically adjusting.

They obviously don't think they can effectively do cof or that it will bugger up the netcode, so they need to find some alternative ways to deal with hitscan weapons like lasers.

Edited by sycocys, 15 October 2015 - 10:28 AM.

[VorpalAnvil]

Gas Guzzler, on 14 October 2015 - 03:09 PM, said:

B-B-b-but who considered the Black Knight meta in the first place??

The Tier 5 players who program the game.

[Lugh]

SaltBeef, on 15 October 2015 - 10:04 AM, said:

TDR favoritism again Sensor Range plus 200

TimberWolf Sensor Range only plus 100 and the JJ S varient gets no sensor boost.


As a matter of fact all IS mechs got Double or more sensor Range ....Yet another Clan whackjob.

Congrats guys you have longer range but good luck capitalizing on that now. TROLOLOLOLOLLOOL