246 replies to this topic

[Daelen Rottiger]

PholkLorr, on 30 October 2015 - 04:33 AM, said:

Boy am I glad you're not in a leadership position in the government or military. Next time a war breaks out you will send up biplanes to fight fighter jets. Or fishing boats armed with spears to fight destroyers.

And yes, epeen polishing is fun to me, as is stomping players both good and bad (Alot more bads than good though) . That's why I do it duh. Hypocrisy? Here's a person telling others not to prescribe what fun is for others, telling me that mym own idea of fun is bad. What's worse than a hypocrite is a hypocrite who fails at reading comprehension.

I've never once said that fun should *only* be defined as winning. Or playing meta builds. Or stock builds. I don't define what fun is for anybody but myself. Only you can decide what's fun for you. If it's playing stock builds, do it. For me, it's winning.

So the point of this whole thread is that you like meta, you like to win and the "noobs" not playing meta should stop whining?

[ice trey]

Eh, Players like this are going to happen. They happen in every game, especially so when it goes online.

Of course, I have never played a game because I wanted to be "Better than everyone else". I've played games because I like the setting, the atmosphere, and the mechanics. Battletech by far more than others. For me, no multiplayer experience has really been memorable. Not Team Fortress 2, nor any MMOs, nor this. It's always been the single player campaigns, with voice actors, stories, missions, and the like. The Half Lifes, Portals, Mechwarrior 2s, Brutal Legends, X-Coms, Front Missions... the works.

...so when that final piece of the mosaic landed to reveal the little "Online" above the Atlas (Why people kept calling it things like an Archer are beyond me), my disappointment was palpable. So much for being able to immerse myself and live the Battletech setting, as I knew exactly what I'd be in for. Powergaming, E-sports, A never-ending see-saw of nerfs and buffs, rage quitters and e-peen comparers. Story? Immersion? Gone to the wind.

So now that the only option (Until 2017) to get a quick-fix of Battletech is dependent on the community, does that mean I'm going to take the e-sport route? Naw. I'm going to get my drops, not take it too seriously. Some groups are fun to drop with, but for the most part, I'd rather not drop with those that adopt this mentality. Group tactics are awesome, but having someone breathing down my neck for not taking the flavor-of-the-month powerbuild is not what I signed up for. All my mechs? Unless part of packages, selected from the RATs for the Draconis Combine as per Historical 3039 and Era Report 3052. Those that I have but don't fit those ranks? None are even out of basic. Paint schemes? Yes, I have all the Standard and Premium colors, and every mech I've bought I've tried to paint according to the schemes shown on Camospecs.com. Most meta players shun that, and stick to "Basic Green" as that MC "Could have been spent buying a hero mech"... But to do what... Get more money... to buy more mechs... to grind up to elite, and the cycle begins anew?

At this point, CW is all but dead, and it was the closest thing to a real overarching story that I could expect to get from this game. During Beta 1, the community came together, and the power-build 2L33T4U units worked along side the Casual players, often rubbing shoulders and teaching each other their various tactics while they all worked together towards a common goal... That was pretty fun. ...but now there's no players, and no goal. It's just people throwing themselves into a one-planet meat grinder in order to secure as many free mech bays as possible. The public cue has never been interesting, and the community seems unanimously determined to make sure that all mission modes that aren't just "Kill everything" are made into exactly that. Pretty much as soon as I secure my "First victory of the day" bonus for whatever mechs I'm grinding at the time, I log off, in hopes that things look up and one day, there's something worth playing towards other than my rank on a leader board.

...and if that doesn't happen by 2017? Well, Harebrained Schemes hasn't disappointed me, yet. Long story short, if this game hadn't have come with the MechWarrior branding, I wouldn't be here.

Edited by ice trey, 30 October 2015 - 05:07 AM.

[CDLord HHGD]

Oh look, another L33T defending his playstyle.

I have read so much hypocrisy from L33Ts like you, it's like watching a political debate.

"We hate it and we only do it because it's allowed." HA! This one is a load of BS.
"Doesn't matter what PGI does, we'll adapt." Guess this means you'll adapt while whining about it.
"I deserve to have my fun like everyone else." Your "fun" is mutually exclusive it seems and is what is killing this game.
"Our playstyle is the more popular." Guess that's why CW is a ghost town and nobody who isn't already wants to be T1.

The best part. I have an open invite to come to my TS to show me the light of your game experience. Just click the link below for my TS address. I'm usually available Wednesday, Friday, and Sunday nights after 4pm MST. NOBODY has come. Not one single L33T. I'm expecting a guest tonight and I promise to be a good host. We'll see if that person comes.

[xWiredx]

I love it when children try to act like an adult. Adorable, OP. Your one-sided, narrow-viewed, simple analysis of a complex problem is truly an inspiration of what others strive not to become.

[adamts01]

PholkLorr, on 30 October 2015 - 04:33 AM, said:

Boy am I glad you're not in a leadership position in the government or military. Next time a war breaks out you will send up biplanes to fight fighter jets. Or fishing boats armed with spears to fight destroyers.

You're confusing war with sport. If someone pulls a knife on me in the street, I'm pulling my Glock. If I'm fighting someone in the dojo, I want an equal opponent. Completely different scenarios. For me it sucks going up against new players, I hate stomps. It's like hunting at the zoo. Most of the time I drive my Mist Lynx because I want a challenge. If you want to go around kicking puppies with your steel toes, whatever, I just don't know why you feel like bragging about it. And for all the puppies that get stuck in high tier games I feel sorry for them and us because they won't stick around and we won't have a game because of lost players.

[mogs01gt]

El Bandito, on 29 October 2015 - 11:01 PM, said:

I'll take the current meta over the 2013 poptart meta any given day. Boy it sucked so much back then, when it was "Highlanders/3Ds/Victors or GTFO". It coincided with the development freeze of MWO, which had resulted in a huge player drop. So yeah, not all metas are bad but some are seriously detrimental to the game's health itself.

I actually enjoyed that meta. I wish it was still possible so my Thor could function better without stripping it's armor off the legs.

But any IS meta is pointless to discuss because Clans completely changed this game. Not for the good IMO.

Edited by mogs01gt, 30 October 2015 - 05:08 AM.

[CDLord HHGD]

adamts01, on 30 October 2015 - 05:01 AM, said:

You're confusing war with sport. If someone pulls a knife on me in the street, I'm pulling my Glock. If I'm fighting someone in the dojo, I want an equal opponent. Completely different scenarios. For me it sucks going up against new players, I hate stomps. It's like hunting at the zoo. Most of the time I drive my Mist Lynx because I want a challenge. If you want to go around kicking puppies with your steel toes, whatever, I just don't know why you feel like bragging about it. And for all the puppies that get stuck in high tier games I feel sorry for them and us because they won't stick around and we won't have a game because of lost players.

You are my new favorite T1 person. Very well said.

[Lugh]

DarthRevis, on 29 October 2015 - 10:06 PM, said:

Stagnation very often leads to death actually....

Change, Evolove, Adapt or die.

Stock Loadouts from the 80s sounds like a great time .....What other games are these people playing that they use the same character and same weapons on the same sprite since the game started. If any other franchise did that people would burn them at the stake for being morons and recycling the damn product. lol

call of duty. Star wars battlefront. team fortress ii. Halo 1,2,3,4,5. Unreal.

[PholkLorr]

cdlord, on 30 October 2015 - 04:48 AM, said:

"We hate it and we only do it because it's allowed." HA! This one is a load of BS.

I never said I hated the meta. In fact, if your logic processor was working properly, you would have noticed that I said that I liked winning. And the best builds and playstyles increase my odds at winning, ergo, I like the meta.

That said, liking the current laser vomit is not mutually exclusive with the desire to see other crappy weapons buffed. Or seeing lasers nerfed.

cdlord, on 30 October 2015 - 04:48 AM, said:

"Doesn't matter what PGI does, we'll adapt." Guess this means you'll adapt while whining about it.

Yes. I'll use the best builds and playstyles to stomp my enemies, including but not limited to lousy players who choose to play either sub optimal builds or optimal builds. I will shoot a barb at these bad players once they start whining about losing because they used a sub optimal build.

cdlord, on 30 October 2015 - 04:48 AM, said:

"I deserve to have my fun like everyone else." Your "fun" is mutually exclusive it seems and is what is killing this game.

Another logical fail. If everyone deserves to have their fun, then anyone can make any build he likes. And that's what we have now. You are free to make substandard builds, I am free to make the best builds. Nothing mutually exclusive here.

Oh, do you mean that when a player who uses a good build demolishes you it's not fun? Awww. What to do? Ban good builds? Now look who's demanding fun exclusivity?

[Daelen Rottiger]

Daelen Rottiger, on 30 October 2015 - 04:37 AM, said:

So the point of this whole thread is that you like meta, you like to win and the "noobs" not playing meta should stop whining?

please?

[PholkLorr]

adamts01, on 30 October 2015 - 05:01 AM, said:

You're confusing war with sport. If someone pulls a knife on me in the street, I'm pulling my Glock. If I'm fighting someone in the dojo, I want an equal opponent. Completely different scenarios. For me it sucks going up against new players, I hate stomps. It's like hunting at the zoo. Most of the time I drive my Mist Lynx because I want a challenge. If you want to go around kicking puppies with your steel toes, whatever, I just don't know why you feel like bragging about it. And for all the puppies that get stuck in high tier games I feel sorry for them and us because they won't stick around and we won't have a game because of lost players.

If both sides agreed to a rule, then it is honorable to honor that rule. Eg. Both agreed to stock builds. Or both agreed to laser vomit.

If there isn't such a rule, and anyone can build any way they like, then I see no reason why I should purposely build my mech to gimp myself.

What if your sub optimal build is still better than a 6 mg build? Shall I then go whining about how your 2 ac2 1 uac5 1 ac20 2 small laser build is superior to my 6 mg build?
When will it end? The crappiest build whining that the crappier build is better than the crappiest build? The crappier build whining that the average build is better than the crappier build?

Why not just build something that is good?

PS. This game's slogan is called "the future is war".

[Mawai]

Random Carnage, on 30 October 2015 - 12:59 AM, said:

It would be nice if my Dire could not get its face melted off by every second light and most mediums.

LOL.

Several problems with this post

1) If a Dire gets its face melted off then the light/medium is standing in front of you ... that is usually a death sentence for a light/medium faced with a DWF unless the DWF has fitted mostly LRMs or the DWF pilot simply can't aim.

2) Your Dire would never get its face melted off by lights or mediums IF you were with your team mates since some of them are supposed to be supporting the assaults and they can easily deal with lights or mediums that get behind you or if you have trouble hitting them.

3) How can you possibly be tier 1 without knowing the above? I am guessing PSR does not mean what folks think it means.

[mogs01gt]

Mawai, on 30 October 2015 - 05:37 AM, said:

3) How can you possibly be tier 1 without knowing the above? I am guessing PSR does not mean what folks think it means.

Because tier1 light pilots in ACH's or FS9's will wreck pretty much any mech 1v1 unless their opponent has streaks.. Now if there are two ACH's, GG.

Edited by mogs01gt, 30 October 2015 - 05:42 AM.

[Clownwarlord]

I disagree, 100% with your opinion that lower skilled players are ruining this game.

In my opinion what ruins this game is high pin point alphas which are caused by weapon systems imbalance and mech chassis imbalance. This has nothing to do with weak or illogical people, but more to do with game development. So while you chastise and criticize players for their opinion by calling them weak and illogical; I will have to refute you based on your pre-assumption that this current game is how the game was intended to be.

PGI has continually stated that they are working to balance the weapon systems and mech chassis based on tonnage (so a 75 ton Timber Wolf is as powerful and balanced as a 75 ton Black Knight, or a 35 ton Jenner is as powerful and balanced as a 35 ton Raven, and so on and so). The player base has continually waited on PGI to get the game balanced and PGI has tried to continually balance the game with some mighty repercussions (lrm appoc due to splash damage, dual AC20 and 6 PPC before ghost heat, highlander and many other turned into hover jets instead of jump jets due to pop-tarting ...). To say that those times and this current state of meta being 40 to 60 if not more pin point alpha is fun is only for those who use it that abuse the intended mechanic of the game.

Here is what PGI has to say on the subject of "Exploiting"

To reiterate and clarify the Terms of Use on Prohibited Conduct: As an online game and an ongoing development, we do expect issues to be discovered by players. In cases where an issue can provide an unfair advantage, players are expected to refrain from manipulating these issues. Accidental triggering of an issue will rarely be of concern, though repeated abuse of any such issue reported to us will frequently be met with a warning or sanction. Intentionally joining a match for the sole purpose of disrupting gameplay through any means could be considered actionable.

The above copied, pasted, made bold, and enlarged print directly from http://mwomercs.com/...nduct-expanded/ here on the forums.

So this "Meta" does violate this policy that PGI has set forward, but the only actionable way outside of banning the mass populace is to fix the problem. Which again PGI has continually stated they are working on it with currently re-balancing, and I hope when they finish the entire re-balancing it will be one that works and lasts for a well extended period.

[Quicksilver Aberration]

PholkLorr, on 30 October 2015 - 05:36 AM, said:

PS. This game's slogan is called "the future is war".

Speaking of being illogical.....using a marketing slogan to "boost" your argument.....

[CDLord HHGD]

clownwarlord, on 30 October 2015 - 05:44 AM, said:

I disagree, 100% with your opinion that lower skilled players are ruining this game.

In my opinion what ruins this game is high pin point alphas which are caused by weapon systems imbalance and mech chassis imbalance. This has nothing to do with weak or illogical people, but more to do with game development. So while you chastise and criticize players for their opinion by calling them weak and illogical; I will have to refute you based on your pre-assumption that this current game is how the game was intended to be.

PGI has continually stated that they are working to balance the weapon systems and mech chassis based on tonnage (so a 75 ton Timber Wolf is as powerful and balanced as a 75 ton Black Knight, or a 35 ton Jenner is as powerful and balanced as a 35 ton Raven, and so on and so). The player base has continually waited on PGI to get the game balanced and PGI has tried to continually balance the game with some mighty repercussions (lrm appoc due to splash damage, dual AC20 and 6 PPC before ghost heat, highlander and many other turned into hover jets instead of jump jets due to pop-tarting ...). To say that those times and this current state of meta being 40 to 60 if not more pin point alpha is fun is only for those who use it that abuse the intended mechanic of the game.

Here is what PGI has to say on the subject of "Exploiting"

To reiterate and clarify the Terms of Use on Prohibited Conduct: As an online game and an ongoing development, we do expect issues to be discovered by players. In cases where an issue can provide an unfair advantage, players are expected to refrain from manipulating these issues. Accidental triggering of an issue will rarely be of concern, though repeated abuse of any such issue reported to us will frequently be met with a warning or sanction. Intentionally joining a match for the sole purpose of disrupting gameplay through any means could be considered actionable.

The above copied, pasted, made bold, and enlarged print directly from http://mwomercs.com/...nduct-expanded/ here on the forums.

So this "Meta" does violate this policy that PGI has set forward, but the only actionable way outside of banning the mass populace is to fix the problem. Which again PGI has continually stated they are working on it with currently re-balancing, and I hope when they finish the entire re-balancing it will be one that works and lasts for a well extended period.

[Kjudoon]

adamts01, on 30 October 2015 - 05:01 AM, said:

You're confusing war with sport. If someone pulls a knife on me in the street, I'm pulling my Glock. If I'm fighting someone in the dojo, I want an equal opponent. Completely different scenarios. For me it sucks going up against new players, I hate stomps. It's like hunting at the zoo. Most of the time I drive my Mist Lynx because I want a challenge. If you want to go around kicking puppies with your steel toes, whatever, I just don't know why you feel like bragging about it. And for all the puppies that get stuck in high tier games I feel sorry for them and us because they won't stick around and we won't have a game because of lost players.

You get it. That's good to see. Seriously.

PholkLorr, on 30 October 2015 - 05:36 AM, said:

If both sides agreed to a rule, then it is honorable to honor that rule. Eg. Both agreed to stock builds. Or both agreed to laser vomit.

If there isn't such a rule, and anyone can build any way they like, then I see no reason why I should purposely build my mech to gimp myself.

What if your sub optimal build is still better than a 6 mg build? Shall I then go whining about how your 2 ac2 1 uac5 1 ac20 2 small laser build is superior to my 6 mg build?
When will it end? The crappiest build whining that the crappier build is better than the crappiest build? The crappier build whining that the average build is better than the crappier build?

Why not just build something that is good?

PS. This game's slogan is called "the future is war".

When did running meta become a 'rule' agreed upon? It is a methodology, not a rule. It can be ignored at the whim of the player and suffer no official repudiation for it.

When did exploits and erroneous game features become rules that people agreed to? A mistake is not an intent, and it should be corrected to meet intent. Was not the LRMpocalypse a mistake exploited for a short period then thankfully reversed? Was it unfair to abuse that? What about the 12man breach into the public queues when organized teams were making 100 games to 0 roflstomps against pugs and the community had to band together and say no more till PGI fixed the mistake? Perfectly legitimate in your apparent vision and never should have been reversed. We all should just have 'gotten good'.

What you are defending is of the same moral level as getting away with a crime on a technicality. It makes no difference functionally or ethically whether it is just a speeding ticket or defrauding a pension fund ruining the lives of millions. It is still abusing a flaw in the system for personal gain at the expense of others. This... attitude... is only a dim Neitzsche-esque reflection of that same immorality.

Yes, you are adhering to the LETTER of the law, but not the SPIRIT. This seems to be the growing blight on gaming as a whole or at least across every online game I encounter, I see it. The argument "If I can get away with it, it's legal. If it benefits me, I deem it good" has grabbed hold of the current zeitgeist of gaming culture. Is this the moral core of gamers? The 'ubermensch' or in gaming parlance 'l33t' are above condemnation because nobody can compete with them, and the rules just hold them back? If it is, then we are a far more depraved and wretched lot than I ever dared condemn us as.

Thankfully, I don't believe it's universally true and is reversible, because I game with many good people and see it is only a visible minority attempting to set the tone and control the language.

I do not agree to your interpretation of the application of the rules and choose instead of just using the letter of the rule, but the spirit as well. Just because something is legal or permitted does not make it right, moral or good. In the end, PGI is the final arbiter of what is allowed in the game; What is legal. What is the intent.

Not you.

Not us.

Thank God for that.

PS: This is a game. Not war. There is no real honor at stake. No real valor. No real sacrifice. No heroes. This is just playing pretend. If anyone believes it is they are in need of professional help. No, really. Good and honest gameplay among peers is one thing. This is all it is.

Edit: after reading some more of these posts here by players, I have to say I am encouraged at the blanket repudiation of this l33t attitude. I guess in one ill conceived way, this discussion will end up being a benefit to the community in spite of the original intent.

Edited by Kjudoon, 30 October 2015 - 06:14 AM.

[Dread Render]

Its good to hear truth.
It just rings nicely in my ears.

[Ted Wayz]

What destroys the game is people not funding it. I don't care if you're a self entitled try hard or a newb.

If the "meta" does not promote sales then it is ilogical developers that are the problem.

The more time we spend going after sub groups of the community and not PGI just makes us look dumb.

Edited by Ted Wayz, 30 October 2015 - 06:48 AM.

[adamts01]

Ted Wayz, on 30 October 2015 - 06:46 AM, said:

What destroys the game is people not funding it. I don't care if you're a self entitled try hard or a newb.

If the "meta" does not promote sales then it is ilogical developers that are the problem.

The more time we spend going after sub groups of the community and not PGI just makes us look dumb.

We'll... Yeah..... But if we didn't hack out problems here how would anyone know what the problems were to begin with? Granted this post was little more than bragging about beating toddlers at connect four.