64 replies to this topic

[FupDup]

TWIAFU, on 05 November 2015 - 02:00 PM, said:

Let's just make ALL weapons, Clan and IS, the same.

Make there is absolutely no difference between the two. So Vets and new players will not have a hard time, make it so ALL weapons fire the same distance from now on, only difference is the damage they do. Small laser will fire the same distance as ER, just do small laser damage. To make it easy for Vets and new players, they dont have to press R any more, just have to hover reticle over target for auto target.

Balance armor tween all weight classes. To make it easy for Vets and new players, all classes, clan and IS, have the same armor, cant be changed, no quirks, and is max. So for now on, all Mediums, Clan and IS, have same armor value.

Strawman argument is strawman.

[Clit Beastwood]

Fierostetz, on 05 November 2015 - 01:40 PM, said:

Recent ill-conceived changes have, for the first time, really made me rethink my future with the game. Too many sesquipedalian mechanics are anti-fun and anti-noob, two things that a game really can't be. Just take away mode/map choice and create casual and ranked game modes - then TT enthusiasts and lore junkies can have fun playing against each other in casual while more competitive players can play against others like them. It sure would help to alleviate some of the balance issues.

I know I'm replying to my own post

For a long time I've been all about community, spending time at NGNG and Comstar helping new guys learn to play (and getting made fun of by other old schoolers), even spent some time with CWI teaching Sibkins how to play. I've long held the view that if we love this game, and we want it to stick around, we need to help grow the userbase. We grow the userbase by telling people about it. We grow the userbase by making youtube videos. We grow the userbase by finding new players and helping them get the hang of it before they quit - it *used* to feel worth doing, but over the last ~6 months I've noticed a change... toxicity is slowly creeping into my personality, i've become jaded, I'm less tolerant of new guys (and gals)... I don't like that it's happened, but I can identify why - in my endeavors I come across players that use the testing grounds, that spend time learning, that read and watch videos and do everything they can to improve - those ones grow and flourish. I've also come across people that refuse to put in the time, refuse to learn, refuse to admit that there might be a way better than theirs - and those are the people that the game is being balanced for. They can't hang because they don't put in effort or refuse to adapt, so they climb atop their soapboxes and decry the evils of the other players demanding nerfs... and all because they won't put in the time and effort. You *earn* your way through life, and I think our modern society of participation trophies and "there are no losers" mentality has just ruined people. It makes me sad, and I see it ultimately running this game into the ground. People don't know what they want long-term, they only know what they want RIGHT NOW.

[Alan Davion]

TWIAFU, on 05 November 2015 - 02:00 PM, said:

Let's just make ALL weapons, Clan and IS, the same.

Make there is absolutely no difference between the two. So Vets and new players will not have a hard time, make it so ALL weapons fire the same distance from now on, only difference is the damage they do. Small laser will fire the same distance as ER, just do small laser damage. To make it easy for Vets and new players, they dont have to press R any more, just have to hover reticle over target for auto target.

Balance armor tween all weight classes. To make it easy for Vets and new players, all classes, clan and IS, have the same armor, cant be changed, no quirks, and is max. So for now on, all Mediums, Clan and IS, have same armor value.

So...

MWO: Dark Age?

Yeah, screw that noise.

[M3 SABLE]

Alan Davion, on 05 November 2015 - 02:36 PM, said:

So...

MWO: Dark Age?

Yeah, screw that noise.

lol

MWO: 1984

MWO: Harrison Bergeron

[Mister Blastman]

JigglyMoobs, on 05 November 2015 - 01:49 PM, said:

problem is lights will become super op.

I think even simpler solution is to increase armor stats so that everyone can survive an extra round of alpha

AC/20 is the great light 'mech equalizer. I've never seen them run faster from anything else.

[cSand]

Mister Blastman, on 05 November 2015 - 02:40 PM, said:

AC/20 is the great light 'mech equalizer. I've never seen them run faster from anything else.

and trashing a light with an AC20 is just so damn satisfying

[Clit Beastwood]

Mister Blastman, on 05 November 2015 - 02:40 PM, said:

AC/20 is the great light 'mech equalizer. I've never seen them run faster from anything else.

I do wish a hit squarely to the nuts would make a locusts legs and arms fly off in all directions. And I say that as the one usually driving the locust

[Saint Scarlett Johan]

Mister Blastman, on 05 November 2015 - 02:40 PM, said:

AC/20 is the great light 'mech equalizer. I've never seen them run faster from anything else.

So is a goose rifle or battery of streaks.

[FupDup]

Lord Scarlett Johan, on 05 November 2015 - 02:46 PM, said:

So is a goose rifle or battery of streaks.

Or a Wubshee...

[M3 SABLE]

Mister Blastman, on 05 November 2015 - 02:40 PM, said:

AC/20 is the great light 'mech equalizer. I've never seen them run faster from anything else.

Maybe you are super good, i don't know. However, scoring a light that runs perpendicularly to your cone of fire, with an AC20, is not that easy.

And it will be even harder without skill trees that buffed the torso twists to allow that to happen.

[JigglyMoobs]

Mister Blastman, on 05 November 2015 - 02:40 PM, said:

AC/20 is the great light 'mech equalizer. I've never seen them run faster from anything else.

Only because it's too late to run from AC/40.

At 0:42 :

Edited by JigglyMoobs, 05 November 2015 - 02:56 PM.

[Saint Scarlett Johan]

Unikron, on 05 November 2015 - 02:51 PM, said:

Maybe you are super good, i don't know. However, scoring a light that runs perpendicularly to your cone of fire, with an AC20, is not that easy.

And it will be even harder without skill trees that buffed the torso twists to allow that to happen.

Depends on what you're using it on. Assaults are a very anticipation based playstyle, you have to learn to anticipate what the enemy is going to do and be there first. Lights are very much the same way in that what separates a mediocre light from a great light is how well the pilot anticipates the situation, same for assaults.

On the flipside, Mediums and Heavies are both weightclasses that allow reactionary piloting to excel almost as much as anticipative piloting.

Edited by Lord Scarlett Johan, 05 November 2015 - 03:02 PM.

[Koniving]

Alistair Winter, on 05 November 2015 - 12:14 PM, said:

I wonder if the learning curve for MWO in 2016 is going to be steeper than what most of us veterans experienced in 2012. Maybe too steep, in fact. In particular, I wonder if the new method of balancing lasers is going to be too difficult for new players to understand.

Is it too counterintuitive? Or will both veterans and new players learn to deal with this mechanic fairly quickly?

Difficult to understand? Not really. Press R to Enable damage.

Counter-intuitive? Quite so. However, I can see the reason. Rather than actually fixing high alpha strike potential from lasers by limiting capacity, PGI has opted a "Press R to do damage" mechanic in that you must be able to target the enemy with information in order to do full damage at your given range.

If this mech sucks at sensor-ship, then this mech is going to suck with lasers, too! Though you can use your allies to get the sensor stuff for you so that your lasers can be calibrated to go "DIE MOTHA BEEPA" instead of "Peeeew."

Just means it's time to pack more of the overpowered autocannons. Nothing like a single shot to kill every single enemy you encounter; just aim for the whites of their eyes.

Edited by Koniving, 05 November 2015 - 03:09 PM.

[Mister Blastman]

cSand, on 05 November 2015 - 02:41 PM, said:

and trashing a light with an AC20 is just so damn satisfying

I love putting a hot load on their chest.

JigglyMoobs, on 05 November 2015 - 02:55 PM, said:

Only because it's too late to run from AC/40.

At 0:42 :

Pull!

[Mister Blastman]

Unikron, on 05 November 2015 - 02:51 PM, said:

Maybe you are super good, i don't know. However, scoring a light that runs perpendicularly to your cone of fire, with an AC20, is not that easy.

And it will be even harder without skill trees that buffed the torso twists to allow that to happen.

I smack lights with AC/20 all the time. Nothing makes them run away faster... well, except streaks. But streaks aren't as satisfying.

Edited by Mister Blastman, 05 November 2015 - 03:18 PM.

[sycocys]

Fortunately for the new players PGI actually figured out how to make a tutorial, now they will just need to update it when mechanics change.

[Ex Atlas Overlord]

If using a base number of your choice (the weapon you're picking) and figuring out what your two ranges are (optimal locked and optimal unlocked) is your definition of "too hard" and "so complicated".... then I hope you're not in charge of something that affects people lives IRL.

[Love in an Annihilator]

sycocys, on 05 November 2015 - 03:24 PM, said:

Fortunately for the new players PGI actually figured out how to make a tutorial, now they will just need to update it when mechanics change.

The current Tutorial is a nice start, but a proper Tutorial for MWO that doesn't leave a new player at a major (dare I say 'unfair') disadvantage would take about 3 hours... .

Battletech is complex and that's a good thing, but we have many needlessly complicated mechanics already and it keeps getting worse with this laser nonsense.

[SethAbercromby]

sycocys, on 05 November 2015 - 03:24 PM, said:

Fortunately for the new players PGI actually figured out how to make a tutorial, now they will just need to update it when mechanics change.

That is a weak argument. A game should not require players to study flowcharts just to actually start playing and this is where the game is moving. The weapon list and hardpoint limitations are already a deep subject on their own, add on top of that the (still mostly invisible) ghost heat scale and now the various effective sensor and laser ranges to drive off some sort of meta boogeyman and when I'm expected to do Eve-levels of preperation and flowchart crunching into just choosing a 'Mech to play, what should I tell newcomers into the game? "what you're feeling right now is perfectly normal with that steep of a learning curve. It can only get worse from here"?

[Omaha]

Steam launch, you guys should be happy! It's more meat for the grinder!