81 replies to this topic

[Malleus011]

Excellent! More like that, please.

[Koniving]

Gas Guzzler, on 09 November 2015 - 11:08 AM, said:

I don't know guys. The TTK depicted in this lore snip is diabolically low. I mean really, a couple LLs and AC5s ( with enough accuracy to focus a component) is all it takes to cripple a Victor that quickly? I thought mechs were supposed to shrug off shot after shot for 10 minutes straight, or so people on the forums say all the time. Not to mention putting an entire alpha (it is said that alpha strikes almost never happen in lore) into one component (also said to almost never happen on lore). Could it be that this is all fluff for fun and has no real bearing in MWO?

It's closer to 1 to 3 minutes in single versus single combat -- unless the terrain is really complicated. That said -- the Victor would have butchered the Rifleman -- Rifleman battlemechs are anti-air akin to the Jagermech. Yes, Rifleman can stand toe to toe against other mechs better than the very soft Jagermech successor, but while it can stand more abuse the heat causes other issues (there's a good chance the Rifleman pilot will lose consciousness before the Rifleman perishes with full heat rules such as heatsink taxation; dang thing would melt itself down. Victor kinda has a similar problem though.)

The Phoenix versus Clan Invasion Wave 1 (first four) match that me and Lordred did with double blind rules and a small original Forest Colony sized area with forestry and some buildings in the center along a road going both ways.... lasted 6 minutes and some seconds (Locust, Shadowhawk, Thunderbolt, Battlemaster versus Dire Wolf [which did the Kool Aid man and burst through a building for a surprise attack], Kit Fox, Nova, and Summoner. Of the Clan mechs, Nova and Summoner did the best, Nova got all the kills for the team and had the last stand on one leg, one side torso, one arm...and perished due to pilot exhaustion with only 3 double heatsinks and 1 ER medium laser remaining; the Battlemaster was mint condition and took 4 days to repair with all supplies on hand. Thunderbolt and Summoner both exploded due to catastrophic engine failure [caused by the Summoner]. Shadowhawk perished by Nova after SHK and Battlemaster kicked the Dire Wolf in the leg, breaking all four actuators in a 10 second period; the Nova used 6 ER ML, at 30% power [3 damage/1 heat each] due to having lost its side torso in the Thor's explosion [the building under it collapsing didn't help at all!])

Details shown here, it spans SEVERAL posts and I wrote up a big breakdown by each 10 seconds. Numerous screenshots.


The second attempt, using Resistance + Phoenix Reinforcements versus Clan Wave I second tier (Adder through Warhawk) lasted less than 3 minutes, and all IS mechs were slaughtered. Adder had most of the kills. However, terrain and conditions allowed for rooftop combat (all hardened reinforced buildings), mech climbing was enabled for the Adder [who did most of the killing, sometimes with single shots of ER PPC so that a shot is thrown at two different targets]. Also, unlike the first example...this time double blind (got to find each other) was not enabled and thus everyone knew where everyone was. No information warfare.

In lore, mechs can withstand a lot because there's little front loaded damage (Gauss rifles, PPCs, missiles...that's it). Lasers are usually several hits to get its rating, ACs are usually oversized machine guns [akin to naval cannons and anti-air weapons], and "1 round" is a shortcut on a 1980s style CRT monitor to save space, when it's really 1 cassette as in an encased cylindrical magazine....which can be anywhere from 4 to 100 bullets [Inner Sphere AC/20]). In tabletop, it's quick because front loaded damage scattered by random chance (not pinpoint) to simulate mechs moving, dodging etc. while fighting in 10 second summaries. In MWO it's some front loaded and some not-as-front-loaded damage at anywhere from 3x to almost 30x the damage rating per weapon (depending on the weapon and quirks) in a 10 second period with extreme pinpoint (against double the structure armor and then some due to quirks).

------

I should also add that every lore story posted here is custom written for MWO.
Below is how quick you can slaughter mechs in MWO with a large laser and twin AC/10s (and a smidgen of help.)

Edited by Koniving, 09 November 2015 - 02:31 PM.

[Ventarles]

Can we get arena mode please. 2v2 1v1 and 3v3 would be awesome on small coloseum map's

[Repasy Cooper]

Gas Guzzler, on 09 November 2015 - 11:08 AM, said:

I don't know guys. The TTK depicted in this lore snip is diabolically low. I mean really, a couple LLs and AC5s ( with enough accuracy to focus a component) is all it takes to cripple a Victor that quickly? I thought mechs were supposed to shrug off shot after shot for 10 minutes straight, or so people on the forums say all the time. Not to mention putting an entire alpha (it is said that alpha strikes almost never happen in lore) into one component (also said to almost never happen on lore). Could it be that this is all fluff for fun and has no real bearing in MWO?

It's misleading, but true all the same. In tabletop BT, it really doesn't take much to cripple a mech. In some scenarios, conventional tanks can be more helpful than battlemechs.

In MWO, they doubled the armor ratings across the board to increase TTK, as well as dialed down the strength of some weapons. Remember when the Clan ER PPC used to be 15 pinpoint dmg, like tabletop?

[Kageru Ikazuchi]

Thanks for this. We've been missing the lore and backstories for a long time, and this is much appreciated.

Gripe / Feedback in the below spoiler

Spoiler

PGI, this is anther example of stuff you occasionally do very well. If you did this every time with the same passion and a bit more attention to detail ("excepting" ... really?), we might be more inclined to believe that you are actually interested in the BT universe. That you care about us as fans, and not just customers.

It would be really cool if this type of stuff could be gathered into one well-organized, indexed, searchable section of the website ... call it Technical Readout: Online or something.

[Alistair Winter]

Thank you so much for this! Please make more! The game really needs the lore, and these orthographic blueprints are greatly appreciated.

Do you guys at PGI have similar orthographics for every mech in the game?

[Rum Duke]

Love it. As others have mentioned it's this kinda stuff that really brings it all to life.

[N0MAD]

Kageru Ikazuchi, on 09 November 2015 - 02:57 PM, said:

Thanks for this. We've been missing the lore and backstories for a long time, and this is much appreciated.

PGI, this is anther example of stuff you occasionally do very well.

Only reason its done well as you say is because PGI didnt do it..

[Duncan Aravain]

Well, Legend Killer was described quite different in the original books; I doubt that Grey Norton would have battled in a purple mech..just not his style. He was called Legend Killer because he prided himself in taking down the puffed up mechwarriors of Solaris and his emblem was a ghost in the crosshairs, ala Ghostbusters. HIs background and subsequent story of his death by Justin Allard-Liao was very interesting and his ability of defeating assault class mechs was also explored a bit.....

but a purple mech for Grey Norton?

[DAYLEET]

Im happy we are going back to the story days with new chassis. But please stop using the word vomit.

[TheSilken]

Twilight Fenrir, on 09 November 2015 - 12:01 PM, said:

You're confusing table top rules with real world ones...

A leg has xx tons of armor... That's distributed across the entire length of the leg.....

I always thought of armor value as the thickness of the armor placed upon the component similar to a tank. Then as it takes damage it gets more and more compromised until it is eventually not combat effective. Oh well.

I don't see how the fall damage is enough to knock out the leg though, it still has 11 points of structure after the alpha and even if you perform a failed jump jet maneuver and crash I think the highest damage is what 10 points? Well even if the leg is taken off the mech can still fight from the ground. Gray was fairly close to the Victor so there was no reason to stop fighting. The only plausible explanation is that the Victor pilot was knocked unconscious from the crash and that is what ended the fight.

Edited by TheSilken, 09 November 2015 - 05:42 PM.

[Tarl Cabot]

Love it!!

Though on the other hand, that would never happen in MWO cause the Victor would not be able to jump that high....

[Sereglach]

The cooperation between HBS, CGL, and PGI is fascinating. While a PGI and HBS relationship is expected (the license that both hold comes from Microsoft for digital IP rights), having CGL in the mix -especially with the recently growing levels of involvement- was not expected (especially with PGI doing their own reimaging of the classics, and not just copying CGL). It makes me wonder if it could lead to greater things in the long run.

Regardless, the short story for presenting the Rifleman was excellent. I wonder if we'll see similar things for the other classics, both already announced and sitting in the queue. I miss these kinds of introductions for mechs, that we used to get with every release back before PGI's shift to packages (Don't get me wrong, however, I love the package deals . . . the monetary value in them is amazing!).

[The Boneshaman]

Yes TheSilken he could have blown of the leg. In TT if you do even 1 point of damage to the internal you get to roll chance for critical hit. If you roll a 12 you blow off the head, legs or arms. If it is a torso you hit 3 locations in that location. even in lore I have read an arm or leg getting shot at the joint ripping it off with out the armor ever getting truly compromised.

[Arkhangel]

also, the thing to remember is he's in a Solaris match. you don't have to completely destroy a mech or kill the pilot. disabling it can usually be enough.

[bayoucowboy]

Thank you PGI and CGL and R.N. Bills for the nice piece. Enjoyed his writing in the Battletech books (sadly original copies donated to local library years ago). Hope to see more fiction incorporated into the game

[SgtMagor]

had good times with the Rifleman in Mw4, think I used 4-AC2 some medium lasers. and bigger engine. 4-Ac2 with pinpoint accuracy was deadly. hope PGI does something with the Ac2's...I really like this mech even though there's no jump jets heh!, hoping it lives up to the hype

[Tahawus]

Repasy, on 09 November 2015 - 02:32 PM, said:

Remember when the Clan ER PPC used to be 15 pinpoint dmg, like tabletop?

Nope, because it never did in MWO. They split the damage to components before releasing the clans.

[ExAstra]

Juodas Varnas, on 09 November 2015 - 10:48 AM, said:

Right click > Open image in a new tab

No no no no. I mean high-resolution. Not wallpaper size.

Gas Guzzler, on 09 November 2015 - 11:08 AM, said:

I don't know guys. The TTK depicted in this lore snip is diabolically low. I mean really, a couple LLs and AC5s ( with enough accuracy to focus a component) is all it takes to cripple a Victor that quickly? I thought mechs were supposed to shrug off shot after shot for 10 minutes straight, or so people on the forums say all the time. Not to mention putting an entire alpha (it is said that alpha strikes almost never happen in lore) into one component (also said to almost never happen on lore). Could it be that this is all fluff for fun and has no real bearing in MWO?

Don't forget that armor values in MWO have been doubled - meaning that all weapons have their damage output nerfed by 0.5x. An AC/5 is essentially an AC/2 by Tabletop Standards. An AC/20 is only an AC/10 by TT. etc.
But yes, it is fluff for fun, because that is what fluff is for. I'll take an easily crippled Victor over a "Phantom Mech"

[AriCri]

Ok ok I'm going to buy it.... I could feel "The Grey Noton awakens"!!

Edited by AriCri, 10 November 2015 - 12:21 AM.