224 replies to this topic

[Jun Watarase]

Competitive players dont enjoy free wins and pubs dont enjoy rigged matches either. When every match ends in the 12 man team spawn camping the pub team with a 3 or 4 to 1 kill ratio, where is the fun?

This is exactly like how MWO was at launch when it was 8 mans getting free wins over and over because there was no matchmaking to speak of.

Why do you do this PGI? Why do you refuse to put teams of the same skill level and organization against each other and just keep allowing people to get free wins?

This is a totally fair and balanced match up guys. Hey, why don't we hold tournaments that consist purely of organized teams vs randoms, instead of pitting organized teams vs each other? Sounds like a great idea?

Edited by Jun Watarase, 15 November 2015 - 04:44 AM.

[VanguardMk1]

Then don't be a pug. Get some unit members together, use Teamspeak or VOIP, use LFG and just group up with some coordination! CW is meant for teamwork, so get a team together.

[Jun Watarase]

VanguardMk1, on 15 November 2015 - 04:43 AM, said:

Then don't be a pug. Get some unit members together, use Teamspeak or VOIP, use LFG and just group up with some coordination! CW is meant for teamwork, so get a team together.

>you are not allowed to enjoy an event unless you spend time organizing a group with 11 other highly skilled players

This sounds like a great idea! I'm sure it will appeal to the majority of players out there. What could possibly go wrong?

[TWIAFU]

Jun Watarase, on 15 November 2015 - 04:45 AM, said:

>you are not allowed to enjoy an event unless you spend time organizing a group with 11 other highly skilled players

This sounds like a great idea! I'm sure it will appeal to the majority of players out there. What could possibly go wrong?

A ONLY part of the game designed primarily FOR Group and Unit play and there is something wrong with it because solo's wont take part in it?

Only thing wrong here is people not grouping up and using the tools asked for to compete with larger groups.

Plenty goes wrong when you do not take part in the core part of this game mode.

CW is NOT solo queue.

[Elizander]

This isn't new. Unless we get a huge population boost or they get to add in AI for people to shoot, it's not going to change overnight. As for this event, as a pug, I'd just focus on getting the numbers needed to win the prizes. If I have trouble getting that one win, I'd maybe (at the end) try to find a group to increase the chances of that happening.

Bringing it up again is okay, but I doubt anything will happen before this event is done so just get your prizes and get out rather than tearing your hair out over a string of losses.

[Pjwned]

The answer is that you don't bother with CW, event or no, until it's no longer a piece of crap.

It'll be a while still.

[Lightfoot]

Number one. The ability of PUGs to compete vs 12 mans ended when LRMs were nerfed in January of 2015. Prior to that in Nov-Dec 2014 LRMs were much better and aided team members supporting each other. Once LRMs were nerfed so intensely that Laser-Vomit-Brawl became the only way to win, CW went to the sole domain of 12-mans coordinating focus-fire on voice coms. Tukkiyad proved this would always be so.

The reason for this is that CW embeds a defensive maze terrain map into the gameplay. LRMs counter terrain while not being as destructive as direct-fire. Unless of course they are nerfed out of any competitive functionality which PGI did in January 2015, either on purpose or by accident. And this killed CW for PUGs. I played CW constantly in Nov-Dec 2014 with PUGs and we did ok vs 12 mans, but 2015's first patch did something to LRMs which removed LRMs as a serious threat and tipped the balance to 12 man-only.

The way to restore PUG vs 12 man competitiveness is to make a second CW gametype that presents a normal map terrain that is neutral to both teams with an objective both teams share. No maze, no cannon to defend or destroy. That game required tactical weapons like LRMs which could defeat terrain, and is dead, to be brutally honest.

[StraferX]

I have not played CW for many months now and made the decision to jump in the pug queue to get that plasma ball and the hanging air freshener. I completed the entire challenge in 5 drops and so far have done 10 drops. We pugs won a few had a few very close good matches and had a few total massacre's.

I stopped playing CW for several reasons mostly due to that the maps are weak and mode pointless, second because it's not very fun unless you are in a group and what makes that fun is the comradery. While CW its normally a stomp fest the biggest problem I see is that those in the pub queue have no clue about team armor or team tactics.

Possibly one of the only things that will help this is that one can not join the CW pug queue until they completes a CW training campaign and is taught how it works.

[StraferX]

Lightfoot, on 15 November 2015 - 05:14 AM, said:

Number one. The ability of PUGs to compete vs 12 mans ended when LRMs were nerfed in January of 2015. Prior to that in Nov-Dec 2014 LRMs were much better and aided team members supporting each other. Once LRMs were nerfed so intensely that Laser-Vomit-Brawl became the only way to win, CW went to the sole domain of 12-mans coordinating focus-fire on voice coms. Tukkiyad proved this would always be so.

The reason for this is that CW embeds a defensive maze terrain map into the gameplay. LRMs counter terrain while not being as destructive as direct-fire. Unless of course they are nerfed out of any competitive functionality which PGI did in January 2015, either on purpose or by accident. And this killed CW for PUGs. I played CW constantly in Nov-Dec 2014 with PUGs and we did ok vs 12 mans, but 2015's first patch did something to LRMs which removed LRMs as a serious threat and tipped the balance to 12 man-only.

The way to restore PUG vs 12 man competitiveness is to make a second CW gametype that presents a normal map terrain that is neutral to both teams with an objective both teams share. No maze, no cannon to defend or destroy. That game required tactical weapons like LRMs which could defeat terrain, and is dead, to be brutally honest.

I disagree with this very much as my weekend experience reflected that when I pug dropped against a clanner group that only had a couple clanner lrms the pugs mopped house however almost every match the clanners relied heavily on lrm's and caused total destruction. Clanners rely on lrms and super high alpha.

[El Bandito]

I got all my awards except the match score one, pugging on the IS side. My contract will be over tomorrow so I am gonna join the Clans, ride the coat tails of either (228) or (-MS-), and get the last reward.

[Lightfoot]

StraferX, on 15 November 2015 - 05:30 AM, said:

I disagree with this very much as my weekend experience reflected that when I pug dropped against a clanner group that only had a couple clanner lrms the pugs mopped house however almost every match the clanners relied heavily on lrm's and caused total destruction. Clanners rely on lrms and super high alpha.

That's what I said. LRMs are not effective anymore. This hurts PUGs much more than 12 mans for the previously stated reasons.

Edited by Lightfoot, 15 November 2015 - 05:54 AM.

[Triordinant]

CW was designed for the 5% or less of the MWO population that drops in organized premade groups of 5 or more. Don't fall for the bait and be cannon fodder for them. CW events are the best time to drop with a friend or two in the public group queue while the big organized premades fight each other in a separate CW "cage". The best way to make sure they fight ONLY each other is to make sure they're the only ones in there.

[STEF_]

Jun Watarase, on 15 November 2015 - 04:38 AM, said:

Competitive players dont enjoy free wins and pubs dont enjoy rigged matches either. When every match ends in the 12 man team spawn camping the pub team with a 3 or 4 to 1 kill ratio, where is the fun?

This is exactly like how MWO was at launch when it was 8 mans getting free wins over and over because there was no matchmaking to speak of.

Why do you do this PGI? Why do you refuse to put teams of the same skill level and organization against each other and just keep allowing people to get free wins?

This is a totally fair and balanced match up guys. Hey, why don't we hold tournaments that consist purely of organized teams vs randoms, instead of pitting organized teams vs each other? Sounds like a great idea?

Carry harder

[GreyNovember]

It'd be nice if people actually accepted the 1v1 requests I put out, when a match's winner is already decided after the first wave of 12-3.

Admittedly, it's the fishiest sounding proposal I'd imagine someone saying, but when you're clearly going to lose, why not get some points?

[Karmen Baric]

Pugging in all my matches, used LFG and went to FRR TS and had a ball, had many victories even against sides with more members of teams than us. Also had some times i didnt use LFG and dropped with randoms not on TS and still had fun getting 1500 or so damage each game as long as i got some kills too.

Hate to say it but if you cant be bothered trying to be competitive then its your own fault.
Im guessing you want a CW mode where you play brain dead bots that you can just smash down all day long.

[Ghogiel]

On Friday I completed the event solo in 6 matches.

Then I joined a 12man and farmed pugs, many were in trial mechs... which would have made them quit the game mode depopulating the queue except for PGI dangling a carrot out there for them, so they kept swarming into the pug zapper to get farmed.

When dangling free MC and mechbays as rewards and allowing the game mode to fill up with noob pugs in trial mechs wanting to fill out their account more. When anyone else does bother to group up or play in the game mode, which is pretty much during events only, they get to farm said pugs.

Just don't come to CW only during events just to farm rewards and then get salty when everyone else is doing the exact same thing. If you are a CW regular then you should be complaining about how events are ruining the (lifeless and barren) ecosystem in CW.

Edited by Ghogiel, 15 November 2015 - 06:20 AM.

[Coolant]

well i think probably the worst thing is 8-10 groups not wearing tags so it appears they aren't a team. It's deceptive and dirty and those units should feel ashamed of pulling such a stunt.

It's gonna be the same thing when Steam players arrive. Units are gonna stomp them into the ground driving them away both in regular matches and in CW. CW will again be a ghost town until CW Phase 3.

[Ghogiel]

Coolant, on 15 November 2015 - 06:20 AM, said:

well i think probably the worst thing is 8-10 groups not wearing tags so it appears they aren't a team. It's deceptive and dirty and those units should feel ashamed of pulling such a stunt.

Sounds like they probably aren't even in a unit.They are probably adhoc groups formed off of a house/clan hub TS/ LFG. Which is what people should be doing when not affiliated with a unit or friendly with other units to group with.

[oldradagast]

Jun Watarase, on 15 November 2015 - 04:38 AM, said:

Competitive players dont enjoy free wins and pubs dont enjoy rigged matches either. When every match ends in the 12 man team spawn camping the pub team with a 3 or 4 to 1 kill ratio, where is the fun?

This is exactly like how MWO was at launch when it was 8 mans getting free wins over and over because there was no matchmaking to speak of.

Back when CW was launched, this problem became immediately apparent - casuals and PUG's were being stomped over and over by coordinated 12-mans. Those of us who understand the problems this would create rightly protested this poor design and asked for some level of match-making. Unfortunately, we were shouted down by an endless clown-car full of try-hards who felt that stomps and seal-clubbing were all a "vital part of the high-skill CW environment." This was followed up with expectations that "everyone" would just magic up a whole pile of new friends to form a unit or have some strange desire to join the unit that just stomped them (while often loudly commenting on how "sucky noobs should stay out of CW.") The parting shot was, of course, "git gud or git rekted."

None of the dim-bulbs realized that most players didn't "git gud or git rekted" - they simply decided to stop playing CW and no longer spent any time trying to get the format fixed because they were tired of being shouted down about it. PGI, naturally, saw no reason to correct the lack of match-making at that point since the format's small surviving player base seemed fine with it. Only now that there's any incentive for casuals and PUG's to again tip-toe back into CW do we again see the problems the format has brought to light. Too bad nothing will be done about it.

[Karmen Baric]

oldradagast, on 15 November 2015 - 06:33 AM, said:

blah blah blah

I didnt know anyone coming into this game yet buy playing CW with LFG and on FRR TS i got friend invites, unit invites and many people in last few days which i can chat and play with in group and have had lots of fun.


I dont know why its so hard a thing to play with multiple people in an online multiplayer game, maybe you should try solitaire?