364 replies to this topic

[Bishop Steiner]

CoffiNail, on 17 November 2015 - 04:36 AM, said:

Umm we did complain. In phase 1 all the major Clan loyalists had tried to get alliances and coalitions going.. Mercs kept ******* it up, because again, mercs playing for Clans make sense in the lore... What happened to the clan loyalist, you know the icon they made before CW launch, the clan faction that was going to be Clans 'mercs'? Pgi main core audience of mercs were again catered too. **** the clan faction, we have some who want to play both Mechs types, well mercs can switch between factions right? Lore is fine with Clans hiring mercs, right? I am sorry you want to play both teams Mechs go pug, you want to play a CW game, go Clan or inner sphere, play pure tech, enjoy the game.. Instead they gave mercs the freedom to **** the game over how ever they wanted... And they did and ruined it for most other people. After Tukayyid CGBI had always struggled to get people to play CW, as it is riddled with the real power creep, has no lore in it and was and still is the exact same crap every game. People go the same routes, bring the same Mechs... Yes so much fun.

Ya know, I fought for the whole honor pool thing, and such. And lore, and all that. I was less bothered with the changes to the clan mechs due the needs for an FPS. And the fact that aside from the Light Side, Clan Mechs are still better (I do run both after all).

But whenever Russ got ensnared in dreams of casuals flocking to support the "great Stompy Bot ESport"..... is when that part went to the trash. And sadly, it ain't gonna recover. And no...it's not even fun for us IS Lore guys, in that regard. Because lore doesn't matter. This is Unreal TOurnament, with Mechs.

I guess maybe that's why I'm less bitter than you about it....because I came to realize that shortly after Launch, that all this was ever going to be was a "Battletech MechAssault Shoot Em Up", and Battletech in name only.

Maybe some flavor will return if they ever do PvE, but trust me, for the most part, I'm just biding my time for HBS's Battletech. (another contentious point with the Clan population.).

Sadly, I am willing to bet Clan or IS, less than 5% of the remaining players are "lore guys".

[FupDup]

Karl Streiger, on 17 November 2015 - 06:16 AM, said:

hm.... so 3067... Heavy Gauss, Light Gauss, MRMs (40s ) Light Engines, HPPCs, LPPCs, Variable Speed Pulse Laser, Rotary ACs, Reflective Armor, Reaktive Armor, Hardened Armor, Small Cockpits, XL Gyro;
vs
Heavy Lasers, ATM, Hyper Assault Gauss

Well ok - lets do it

IS LFE < Clan XL

Light Gauss < Clan Gauss

Heavy Gauss is actually deadly, but niche and hard to mount

MRMs were inferior to Clan LRMs in BT, but in MWO there might be some potential, depends on how PGI does it...

HPPC < Clan ERPPC

Light PPC < Clan ERPPC

VSPL < Clan Pulse Laser

Rotary ACs get adapted by the Clans

Reflective, Reactive, and Hardened armor get adapted by the Clans

XL Gyro and Small Cockpit are impossible in MWO's current mechlab


Most Clan invasion-era tech beats Inner Sphere futuretech.

Edited by FupDup, 17 November 2015 - 07:32 AM.

[Karl Streiger]

IS LFE < Clan XL - CHECK

Light Gauss < Clan Gauss - More Range (but only powerful with C3i and extreme range rule) - so CHECK

Heavy Gauss is actually deadly, but niche and hard to mount (only Torso Mounted....without CriSplitng STD only) CHECK

MRMs were inferior to Clan LRMs in BT, but in MWO there might be some potential, depends on how PGI does it...(1000% Cooldown ASRM2 stuff)

HPPC < Clan ERPPC (Check)

Light PPC < Clan ERPPC (Depends on stacking - for example 2 LPPCs will be equal in point damage for same weight)

VSPL < Clan Pulse Laser (depends on solution (you have to reduce the "effective" range and increase the max range - for more damage at shorter ranges and reduced damage on range - similar to Snub PPCs perfect brawl weapon

Rotary ACs get adapted by the Clans (not really - afaik only Xperimental)

Reflective, Reactive, and Hardened armor get adapted by the Clans (really oh i hate the clans)

XL Gyro and Small Cockpit are impossible in MWO's current mechlab (right

did forget:
Plasma Rifle, MagShot, Snub Noose PPC
Machine Gun Arrays for both (they would boost Machine Guns for sure - considering a Heavy Machine Gun Array
Plasma Cannon, AP Gauss

[Triordinant]

Bishop Steiner, on 17 November 2015 - 07:25 AM, said:

Maybe some flavor will return if they ever do PvE, but trust me, for the most part, I'm just biding my time for HBS's Battletech.

We'll all see each other there in 18 months. In the meantime we've got Fallout 4 today and X-COM 2 in February.

[FupDup]

Karl Streiger, on 17 November 2015 - 07:41 AM, said:

MRMs were inferior to Clan LRMs in BT, but in MWO there might be some potential, depends on how PGI does it...(1000% Cooldown ASRM2 stuff)

I don't see how that extreme typo has anything to do with the situation.

Karl Streiger, on 17 November 2015 - 07:41 AM, said:

VSPL < Clan Pulse Laser (depends on solution (you have to reduce the "effective" range and increase the max range - for more damage at shorter ranges and reduced damage on range - similar to Snub PPCs perfect brawl weapon

The issue with the VSPL is that they have extreme weight (e.g. 9 tons of the Large), fairly high heat, much shorter range, and even in short range they barely deal more damage than their Clan equivalents. They lose more than they gain on the risk-reward curve.

Karl Streiger, on 17 November 2015 - 07:41 AM, said:

did forget:
Plasma Rifle, MagShot, Snub Noose PPC
Machine Gun Arrays for both (they would boost Machine Guns for sure - considering a Heavy Machine Gun Array
Plasma Cannon, AP Gauss

Magshot is nice, but less effective than the Clan AP Gauss (the latter is 1 slot smaller and does 50% more damage)

Clan MGs are half weight of IS MGs, same goes for arrays

Plasma Cannon on the Clan side would actually suck since it has literally zero damage against mechs (even Flamers and MGs could hurt mechs in BT, but not Plasma Cannons)

Plasma Rifle...maybe

Snub Nose would be nice, since the current PPC velocity makes them have issues beyond short to medium range anyways



...With all of this being said, I do like a lot of the future timeline tech toy options. I'm just saying that the Clan invasion era was still really damn good compared to the future IS.

Edited by FupDup, 17 November 2015 - 07:51 AM.

[Sjorpha]

It's all very cool to have new and exciting equipment added to the game. But balancing by powercreep is a bad idea, in online PvP games you need every piece of equipment to be a viable choice.

It's bad enough that single heatsinks and standard structure aren't balanced against dhs and endo, adding more stuff would only make that problem worse by obseleting existing equipment, whatever is added needs to be balanced against what we already have and what we already have still needs to be balanced between the factions regardless of what you add.

[Johnny Z]

The "QUICK PLAY" and "FACTION PLAY" buttons in the update notes speak volumes about the respect given to players and the atmosphere this game is trying to put across to the players.

Just sad.

To put into perspective. CAN YOU IMAGINE FALLOUT 4 WITH A GIANT "QUICK PLAY" BUTTON IN THE MIDDLE OF THE SCREEN FOR HALF THE TIME PLAYING THE GAME?

LAME.

If I could make "lame" larger, page 5 of this topic would be a giant L, page 6 of this topic would be a giant A etc...

In fact having a giant "QUICK PLAY" button is a deliberate FU to any game player ever. Someone hates video games is clear. I will remind that person that video games wouldnt be as advanced or as popular if other things had not already gone in the trash leaving little to no alternatives for people trying to have a bit a fun and not pushed into being hooked on drugs or alchahol or jail or worse. Big subject, but wake up and do the math. Video games are exactly where they are among other things because of this sort of thing.

If who ever responsible for this was running hockey games, they would put a giant "PLAY NOW" sign on the player box gates and a giant middle finger beside it.

Also since this lack of respect for people trying to play a game and have some fun has been reinforced with this latest update. I hope a big deal is made about a game that would show such obvious disrespect for their own players.

I could go on about this, but with extreme effort I wont . lol

Edited by Johnny Z, 17 November 2015 - 08:46 AM.

[MeiSooHaityu]

Gyrok, on 16 November 2015 - 02:19 PM, said:

I would like to start a petition to have "A BattleTech Game" removed from the title of MechWarrior Online...

Edited by MeiSooHaityu, 17 November 2015 - 08:14 AM.

[Kalimaster]

Mechwarrior is Battletech. Look at the old FASA manuals when this game was still pen and paper. Please do that. Those were the days, when you had to depend upon a good dice roll to do damage.

[Sandpit]

Started playing Btech in the early 80s
Played every iteration of Btech games (except clicky tech ewww Wizards
Played every iteration of MW video games
Looks over MWO

Mechs? Check
Inner Sphere? Check
Lore? Check (Note I didn't say implemented into game terms although that's several arguments as well for a dif thread)
Clans? Check
Interplanetary conquest? Check


Just because the game doesn't play as "deep" as you might like OP doesn't mean it's not a Btech game. It's Btech. It's based on a board game created 30 years ago.

If you played a TT game of Btech and had a poor GM that didn't flesh out a storyline very well and just pitted you against various forces, you would still be playing Btech, just not Btech with a very good storyteller.

PGI has created a decent Btech game. The mechanics and combat are fun (if repetitive) and the mechs look gorgeous. PGI has not, however, created any story, depth in the fiction, etc. PGI has concentrated solely on creating a combat game. I think a lot of people expected a much deeper RPG-like experience. PGI technically did (trust me, I invented PGInese so I know these things) create the game they promised. They just didn't give us any story, narration, etc. to it.

I honestly believe this is where a lot of the disconnect comes from. Some of the player base (founders especially) expected a little more depth (ok a LOT more) in those areas to make it more than just another robot shooter. That's really what was wanted and expected in regards to things like CW.

A story. A reason to WANT to conquer the Inner Sphere. A reason to CARE about the characters, universe, and outcome of the war. It's been several years and MWO STILL has less story than Angry Birds or 90% of the other games available on my phone.

Hire a storyteller PGI. Tell a story. Add a little depth to your universe. You don't need single-player to tell a story, you just need to sit down and write one (or hire someone to do it)

MWO = Decent and fun Btech arena fight game.
MWO =/= Anything beyond that

[Almond Brown]

Can we keep the Re-Seen Mechs please, please, please.... LOL! They are kinda BattleTech related...right?

[Mystere]

Karl Streiger, on 17 November 2015 - 05:52 AM, said:

DireWolf = IMP
Executioner = Cyclops
Warhawk = Crocket
Gargoyle = Charger
TimberWolf = Thug
Summoner = Flashman
Hellbringer = Exterminator
Ebon Jaguar = Lancelot
MadDog = Champion
StormCrow = Hoplite
Nova = Gladiator
ShadowCat = Wyvern
Ice Ferret = Sentinel
Adder = Talon
Arctic Cheeta = Hussar
Kit Fox = Hermes
Koshi = Monngoose

or similar :-)

I'm sorry, but no substitutions allowed.

Edited by Mystere, 17 November 2015 - 08:32 AM.

[Bishop Steiner]

Sandpit, on 17 November 2015 - 08:15 AM, said:

Started playing Btech in the early 80s
Played every iteration of Btech games (except clicky tech ewww Wizards
Played every iteration of MW video games
Looks over MWO

Mechs? Check
Inner Sphere? Check
Lore? Check (Note I didn't say implemented into game terms although that's several arguments as well for a dif thread)
Clans? Check
Interplanetary conquest? Check


Just because the game doesn't play as "deep" as you might like OP doesn't mean it's not a Btech game. It's Btech. It's based on a board game created 30 years ago.

If you played a TT game of Btech and had a poor GM that didn't flesh out a storyline very well and just pitted you against various forces, you would still be playing Btech, just not Btech with a very good storyteller.

PGI has created a decent Btech game. The mechanics and combat are fun (if repetitive) and the mechs look gorgeous. PGI has not, however, created any story, depth in the fiction, etc. PGI has concentrated solely on creating a combat game. I think a lot of people expected a much deeper RPG-like experience. PGI technically did (trust me, I invented PGInese so I know these things) create the game they promised. They just didn't give us any story, narration, etc. to it.

I honestly believe this is where a lot of the disconnect comes from. Some of the player base (founders especially) expected a little more depth (ok a LOT more) in those areas to make it more than just another robot shooter. That's really what was wanted and expected in regards to things like CW.

A story. A reason to WANT to conquer the Inner Sphere. A reason to CARE about the characters, universe, and outcome of the war. It's been several years and MWO STILL has less story than Angry Birds or 90% of the other games available on my phone.

Hire a storyteller PGI. Tell a story. Add a little depth to your universe. You don't need single-player to tell a story, you just need to sit down and write one (or hire someone to do it)

MWO = Decent and fun Btech arena fight game.
MWO =/= Anything beyond that

pretty well summed up.

So instead of feeding to the rage, I will instead sit back and listen to some awesome jazzy guitar riffs.....

and make some popcorn.

[WarHippy]

Bishop Steiner, on 16 November 2015 - 05:45 PM, said:

if they can't balance existing tech, how is jumping into the future and MORE tech to balance going to help?

Sounds like being inside a burning building....and your solution is to pour gas all over yourself.

Well a lot of the current balance problems that people complain about stem from IS vs Clan during the 3050-3052 timer period. By moving the timer period forward new equipment for the IS and Clans at least brings things closer together balance wise than what we have in the 3050-3052 era. Yes, they will have more things to balance, but what they have to balance doesn't start from vastly different sides of the balance spectrum. The only downside would be that some old tech just wouldn't be used much if at all anymore, but at least we wouldn't be in a situation like what we are creating here. Trying to make everything similar yet different only to be forced to redo all the balance again if we do ever move the timeline forward and get new equipment seems counterproductive.

[Summon3r]

nothing about MWO is battletech what so ever except the name of mechs and weapons.

+1 petition signed, how about MWO a repetitive twitch shooter?

[Lucian Nostra]

CoffiNail, on 17 November 2015 - 04:36 AM, said:

Umm we did complain. In phase 1 all the major Clan loyalists had tried to get alliances and coalitions going.. Mercs kept ******* it up, because again, mercs playing for Clans make sense in the lore... What happened to the clan loyalist, you know the icon they made before CW launch, the clan faction that was going to be Clans 'mercs'? Pgi main core audience of mercs were again catered too. **** the clan faction, we have some who want to play both Mechs types, well mercs can switch between factions right? Lore is fine with Clans hiring mercs, right? I am sorry you want to play both teams Mechs go pug, you want to play a CW game, go Clan or inner sphere, play pure tech, enjoy the game.. Instead they gave mercs the freedom to **** the game over how ever they wanted... And they did and ruined it for most other people. After Tukayyid CGBI had always struggled to get people to play CW, as it is riddled with the real power creep, has no lore in it and was and still is the exact same crap every game. People go the same routes, bring the same Mechs... Yes so much fun.

Oh CW... the death knell of Clan Nova Cat... PGI's minimal investment into it pretty much crushed our entire clan. Something as simple as Faction labels. We knew CNC was a long time coming, we where one of the loudest groups of players for the Clan Loyalist symbol and we ran it with pride. We where clan, but we where not Wolf, Bear, Falcon or Jaguar.. Than CW hits, the loyalist tag disappears and we have people jumping ship "If I'm gonna run Wolf/falcon/bear/jag tags Ill just join a wolf/falcon/bear/jag unit" It's pretty damn hard to keep people in a unit when that unit has no supported identity, we held on for a bit after but all the work pretty much crushed the leadership seeing it fall apart on PGIs backs.

[Sandpit]

Quote

[color=#959595]we held on for a bit after but all the work pretty much crushed the leadership seeing it fall apart on PGIs backs. [/color]

Can we please stop with the "PGI killed my unit" propaganda? PGI didn't do anything to "kill" anything in regards to personal and private units. Sorry. That's not how it works. Those players didn't even leave MWO, they quite simply left your unit. They left your unit because they, according to your words, were having more enjoyment playing with and in different units/clans.

If it had been "PGI's fault" they wouldn't have continued playing MWO, just with a different unit.

[C E Dwyer]

Battle tech stopped being Battle tech the moment the clans arrived, from that moment it became Power Creep Tech.

Mech warrior started out as a Role playing game, a simple extension of the hex mat board game, not a very good one either, what saved it was the lore and the great colour section.

The moment you could point a weapon and hit where you aimed the sights and guarantee it would not miss, the whole point of the lore became a distant second place to the game, its not just clans and it's not just this platform.

As to Clan lore while it may be popular, it's also extremely dumb beyond measure we had one bunch of space samurai, not only space samurai, but those that had to colonise a fresh without any support from the mother world, life was hard apparently aproximately sixty thousand people perished from the enviroment and new illnesses..clearly it was the mongol element of the new civilisation

Seriously only sixty thousand out of over one million.. this is the number of civilians that Kerensky's son rescued, escaping the civil war on the pentagon worlds, yeah right...

So while trying to survive not really that harsh, enviroment with so few deaths, they managed to have a civil war, a second exodus, and then a war of conquest and still develope a new culture, genetic engineering, and new tech vastly superior to even old star league tech..in a couple of hundred years

What did Kerensky do wave Tinkerbells magic wand...

So now we have claners complaining about the lore, that was even more full of holes, than the back story to Plan 9 from outer space, because PGI chose to take a different angle on it. Not really any more stupid, than weapons that hit where you aim.

After slagging it off, I can understand frustration.

It should be relatively simple to call a lance a star, it shouldn't really be to difficult to make it 10 v12.

P.G.I say it can't be done, I'm sure what they mean is they can't do it.

So sure leave or cancel orders , because your bored fed up frustrated, with the slow development, the imbalance, sure I can understand that..I teeter on the verge of uninstalling myself

But over lore being ignored which was stupid in the first place, is well kinda stupid..

[Bishop Steiner]

Cathy, on 17 November 2015 - 09:33 AM, said:

As to Clan lore while it may be popular, it's also extremely dumb beyond measure we had one bunch of space samurai, not only space samurai, but those that had to colonise a fresh without any support from the mother world, life was hard apparently aproximately sixty thousand people perished from the enviroment and new illnesses..clearly it was the mongol element of the new civilisation

Space Mongols, actually. Don't let the honor duel fighting mentality fool you. 90% of the Clan source material was totally and baldly ripped off of Genghis Khan (of course the entire sociopolitcal structure of the Inner Sphere is a Junior High School students grasp of various cultures, tossed into space.)

[Lucian Nostra]

Sandpit, on 17 November 2015 - 09:18 AM, said:

Can we please stop with the &quot;PGI killed my unit&quot; propaganda? PGI didn't do anything to &quot;kill&quot; anything in regards to personal and private units. Sorry. That's not how it works. Those players didn't even leave MWO, they quite simply left your unit. They left your unit because they, according to your words, were having more enjoyment playing with and in different units/clans.

If it had been &quot;PGI's fault&quot; they wouldn't have continued playing MWO, just with a different unit.

Lol I said death knell, the final toll. Funny you should mention people going inactive because we lost a good 60% to disappearing. Cw was just the final straw