58 replies to this topic

[Ansel]

The title says it all. What are your thoughts on bringing an extra person to handel the strategic elements so you can concentrate on driving the mech. Also what are your thoughts on being the guy in the extra seat and dealing with the strategic elements of the game.

Of course being the extra guy should be optional in any event.

I would like to see something like this because of the information warfare they are trying to impliment, having someone to watch the drone feeds and watch the other peoples raders from C3 networks would be very handy.

[Alex Wolfe]

My thoughts are that a decent pilot should be able to handle that much on his own.

When idle, the pilot would be free to strategize at will. When under fire, the interior of the mech would be too shaky, noisy and steaming hot from its own weapons for a "passenger" to focus on formulating plans.

Edited by Alex Wolfe, 04 December 2011 - 02:34 PM.

[S3dition]

This is from Maximum Tech. It's actually in Battletech, but command seats are extremely rare and relegated to use as training mechs at academies by 3049.

[Mchawkeye]

Has to be said that I really like this idea. The thought of a two seater mech, one piloting/defending whilst the other controls all the battle information and directs the forces accordingly really appeals to me, as well as further emphasising team work.
just another layer to add depth to the game.

Although fair to say one person could do it...I just think it adds to the spectrum of roles available for people to perfect.

[Semyon Drakon]

Command seats are not only relegated to training 'mechs. Ariana Winstons Mech during Operation Serpent carried an extra seat for her Comms officer, who also handled the C3 gear.

Unless you were dedicated to command and not actually shooting things it might not be the most fun though.

Semyon

[Colonel Bogey]

I think it would be funny to basically call it spectating. When people spectate games they see things from behind the pilots head, or third person to the first person view lol.

[Alizabeth Aijou]

Command Consoles are, as noted above, relagated to non-combat duties.
Rumble Seats are still an option, though, but they don't add any real benefits other than letting you carry a single passenger.

One thing that is, somewhat, in use are Dual-Cockpit Systems, but those are slightly less rare than Command Consoles, and even less practical unless you've trained with it for months if not years. One of the Solaris VII stables has a famous MechWarrior, Gemini Stables, iirc. The functions of pilot and gunner are split in two with these cockpits.

[Big Willie]

What mechs even have dual cockpits?
Battlemaster is the only mech I have heard of that has two seats (and even that is probably a throwback to anime more than btech cannon).

[Firefly]

No.

The end.

[EDMW CSN]

Dual cockpits / Command consoles are fine if they have access to a Mech commander style birds eye view of everything.
But that might need additional work.

[Adridos]

I'm strategist, so special aircraft for me to see from top down perspective would be nice.
You can strategise in a mech too, as I'm able in WoT, but people there won't listen to you.

[John Clavell]

As cool as it seems in the lore, I don't think it's a super fun game mechanic.

[verybad]

I don't think it would be useful at all. Commanders aren't necessarilly being the ones actually giving their teammates commands. Anyone can do that Scouts, Attackers, Defenders etc.

Commanders are probably going to be "Buffers" Units that enhance other units abilities. Scouts will likely be De-Buffers. For instance, a Commander might be able to capture a new spawn point, or call in an airstrike. Likely not as good at actual combat as attacker/defender units, but they're be able to distribute the radar view and help their teammates out in other ways.

Personally I don't want to share a mech's seat, I'd get PO'd when someone I was cooping with did soemthign stupid and got us killed for example.

Just doesn't sound like fun.

[Alizabeth Aijou]

Big Willie, on 05 December 2011 - 11:34 PM, said:

What mechs even have dual cockpits?
Battlemaster is the only mech I have heard of that has two seats (and even that is probably a throwback to anime more than btech cannon).

FedSuns:
BLR-1R and/or BLR-3M BattleMaster, modified by removing one heat sink.

Draconis Combine:
DRG-5K Grand Dragon, by removing one medium laser.
WHM-6R Warhammer, by removing two small lasers.
WHM-7M Warhammer, by removing one medium laser.

Lyrans:
ZEU-6S Zeus, by removing on medium laser.
ZEU-9S Zeus, by removing one heat sink.
AS7-D or AS7-K Atlas, by removing one ton of LRM ammo.

FWL:
ON-1V or ON-1M Orion, by removing one ton of SRM ammo.
MAD-3M or MAD-5M Marauder, by removing one heat sink.

CapCon:
CP10-Z Cyclops, by removing one ton of AC ammo.
CP11-A Cyclops, by removing one ton of Gauss ammo.
WHM-6L Warhammer, by removing one flamer.
WHM-7M Warhammer, identical to the DC one.

[CyBerkut]

If I were the developers, I wouldn't burn resources on getting it into the game at launch. Maybe later on, include it in a content upgrade, if game play to date seems to indicate that it would be an interesting niche to fill.

If somebody wanted to do a shared cockpit / split responsibilities in their own home, I'm guessing it would be possible. I remember seeing a post not too long ago (over on SimHQ, I think), where a dad made a 2 seater pit for use with DCS:Blackshark. When his son wants to join in, dad flies the chopper, and junior works the weapons with a second set of controls setup for that purpose. I think they were both looking at the same projection screen, or TV display. It was actually a pretty slick idea for sharing the fun with someone who wasn't ready to take on all of the complexity.

[Karyudo ds]

Alex Wolfe, on 04 December 2011 - 02:31 PM, said:

My thoughts are that a decent pilot should be able to handle that much on his own.

When idle, the pilot would be free to strategize at will.

You think a pilot could do anything while watching drone feeds, maps, etc? Seems to me that most of the time they would have to stop every time they wanted to do anything. I would approve of the idea if "command" was something that required this type of effort. In fact I think it would be rather realistic if 2 seater mechs were somewhat common for information warfare. Many real military vehicles do things like that.

[Firefly]

First of all we're talking about big stompy robots that don't even exist. Realism != Video Games

What works for a Bradley crew or a C130 Spectre gunship crew does not translate into video games. Not everyone wants to hop on a video game Black Hawk and be the crew chief for hours on end. Even if we did translate it into video games, Planetside featured multi-crew vehicles, and they're rethinking some of the concepts for Planetside 2.

This feature, among others in tabletop BattleTech, serves no purpose because it doesn't translate well into video game mechanics and video gamer mentality. Remember, this will not be a persistent-world MMO - so theoretically you may be looking at a 15min match. Most people want to get in a cockpit, throttle to max, and start blowing the enemy to bits. You'll invariably have a number of people who will find a niche as a support person, and as such will hang their 'Mech towards the back in a proverbial Command Lance and fulfill the function of drone-watcher and intelligence interceptor whilst the assaulters are up front. It's a waste of time, resources, memory, energy and payroll dollars to work on something that a small minority will use.

[feor]

I recommended in an earlier thread along these lines the idea of having the Command Console as a piece of equipment you could add to your mech that came with (or for which you hired) an NPC pilot. So you could command your mech as a mechwarrior, stomping around stepping on things. But if you needed to take a look at the strategic picture and start setting waypoints and issuing specific orders, you can switch over to the command console, and the NPC pilot takes over the direct combat activities of your mech.

You could even have Dual Cockpits and Command Consoles as just different "tiers" of the same type of equipment. Command Console giving you more information and tools for commanding your troops.

[Ghost]

I think dual cockpits could be a convenient excuse for including a TF2-style 'coach' system for training new players in advanced strategies.

[ManDaisy]

I think this idea has merit.

For one thing this would enable a kill the king game mode where both teams try to take out each others commander, while essentially the commander would really just be a spectator inside some piloted mech shouting help help all the time and running around like a headless chicken. Or they could use... dare I say it tactics and strategy.

Defend and escort modes would too.

Edited by ManDaisy, 06 December 2011 - 08:28 PM.