215 replies to this topic

[pwnface]

Lord Scarlett Johan, on 03 December 2015 - 12:12 PM, said:

I'd basically like for mechs to have doubled IS across the board, if I'm honest. Then just adjust up or down from there on a chassis by chassis basis.

I'd be on board with that. You just can't do it for only 1 chassis that didn't even need help. #pgipls

[Deathlike]

FupDup, on 03 December 2015 - 12:05 PM, said:

The BK and Grass are heavier than the Thud, so TL's hurt them more than they help them.

The Drag does get a tiny benefit over the Thud there, but probably not enough to matter.

Humor this idea for a moment. Let's say that the BK and Grasshopper got stupidly awesome quirks (over 25% heat gen plus over 25% armor/internal structure quirks over the mech). It doesn't take too much to change the thinking on what your "best option" happens to be.

I'm not endorsing such a game-changing quirk. I'm saying that if a mech is noticeable "out there" compared to the alternatives, people will bend over backwards to fit them as their primary option by whatever means necessary.

The sad thing is that I'm probably going to retire the Thunderwub (I'm thinking moar BJs in my dropdeck). I'm still trying to evaluate the BK+Grasshopper, but it's initially looking like I'll abandon IS heavies in favor of the alternatives.

Quote

Yes, we would and should have to fix that issue to bring about the inter-chassis balance talked about earlier. I view the limits as a symptom of underlying problems.

Quite.

I don't think we'll ever see this day.

[Jun Watarase]

[Saint Scarlett Johan]

pwnface, on 03 December 2015 - 12:13 PM, said:

I'd be on board with that. You just can't do it for only 1 chassis that didn't even need help. #pgipls

What rustled my jimmies is why the f*ck does the Oxide get a 50% increase in internal structure but the other Jenners don't?

Bad form and leaves a window open to P2W arguments.

[Deathlike]

Lord Scarlett Johan, on 03 December 2015 - 12:17 PM, said:

What rustled my jimmies is why the f*ck does the Oxide get a 50% increase in internal structure but the other Jenners don't?

Bad form and leaves a window open to P2W arguments.

Ask Paul.

[FupDup]

Lord Scarlett Johan, on 03 December 2015 - 11:35 AM, said:

...
And the only thing that pushed it into proliferation was it getting doubled internal structure. Which I think a lot more mechs need.

I'd rather give a hefty buff to using STD internal structure, to help add some more build options and buff a few of the sub-par Omnimechs (most of which lack Endo). Wanna be tough, use STD. Wanna have more payload/engine/whatever, use Endo.

I will admit that this has the unintended consequence of buffing Hellbringers and Dire Whales, but those mechs can get bumped down in other ways if need be.

[Mawai]

So ...

Expect it to get nerfed.

If the BJ-1X is bad enough then the quirks will get toned down. They did it with the ERPPC TDR and they will do it with the Blackjack. Some folks will cheer and some will whine. Hopefully, though, PGI has better metrics in place and will be able to identify such outlier mechs more quickly and implement the changes sooner based on facts rather than hearsay, posts and twitter comments from both those for and against.

At the moment, I think PGI is focused on the steam launch and if the BJ-1X is bad enough then they will be motivated to patch it before the launch.

[Deathlike]

Mawai, on 03 December 2015 - 12:24 PM, said:

So ...

Expect it to get nerfed.

If the BJ-1X is bad enough then the quirks will get toned down. They did it with the ERPPC TDR and they will do it with the Blackjack. Some folks will cheer and some will whine. Hopefully, though, PGI has better metrics in place and will be able to identify such outlier mechs more quickly and implement the changes sooner based on facts rather than hearsay, posts and twitter comments from both those for and against.

At the moment, I think PGI is focused on the steam launch and if the BJ-1X is bad enough then they will be motivated to patch it before the launch.

That gets said time and time again... and we have long standing metas that keep going or get overnerfed and the actual problem isn't actually resolved.

I can't take that type of statement seriously until it is demonstrated otherwise (outside of the noise/whining).

[Torric]

FupDup, on 03 December 2015 - 10:55 AM, said:

I don't really buy the whole "effectiveness for tonnage" argument thing because I don't think that a larger mech should instantly equal direct superiority.

I like the "effectiveness for tonnage" argument. It's the only way a Locust (the less-than-four-energy-hardpoint variants) can look super stronk.

500 dmg in a Locust 1V? Yeah, totals equals 2500 dmgs in a dires. Totals.

Edited by Torric, 03 December 2015 - 12:35 PM.

[pwnface]

Mawai, on 03 December 2015 - 12:24 PM, said:

So ...

Expect it to get nerfed.

If the BJ-1X is bad enough then the quirks will get toned down. They did it with the ERPPC TDR and they will do it with the Blackjack. Some folks will cheer and some will whine. Hopefully, though, PGI has better metrics in place and will be able to identify such outlier mechs more quickly and implement the changes sooner based on facts rather than hearsay, posts and twitter comments from both those for and against.

At the moment, I think PGI is focused on the steam launch and if the BJ-1X is bad enough then they will be motivated to patch it before the launch.

The problem is all of these "out of balance" quirks were easily predictable before they even went live. PGI just has no idea what they are doing and are throwing darts on a dartboard when it comes to balance. The Atlas needed more survivability because it was underpowered and is primarily a brawling mech at a time when brawling is particularly weak. The BJ-1X was already performing above par and did not need these ridiculous survivability quirks. It's as absurd as giving the DWF a 25% gauss cooldown buff.

Buff weaker mechs not strong ones. Too bad PGI has no idea what is strong or weak.

[Big Tin Man]

Thinking more about this, it's a ploy by PGI. Offer the new steam players a choice for one of the best, most OP mechs in the game, at an affordable price for entry. Then nerf it later.

Well played Paul.

[Sjorpha]

Deathlike, on 03 December 2015 - 11:17 AM, said:

I'm here for the inside joke.

Don't choke on it.

[Navid A1]

well, last night our group decided to put that to the test...

It. was . a . massacre !

NOTHING could stand in our way... they just died.. from dires to KGCs to MADs, TBRs, HBRs, EBJs, ... everything!
strategy?... nope..... full yolo mode...
we were terrified ourselves... a 100+kph deathball... killing anything on the first shot!

We later noticed that it was extremely hard for the enemy to even call targets!

this went on and on:

Edited by Navid A1, 03 December 2015 - 12:56 PM.

[Saint Scarlett Johan]

pwnface, on 03 December 2015 - 12:40 PM, said:

Too bad PGI has no idea what is strong or weak.

Unless Paul was trolling the living sh!t out of us, we found our disconnect.

Every night when I have the star to the group, when I see Tina online I want to shoot her an invite and get her to play with QQ for a bit so she can see 'what right looks like.'

[pwnface]

Big Tin Man, on 03 December 2015 - 12:40 PM, said:

Thinking more about this, it's a ploy by PGI. Offer the new steam players a choice for one of the best, most OP mechs in the game, at an affordable price for entry. Then nerf it later.

Well played Paul.

If Paul were actually smart enough to do this intentionally, I could respect that.

Too bad he has no idea what he's doing.

What even is balance?

Edited by pwnface, 03 December 2015 - 12:52 PM.

[Saint Scarlett Johan]

Sometimes I feel like I need a word more obscene and offensive than f*ck. I just use it way to often now that I feel like I devalued it...

[FupDup]

Lord Scarlett Johan, on 03 December 2015 - 01:00 PM, said:

Sometimes I feel like I need a word more obscene and offensive than f*ck. I just use it way to often now that I feel like I devalued it...

How about "Paul?"

[pwnface]

Lord Scarlett Johan, on 03 December 2015 - 01:00 PM, said:

Sometimes I feel like I need a word more obscene and offensive than f*ck. I just use it way to often now that I feel like I devalued it...

I get what you mean, I wish there were one word that described "sh!t eating cvntwaffle" which I could use in regards to our master balancer.

[Big Tin Man]

pwnface, on 03 December 2015 - 12:51 PM, said:

If Paul were actually smart enough to do this intentionally, I could respect that.

Too bad he has no idea what he's doing.

Even a blind squirrel finds a nut every once in a while...

Lord Scarlett Johan, on 03 December 2015 - 12:49 PM, said:

Every night when I have the star to the group, when I see Tina online I want to shoot her an invite and get her to play with QQ for a bit so she can see 'what right looks like.'

Go for it, though she might think you're stalking her.

[Saint Scarlett Johan]

FupDup, on 03 December 2015 - 01:01 PM, said:

How about "Paul?"

'God-Pauling-dammit'

hmmmm...

I just doesn't have the 'ffffffff' lead up to it.

I must ponder on this some more...