254 replies to this topic

[Kaeb Odellas]

I'm sure many here would agree that the biggest source of imbalance between Clan and IS mechs is the Clan XL engine. However, I don't think anyone would accept hitting the Clans with further speed and cooling nerfs on ST loss would be the best move here. So why not improve IS engines in some way?

Here's my idea:

-Instead of instant death on ST loss for IS XL mechs, delay the mech's death for a short time. The stricken mech starts slowly taking internal damage to its CT and remaining ST over time. The mech takes no movement or heat penalties, but it will eventually die, giving the pilot a short amount of time to get a few hits in before going down in a blaze of glory.

-Equipping a Standard engine boosts a mech's side torso internals by 50%, or make them equivalent in strength to the mech's CT. Say that installing an XL engine requires techs to remove structural support in the side torsos or whatever.


What do you guys think?

[Mcgral18]

I enjoy the STD change, though I'd add structure to all 3 torsi (it's competing against the cXL after all).

For the isXL, I'd just normalize it. 'sidesToDie' to 2, with penalties. Identical, worse or better.



Then there's the quirks...some could be dialled back.

[Kaeb Odellas]

The problem with normalizing IS and Clan XL is that IS XL would then essentially be a no brainer for the vast majority of IS builds, unless you make the penalties far worse for IS. Like 50% speed and heat penalties, or worse.

I guess that could also work, but I like the idea of doomed XL mechs flying into a berzerker rage in their last moments. Quirks would be reduced as necessary, of course.

Edited by Kaeb Odellas, 08 December 2015 - 12:24 PM.

[sycocys]

Wouldn't it be possible to make the engines just have crit/structure that actually needs to be destroyed? Possibly has a higher priority over internal structure (as most things you place should be IMO - break stuff to get to the internals).

Drop 3 engine crit spaces and you drop. Same effect, slightly longer life.

[Kaeb Odellas]

I'll be honest. I got the "doomed" idea from Titanfall, which was a pretty fun, if flawed game. I really enjoyed seeing that big doomsday bar shrink down when your mech was doomed, and the mad scramble to put out as much damage as you can before you were forced to eject.

[Metus regem]

So then what would you do with the Light Fusion Engine? Making the ISXL equal to the cXL would make the LFE obsolete. I think what should happen is proper Engine crit hits.

[Kaeb Odellas]

Metus regem, on 08 December 2015 - 12:28 PM, said:

So then what would you do with the Light Fusion Engine? Making the ISXL equal to the cXL would make the LFE obsolete. I think what should happen is proper Engine crit hits.

Eh, LFEs don't show up for another 10 years in the timeline, so I doubt we'll be seeing them anytime soon. They'll still have the benefit of using fewer slots than the XL. You could just make those identical to the Clan XL in mechanics, though with reduced weight savings. Maybe reduced penalties as well?

[Mcgral18]

Metus regem, on 08 December 2015 - 12:28 PM, said:

So then what would you do with the Light Fusion Engine? Making the ISXL equal to the cXL would make the LFE obsolete. I think what should happen is proper Engine crit hits.

Look at all the LFEs we have...

Oh, right...they don't exist.


All engine Crits does is bring TTK down, exactly what most people want to avoid.

[Jack Corban]

Here is an idea why don't we reduce the number of mechs available to 1. Its only a sphere that rolls around and has a UT style instagib ASMD. Now that we finally have equality we can all go and stop playing the game.

Edited by Jack Corban, 08 December 2015 - 12:44 PM.

[Kaeb Odellas]

Mcgral18, on 08 December 2015 - 12:39 PM, said:

Look at all the LFEs we have...

Oh, right...they don't exist.


All engine Crits does is bring TTK down, exactly what most people want to avoid.

Seriously, I really would not like to have a single AC20 round hit my Atlas in the back, triple crit my engine, and kill me instantly.

[Mcgral18]

Kaeb Odellas, on 08 December 2015 - 12:45 PM, said:

Seriously, I really would not like to have a single AC20 round hit my Atlas in the back, triple crit my engine, and kill me instantly.

To avoid that, they could be set to 50ish HP per crit slot (like the AC20 should have total).

I'd rather not have it at all, of course.

Jack Corban, on 08 December 2015 - 12:44 PM, said:

Here is an idea why don't we reduce the number of mechs available to 1. Its only a sphere that rolls around and has a UT style instagib ASMD. Now that we finally have equality we can all go and stop playing the game.

Poor line of thinking.

[Lugh]

Kaeb Odellas, on 08 December 2015 - 12:00 PM, said:

I'm sure many here would agree that the biggest source of imbalance between Clan and IS mechs is the Clan XL engine. However, I don't think anyone would accept hitting the Clans with further speed and cooling nerfs on ST loss would be the best move here. So why not improve IS engines in some way?

Here's my idea:

-Instead of instant death on ST loss for IS XL mechs, delay the mech's death for a short time. The stricken mech starts slowly taking internal damage to its CT and remaining ST over time. The mech takes no movement or heat penalties, but it will eventually die, giving the pilot a short amount of time to get a few hits in before going down in a blaze of glory.

-Equipping a Standard engine boosts a mech's side torso internals by 50%, or make them equivalent in strength to the mech's CT. Say that installing an XL engine requires techs to remove structural support in the side torsos or whatever.


What do you guys think?

Sorry but if the clans have to suffer all those reductions before they die, so do you.

[Kaeb Odellas]

Lugh, on 08 December 2015 - 12:46 PM, said:

Sorry but if the clans have to suffer all those reductions before they die, so do you.

The difference here is that the Clan mech can still survive its ST loss, but the IS mech is absolutely guaranteed to die no matter what. Just not straight away.

Would you swap your 20% heat/speed loss for a guaranteed death? I doubt it.

[Mcgral18]

Jack Corban, on 08 December 2015 - 12:54 PM, said:

[redacted]

Mr irrational CAPs, you'd be stupid not to take the cXL.


Clam Battlemechs are coming.

Edited by Marvyn Dodgers, 08 December 2015 - 04:56 PM.
Unconstructive/insults in quote

[Kaeb Odellas]

Jack Corban, on 08 December 2015 - 12:54 PM, said:

[redacted]

Be honest. You would never take a standard engine over a Clan XL. To carry the same level of firepower, you'd have to fit a much less powerful standard engine and sacrifice your speed from the get-go. Run 20% slower after losing an ST, or run 20% slower the entire match? Not a hard decision to make.

Edited by Marvyn Dodgers, 08 December 2015 - 04:56 PM.
Unconstructive/insults in quote

[Jack Corban]

Kaeb Odellas, on 08 December 2015 - 12:57 PM, said:

Be honest. You would never take a standard engine over a Clan XL. To carry the same level of firepower, you'd have to fit a much less powerful standard engine and sacrifice your speed from the get-go. Run 20% slower after losing an ST, or run 20% slower the entire match? Not a hard decision to make.

well you seem to know me so well take a look into my garage and find i play most of my 170 mechs including IS mechs stock.

[Kaeb Odellas]

Jack Corban, on 08 December 2015 - 01:01 PM, said:

well you seem to know me so well take a look into my garage and find i play most of my 170 mechs including IS mechs stock.

So would you reasonably take a standard engine over a Clan XL in your Clan mechs or not?

And while you're whining about Clan nerfs, understand that PGI is pretty much dead set on having roughly 1:1 IS vs Clan battles, because the things that would actually give the IS a chance on the battlefield (superior numbers, artillery support, air support, combined arms tactics with tanks and infantry, and zellbrigen) would be too difficult and resource intensive to implement or impossible to enforce in a multiplayer shooter.

[Jack Corban]

Kaeb Odellas, on 08 December 2015 - 01:08 PM, said:

So would you reasonably take a standard engine over a Clan XL in your Clan mechs or not?

And while you're whining about Clan nerfs, understand that PGI is pretty much dead set on having roughly 1:1 IS vs Clan battles, because the things that would actually give the IS a chance on the battlefield (superior numbers, artillery support, air support, combined arms tactics with tanks and infantry, and zellbrigen) would be too difficult and resource intensive to implement or impossible to enforce in a multiplayer shooter.

Thats a trick question. There is no standart Clan Engines. so i can't also there is a reason why i play my mechs stock for the most part. Its called "Canon" and i am a purist. So No i would not because its against the Lore.

[Mcgral18]

Jack Corban, on 08 December 2015 - 01:10 PM, said:

Thats a trick question. There is no standart Clan Engines. so i can't also there is a reason why i play my mechs stock for the most part. Its called "Canon" and i am a purist. So No i would not because its against the Lore.

Wrong, there is a Clan standard engine; it's a standard engine, much like a Single Heat Sink is a SHS.

Some Clam Battlemechs come stock with STDs.


KingFisher and Stooping Hawk are Omnis that are stuck with STDs.

Edited by Mcgral18, 08 December 2015 - 01:15 PM.

[CaptainScumBa11s]

Jack Corban, on 08 December 2015 - 12:54 PM, said:

HEY NOOBCAKE WE HAVE ONLY XL ENGINES!

If you don't like how the lore has it then go play hawken or any other mech game out there.

Clans are allready nerfed to hell, have strict build rules, no choice in Engine rating, and are hot as ******* hell. If you still can't win against us go back to playing tetris.

END OF DISCUSSION!


F-ing know it alls' all over the F-ing forums. Give me unrestricted Clan Mechs like in the Lore and make me play with 2 Players less per match so i can show you your rectums inside like i want to.

Jesus....

You need to go re read omni mechs before calling up lore. Internals are locked for a reason