66 replies to this topic

[Spleenslitta]

This post turned into a textwall overnight but it should save you the trouble of running all over the forums hunting down the info.

This is not another thread were we beg the dev's to put the Urbie in the game. It's one of the candidates though.
As you all know the only light mech capable of mounting ballistic weaponry in MW:O that is in game at the moment is the Commando (if they have the C1 variant in the game that is.)

I ask the developers to make certain that they make certain to give us a light mech capable of mounting ballistic weaponry before they do the final launch.

When i say ballistic weaponry i count anything and everything. Meaning that if a mech mounts a single MG that's good enough reason to say it qualifies.
I'm not asking for much here.

Edit: There seems to be a few that aren't aware that the dev's have put a hardpoint system into the mechlab in MW:O.
I highly recommend that you read about that here (it's another textwall so i won't add it here).
Dev Blog 6 - MechLab



Astarot brought into the light that this post is lacking in information so i've added some stuff i found in this Q&A thread.Community Q&A 6 - MechLab

I'll paste them here for convinience.
Are hardpoints limited by the weapons that come stock with the mech? By that I mean will there be hardpoints available on a chassis that a particular configuration doesn't use? –BarHaid

[DAVID] The hardpoints will be based on the default loadout of a given ’Mech. However, different variants of the same ’Mech will have different default loadouts and, therefore, different hardpoints.

A Swayback Hunchie would have energy hard points in the arms, and right torso cannon mount. Does that mean in the left torso, where no weapon is normally mounted, there are non-weapon hard points for empty crit slots, which means no weapon can be mounted there? –Namwons

[DAVID] Yes, if there are no weapons in a location on the default loadout, then there will be no weapon hardpoints in that location. Equipment generally doesn’t use hardpoints and can be placed anywhere, including the Hunchback’s left torso.

How will the hardpoint system apply to body sections that do not normally have weapons (but could) like the Centurion's left arm? –Morquedeas

[DAVID] If there is no weapon there in the default configuration of a particular variant, there will be no hardpoints there for you to mount weapons on.


What have we learned from this? We learned that a variant of a mech is only capable of mounting weapons were they are mounted and only with the same category of weapons that were there from the start.
You can't replace a large laser in the right arm with a ballistic weapon no matter how much you try.
Don't get me wrong...i actually like these restrictions really well.

At this moment we have the following light mechs that have been announced so far- Commando, Jenner and Raven.

Neither the Jenner nor the Raven have a single variant with ballistic weaponry. Not so much as an MG even.
The Commando has the C1 variant which replaces all of it's SRM's with a single AC 2. This variant was an experiment in providing direct fire long range support.

The fact that it was only an experiment indicates that it must have been an extremely rare variant of the Commando and thus it's questionable that it will appear in MW:O since the dev's are sticking tightly to the canon.
You could even say they glued themselves to it with two component glue....not necessarily a bad thing that.


You must be tired of this textwall so i will finish here. In the current 3049 timeline there are only a precious few light mechs available with ballistic weaponry.
I've listed them and their variants mounting ballistic weaponry along with their links.

Flea- 15 http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Flea
Commando- C1 (rare?) http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Commando
Urbanmech- R60 - R60L http://www.sarna.net/wiki/UrbanMech
Jackrabbit- T8 (mothballed by Comstar so it's probably rare too) http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Jackrabbit
Firestarter- H - M (A?) http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Firestarter

There i'm done....So much typing...i'm finaly finished.

Edited by Spleenslitta, 12 July 2012 - 08:48 AM.

[Eagle Bear]

THE FLEA!!!!!!

[exiledangel]

right now the game is leaning toward a lot of AC mech in there but the lights are heavy on the beam side of weapons and missles so why not add some lights with AC capabilies

[Spleenslitta]

exiledangel, on 11 July 2012 - 08:23 AM, said:

right now the game is leaning toward a lot of AC mech in there but the lights are heavy on the beam side of weapons and missles so why not add some lights with AC capabilies

I forgot my tinfoil hat. You've been snopping into my mind haven't you?

[Davoke]

unfortunately, every light mech i see in our time period except the flea and urbie are las heavy. Or clan.
Sunvagun

[Spleenslitta]

Davoke, on 11 July 2012 - 08:30 AM, said:

unfortunately, every light mech i see in our time period except the flea and urbie are las heavy. Or clan.
Sunvagun

There are other candidates. Jackrabbit and Firestarter for example. The Firestarter has plenty of variants too.

[Reyge]

I can just see this now... Flea vs. Atlas... this is NOT gonna end well for ONE of them!

[Bansheedragon75]

Since we have a mechlab I dont see what the problem here is exactly.
If you want a light mech with ballistic weapons, cant you just replace the lasers with ballistic weapons?
Or are there some limitations to the mech or hardpoints that I dont know about which prevents you from doing that?

[Davoke]

Spleenslitta, on 11 July 2012 - 08:32 AM, said:

There are other candidates. Jackrabbit and Firestarter for example. The Firestarter has plenty of variants too.

True, but the firestarter has only two variants(if i'm understanding the sarna page) that have Ballistics. The Jackrabbit is post-3050<NOTE:, ComStar owned the few left of these mechs, and these would be very pricey because of extreme rarity, at least until after the Clans> and not available.

[Spleenslitta]

Davoke, on 11 July 2012 - 08:37 AM, said:

True, but the firestarter has only two variants(if i'm understanding the sarna page) that have Ballistics. The Jackrabbit is post-3050<NOTE:, ComStar owned the few left of these mechs, and these would be very pricey because of extreme rarity, at least until after the Clans> and not available.

If the Firestarter has only 2 variants with ballistic weapons then that is good enough for me. No complaints.
As for the Jackrabbit....it still deserves to be mentioned.

Any other IS light mechs with ballistics?

[Davoke]

Nothing that i saw.
Unfortunately, I still wouldn't mind an Urbie. But the Flea...Oh goodness no....

[Spleenslitta]

Dragonlord, on 11 July 2012 - 08:37 AM, said:

Since we have a mechlab I dont see what the problem here is exactly.
If you want a light mech with ballistic weapons, cant you just replace the lasers with ballistic weapons?
Or are there some limitations to the mech or hardpoints that I dont know about which prevents you from doing that?

The dev's have made some additional rules for the MW:O mechlab. Take a look here.
Dev Blog 6 - MechLab

Davoke, on 11 July 2012 - 08:43 AM, said:

Nothing that i saw.
Unfortunately, I still wouldn't mind an Urbie. But the Flea...Oh goodness no....

Why not the Flea? We don't have any 20 ton mechs either. It could be the first.

[Davoke]

The armor is ****-poor, and it barely carries an acceptable weapons load.

[Spleenslitta]

Davoke, on 11 July 2012 - 08:48 AM, said:

The armor is ****-poor, and it barely carries an acceptable weapons load.

Hehehe....Imagine your piloting a Flea in a city. Your commander says: Sneak through the enemy lines and perform sneak attacks from behind. But remember to only shot once and then run away.

You manage to sneak behind the enemy lines and you sneak up on a Catapult with only your passive sensors activated.
You shot it in the back and run away. Then you do the same thing to another enemy mech. You could harrass the enemy commander and their support mechs.

That would be the ultimate thrill. One mistake and your done for. What an adrenaline rush it would be.

[Eagle Bear]

TripleHex, on 11 July 2012 - 08:33 AM, said:

I can just see this now... Flea vs. Atlas... this is NOT gonna end well for ONE of them!

i may not kill that atlas but he sure wouldnt kill me

[Eagle Bear]

oh and again on the flea its armor is crap and its weapons are poor because it meant to restrict you to its role of scouting and then getting the **** out of there so your vultures, catapaults, longbows can bend the enemy over and rape them


oh also get 6 fleas load them with 3 machine guns load then with the fastest engine and load them up with ammo no armor and let them fight

Edited by Eagle Bear, 11 July 2012 - 09:20 AM.

[Spleenslitta]

I took a look through all the mechs on Sarna. Seems the Jackrabbit, Urbie, Commando C1, Firestarter and the Flea are the only mechs with ballistic weapons.

I hope the dev's include some ballistic hardpoints that aren't used in the mechs that are introduced into MW:O.
As long as they do that there is still hope.
I just want the ability to put an AC 2 into a light mech and still have enough speed to run away when the enemy gets too close.

[Astarot]

From my understanding, which I have very little remembered knowledge anymore, but for ballistics are all generally heavy weapon systems, aside from machine guns, a light simply can't fit big enough, or enough ballistics weapon systems to make them effective to fight anything but other light mechs. While I'm sure it would be cool to see a light mech running around with a single Gauss rifle, and thats it, it wouldn't be practical. So even if they did have access to EVERYTHING in the ballistic line, you would only really be able to equip one or two items in mass that won't cause their legs to buckle under the weight. You would be better off sticking to lasers, and a combination of CSTRIKE or Small launcher 5 to 10s. But thats just my two cents.

[Spleenslitta]

Astarot, on 11 July 2012 - 10:23 AM, said:

From my understanding, which I have very little remembered knowledge anymore, but for ballistics are all generally heavy weapon systems, aside from machine guns, a light simply can't fit big enough, or enough ballistics weapon systems to make them effective to fight anything but other light mechs. While I'm sure it would be cool to see a light mech running around with a single Gauss rifle, and thats it, it wouldn't be practical. So even if they did have access to EVERYTHING in the ballistic line, you would only really be able to equip one or two items in mass that won't cause their legs to buckle under the weight. You would be better off sticking to lasers, and a combination of CSTRIKE or Small launcher 5 to 10s. But thats just my two cents.

A 30 ton light mech can mount a single AC 5 and two tons of ammo plus a medium laser and still have 5 tons of std armor plus a speed of 97Kph.
A 35 tonner could mount a few more weapons and maybe some more speed and armor....Doesn't sound useless to me.

Besides this is about the lights being cut off from 1/3 of all the weapons available in the game. That's a huge problem for light pilots.

Edited by Spleenslitta, 11 July 2012 - 10:27 AM.

[Astarot]

I actually do find that useless when fighting a bigger mech which has 45 to 60 tons of weapons system, modular equipment, heavier armor.... Plus how much ammo is given to you with two tons of ammo? 120 shots per ton right? with a cycle time of .20 seconds, so that means you shoot how many shots a second? 5 times a second right? So that means, if you have 240 ammo....So you will have roughly 48 seconds worth of ammo, now, lets assume you hit every shot, so that means you have the potentate to do 480 over all damage. Now lets assume that the mech you are shooting at has anti-ballistic armor, so that means your damage is now cut by 50 to 75 percent. Also in a real world even the likelyness of you hitting every shot while moving 97kph+ is very very low. So that means every shot you miss, you lose some of your damage, you will be finding yourself going from 480 potentate damage, to 300 then to 200, then it continues for every miss shot, or wasted shot. So then you have to slow to optimize your hit percentages, but then that brings in the problem being a light mech, the slower you go, the increase likelyness that a heavy pounder going to come by and one shot you.

Final question, so you plan on just filling your super fast light mech with a big Ballistic gun, and a super high heat producing (for a light) weapon? And not save any weight for heat sinks, pilot mods, and ectra?