100 replies to this topic

[Lily from animove]

0bsidion, on 21 December 2015 - 08:39 AM, said:

Well I would hope anyone pulling off a 2800+ game was a good player. I'd love to spectate a game where someone pulled that off though, because it makes me feel like I'm doing something spectacularly wrong, so maybe I could learn something.

well look 2800 menas 280 scores per match (not score score, forumula score form the formula shown in the tournament)

now lets sa you have a match with 750 damage, doing 3kills, (2 solos), and 3 kill most damage dealt amongst the 7 assists.

(Solo Kill x 30) + (Kill Most Damage x 20) + (Killing Blow x 10) + ( Kill Assist x 10) + (Win × 10) + (Loss × 5) + (Survive × 10) + (Dead × 5) + ((Damage done - Team Damage) ÷ 15)

I am just nto sure if the "killing blow" is included ot extra to the solo kill, and if a kill most damage stacks with assis, but I make it not count in my calculation.

Thats then
2*30 = 60 solo kill
3*20 = 60 kill most dmg
1*10 = 10killing blow
4x10 = 40 kill assist
1x10 = 10 win
1x10 = 10 survive
750/15 = 50 damage.

thats 240 on the scores of the leaderboard. So a match getting you 280 must have to be a match where you have your hands on all opponents and keep involved most of the time with a very influencing factor. Just to make sure you get a lot solo kills and kill most damages. Because just hiding and making kills to K7d stroke isn't going to make it, or racking up pointless damage by stripping one or two mechs with spread damage.

Go to youtube you may find some people showing you the big scoring games, and see how these pilots behave.

The other way around would be showing is some of your games, if you can record, some advices to your builds and behaviors cna often be given. In the end MWO is more about avoiding mistakes killing you quickly than "doing it right" since situations differ too often to doing it in the right style. So you mostly do good when you prevent doing stuff wrong.

Edited by Lily from animove, 21 December 2015 - 09:03 AM.

[V O L T R O N]

TIER 1 OR GTFO

So many ******** baddies farming old inactive accounts or buying new mechs on new accounts at top of the leaderboards.

^ FLOCKING SCRUBS.

Quite frankly, if you are on the leadeboards and not tier 1, it means absolutely nothing.

Edited by V O L T R O N, 21 December 2015 - 09:16 AM.

[Lily from animove]

V O L T R O N, on 21 December 2015 - 09:16 AM, said:

TIER 1 OR GTFO

So many ******** baddies farming old inactive accounts or buying new mechs on new accounts at top of the leaderboards.

^ FLOCKING SCRUBS.

thats not tier related LOL. But both ahs the "grind attitude" in common

Edited by Lily from animove, 21 December 2015 - 09:16 AM.

[Kraftwerkedup]

Yeah if all yer games are this ^ youre gonna hit some serious numbers.

I wish I had time to play. Im not even getting the personal challenge stuff. *shakes fist*

On the bright side, I *am* posting this from a beach on Rabaul. So that might be slightly better than a few thousand more MC and some hanging items ill never use.



Be jealous.

Edited by Kraftwerkedup, 21 December 2015 - 09:30 AM.

[cSand]

Kraftwerkedup, on 21 December 2015 - 09:30 AM, said:

Yeah if all yer games are this ^ youre gonna hit some serious numbers.

THAT'S MY BOY, KRAFTY!!!

REPRESENT

[Grimlox]

V O L T R O N, on 21 December 2015 - 09:16 AM, said:

TIER 1 OR GTFO

So many ******** baddies farming old inactive accounts or buying new mechs on new accounts at top of the leaderboards.

^ FLOCKING SCRUBS.

Quite frankly, if you are on the leadeboards and not tier 1, it means absolutely nothing.

Don't Tiers 1-4 play against each other in the same matches? I'm sure the MM tries to fit people closer to their tier together but a tier 1 playing in off peak hours is going to get matched with more scrub tier players like me than a tier 1 player that plays during primetime when there are plenty of other tier 1 opponents to match them against.

Couple that with the fact that the tier system is pretty flawed to begin with and I'd say only showing tier 1 players isn't that meaningful either. Heck I came back to the game from a year break and it dropped me into tier 4 and it hasn't taken long to hit tier 3. If I just solo queue farmed I could be rising faster as well, but I like to drop with 1 or two friends and not taking advantage of the high tonnage we get so there tends to be more losses as our 2-3 man runs against the 10 man on the other team. Anyone that wants to tryhard and win can get to tier 1 pretty easily by the looks of it, most likely by running in a large group with voice and farming quick match rather than playing CW.

But for the sake of those that are more interested in showing off their e-peen maybe a little (T1, T2, T3 etc.) to show the tier beside the player name would be helpful.

Edited by Grimlox, 21 December 2015 - 09:37 AM.

[V O L T R O N]

Grimlox, on 21 December 2015 - 09:33 AM, said:

Don't Tiers 1-4 play against each other in the same matches? I'm sure the MM tries to fit people closer to their tier together but a tier 1 playing in off peak hours is going to get matched with more scrub tier players like me than a tier 1 player that plays during primetime when there are plenty of other tier 1 opponents to match them against.

Couple that with the fact that the tier system is pretty flawed to begin with and I'd say only showing tier 1 players isn't that meaningful either. Heck I came back to the game from a year break and it dropped me into tier 4 and it hasn't taken long to hit tier 3. If I just solo queue farmed I could be rising faster as well, but I like to drop with 1 or two friends and not taking advantage of the high tonnage we get so there tends to be more losses as our 2-3 man runs against the 10 man on the other team.

But for the sake of those that are more interested in showing off their e-peen maybe a little (T1, T2, T3 etc.) to show the tier beside the player name would be helpful.

Its not flawed, trust me, its completely different for me and you.

1. having different tier leaderboards
2. show tier next to placement
3. Opt in to a tier 1 for leaderboard tourneys

Edited by V O L T R O N, 21 December 2015 - 09:35 AM.

[Kraftwerkedup]

And alot of people say these tournaments and public leaderboards "bring out the worst" in the community, and maybe in some small ways, in individual cases, thats true.

But the way I see it, when I see respectful competition, when someone cares that youre doing well, and other competitors congradulate you, challenge you, push you to do better, to get in game and have some fun.

THATS what a community is.

cSand, on 21 December 2015 - 09:32 AM, said:

THAT'S MY BOY, KRAFTY!!!

REPRESENT

PUG life!

[0bsidion]

Lily from animove, on 21 December 2015 - 08:59 AM, said:

well look 2800 menas 280 scores per match (not score score, forumula score form the formula shown in the tournament)

now lets sa you have a match with 750 damage, doing 3kills, (2 solos), and 3 kill most damage dealt amongst the 7 assists.

(Solo Kill x 30) + (Kill Most Damage x 20) + (Killing Blow x 10) + ( Kill Assist x 10) + (Win × 10) + (Loss × 5) + (Survive × 10) + (Dead × 5) + ((Damage done - Team Damage) ÷ 15)

I am just nto sure if the "killing blow" is included ot extra to the solo kill, and if a kill most damage stacks with assis, but I make it not count in my calculation.

Thats then
2*30 = 60 solo kill
3*20 = 60 kill most dmg
1*10 = 10killing blow
4x10 = 40 kill assist
1x10 = 10 win
1x10 = 10 survive
750/15 = 50 damage.

thats 240 on the scores of the leaderboard. So a match getting you 280 must have to be a match where you have your hands on all opponents and keep involved most of the time with a very influencing factor. Just to make sure you get a lot solo kills and kill most damages. Because just hiding and making kills to K7d stroke isn't going to make it, or racking up pointless damage by stripping one or two mechs with spread damage.

Go to youtube you may find some people showing you the big scoring games, and see how these pilots behave.

The other way around would be showing is some of your games, if you can record, some advices to your builds and behaviors cna often be given. In the end MWO is more about avoiding mistakes killing you quickly than "doing it right" since situations differ too often to doing it in the right style. So you mostly do good when you prevent doing stuff wrong.

Thanks for the explanation. It looks like the way it is set up doesn't exactly encourage team play though, as the most rewarding thing is solo kills. No points for sticking with the team, helping the team, accomplishing team objectives. Just every man for himself. I'm surprised there hasn't been more saltiness than there has been so far.

[Kraftwerkedup]

Well if you get multiple solo kills, you are absolutely helping your team, since shooting gundams is always the main objective.

With some beams to stand in, as an option some of the time.

If you have 4 guys on your team who can each get 3 solo kills. You win dude.

Edited by Kraftwerkedup, 21 December 2015 - 09:55 AM.

[Grimlox]

V O L T R O N, on 21 December 2015 - 09:34 AM, said:

Its not flawed, trust me, its completely different for me and you.

1. having different tier leaderboards
2. show tier next to placement
3. Opt in to a tier 1 for leaderboard tourneys

I have no doubt that the soloQ experience is different for you and I, it's pretty easy to farm bad players in it at my tier. However it seems in the group queue even dropping as a 2 or 3 man group they throw PSR out the window when matching games. I find it hard to believe the 8-10 man groups of MS, BEER, SPQR, WoL etc. are tier 3-4 players like the group of friends I drop with.

I'm sure if you are soloQ dropping as a tier 1 player during primetime that it's a totally different level of competition and agree that it would make sense to show these pilots on a different leaderboard. However it really does seem a bit flawed when you can farm group queue and get matches where 10 mans go against groups no larger than 3 or 4 mans. If PSR was only based on solo Q then I would take it more seriously.

[Kraftwerkedup]

Its also harder to get insanely high match scores, dropping with 8-10 other dudes who can also get insanely high match scores.

[Jacon Ceronia]

Way to go Voltron, you killed an otherwise fun thread. Thx... =(

Edited by Jacon Ceronia, 21 December 2015 - 10:00 AM.

[Grimlox]

Kraftwerkedup, on 21 December 2015 - 09:58 AM, said:

Its also harder to get insanely high match scores, dropping with 8-10 other dudes who can also get insanely high match scores.

Yes I don't think it necessarily helps you for these leaderboards to drop in 8-10 man groups, but if we restricted the leaderboards to tier 1 only it's a lot easier to get to tier 1 by playing the other 99% of the time in a big 8-10 man group. I'm just saying using the PSR to show who gets to even show up on the leaderboards is somewhat flawed when the PSR is so much easier to gain depending on how you play (small group or big group or soloQ).

[V O L T R O N]

Jacon Ceronia, on 21 December 2015 - 10:00 AM, said:

Way to go Voltron, you killed an otherwise fun thread. Thx... =(

This is your fun?

[CygnusX7]

V O L T R O N, on 21 December 2015 - 10:18 AM, said:

This is your fun?

Judging by your signature this is not your sort of fun so why bother "contributing"?

[0bsidion]

Kraftwerkedup, on 21 December 2015 - 09:54 AM, said:

Well if you get multiple solo kills, you are absolutely helping your team, since shooting gundams is always the main objective.

With some beams to stand in, as an option some of the time.

If you have 4 guys on your team who can each get 3 solo kills. You win dude.

Sure, killing off the opposition obviously nets your team the win, yay team, but the scoring system doesn't encourage team oriented behavior. No points for TAG, NARC, UAVs, spotting, scouting, anything like that. It encourages players to be selfish to try and get kills all on their own.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying that anyone here did that necessarily or that the top scorers are bad team players. I'm sure they're great. I'm just saying it doesn't strike me as a particularly well thought out system for a team game. Because lets face it, if you're trying to game the system for the best scores, your team winning is purely incidental and may in fact influence circumstances where helping the team interferes with the personal motivation to rank on the leaderboard.

[Ultimax]

Grimlox, on 21 December 2015 - 09:55 AM, said:

However it really does seem a bit flawed when you can farm group queue and get matches where 10 mans go against groups no larger than 3 or 4 mans. If PSR was only based on solo Q then I would take it more seriously.

I don't think you really understand how difficult it is to hit huge scores when the other 9-11 people on your team are also good players and its basically a race to get damage in matches that end in 3 minutes.

Everyone is trying to one-up everyone else, no one is farming components or bringing bad builds that spread damage all over - mechs get focused and killed fast.


The vast majority of matches will have everyone on the team in a 300-500 damage spread.

Every few matches someone gets into a lucky position and hogs a large portion of damage or kills.

Edited by Ultimatum X, 21 December 2015 - 10:23 AM.

[Grimlox]

Ultimatum X, on 21 December 2015 - 10:22 AM, said:

I don't think you really understand how difficult it is to hit huge scores when the other 9-11 people on your team are also good players and its basically a race to get damage in matches that end in 3 minutes.

Everyone is trying to one-up everyone else, no one is farming components or bringing bad builds that spread damage all over - mechs get focused and killed fast.


The vast majority of matches will have everyone on the team in a 300-500 damage spread.

Every few matches someone gets into a lucky position and hogs a large portion of damage or kills.

I get that but you missed the point of my post. My point was it's somewhat flawed to limit the leaderboard to tier 1 pilots only when all you have to do is run with 8+ man groups long enough and you are tier 1. Even if you have less than a 50% win rate against other 8+ man groups you will more than make up for it with farming 2-4 man groups on the opposite side. Meanwhile there could be some really good pilots that play mostly 2-4 man groups (where they are at a disadvantage) or solo and it would be silly to exclude them from the leaderboards.

Actually running in the 8+ man groups for the event is probably not the best way to farm a good score as you mentioned and I agree with you. My point was about why its a bad idea to limit leaderboards based on PSR when PSR seemed to be a somewhat flawed way to rank. If PSR was based only on soloQ then it would be more meaningful IMO. Just like in MoBA's which are the biggest esports/competitive genre solo/duoQ rank is how they rate players skills rather than team win/loss dictating the vast majority of the outcome.

[Jman5]

Mcgral18, on 20 December 2015 - 11:15 PM, said:

And so we advance, point by point...

I shall be waiting (in my Jade Falcon camo).

I'll be back on tonight and then we will put an end to this little contest!