522 replies to this topic

[StalaggtIKE]

El Bandito, on 29 December 2015 - 01:30 PM, said:

Or make the Merc life as tough as it should be, like in MW2. Right now there is no risk of going Merc and hopping factions--on the contrary, there are only benefits, such as easy low tier rewards.

BINGO! Reintroduce r&r for mercs. It makes sense for House to get free repairs.

[Armando]

StalaggtIKE, on 05 January 2016 - 12:58 PM, said:

BINGO! Reintroduce r&r for mercs. It makes sense for House to get free repairs.

As long as they introduce the 'contract' process at the same time (factions can draw up contracts to attract Mercenary Units), so that mercs can pay the r&r bill, I'm alright with this. (honestly makes sense IMO).

I really think that the 'contact' process is what is missing in MWO Community Warfare. Give factions the means to attract merc units via contracts, once the merc unit accepts the contract let the faction choose what planet(s) the merc units attack. Once the contract has been 'filled' mercs get paid.

To be honest, WHEN mercs get paid is up in the air...

...front loaded contracts (contract is paid in full at the time the contract is signed).
...50 / 50 contracts (half paid up front, half paid once contract has been completed successfully).
...back loaded contracts (contract is paid in full once contract has been completed successfully).

^^^these details can / should be hammered out when the contract is created / signed^^^

_____________________________

Take this even FURTHER, and make "Number of planets held" a major stat for Factions (more planets, more taxes inc) and give factions a reason to pay mercs to work for them.

Edited by Armando, 05 January 2016 - 01:10 PM.

[Tesunie]

Armando, on 05 January 2016 - 01:09 PM, said:

As long as they introduce the 'contract' process at the same time (factions can draw up contracts to attract Mercenary Units), so that mercs can pay the r&r bill, I'm alright with this. (honestly makes sense IMO).

I really think that the 'contact' process is what is missing in MWO Community Warfare. Give factions the means to attract merc units via contracts, once the merc unit accepts the contract let the faction choose what planet(s) the merc units attack. Once the contract has been 'filled' mercs get paid.

To be honest, WHEN mercs get paid is up in the air...

...front loaded contracts (contract is paid in full at the time the contract is signed).
...50 / 50 contracts (half paid up front, half paid once contract has been completed successfully).
...back loaded contracts (contract is paid in full once contract has been completed successfully).

^^^these details can / should be hammered out when the contract is created / signed^^^

_____________________________

Take this even FURTHER, and make "Number of planets held" a major stat for Factions (more planets, more taxes inc) and give factions a reason to pay mercs to work for them.

My only question is... who is making this contracts? And are they on a per unit basis, or a general merc contract to any merc who wishes to grab it?

[Armando]

Tesunie, on 05 January 2016 - 01:12 PM, said:

My only question is... who is making this contracts? And are they on a per unit basis, or a general merc contract to any merc who wishes to grab it?

If the process is coded well, it could be either. A faction could create a 'general merc contract' available to any merc unit that can complete the mission...OR .... create a specific contract between a faction and a specific merc unit (if that is what the faction wants and the merc unit is willing).

FRR creates a 'general contract' to pay 2,000,000 C-Bills for taking a single specific planet. The merc unit that takes the planet for FRR gets the money....if by chance the planet gets taken by faction units, tough luck to the mercs.

OR

FRR creates a 'unit specific' contract to pay [-MS-], or [228], or [insert merc unit here] 100,000,000 C-Bills so that the specified unit will fight for FRR for 14 days straight. In this case FRR could even add a 'bonus' amount for every planet taken by the Merc Unit over (x) number of planets during the duration of the contract.

In short: The factions that pay the best, attracts the best merc units.

Edited by Armando, 05 January 2016 - 01:22 PM.

[Tesunie]

Armando, on 05 January 2016 - 01:15 PM, said:

If the process is coded well, it could be either. A faction could create a 'general merc contract' available to any merc unit that can complete the mission...OR .... create a specific contract between a faction and a specific merc unit (if that is what the faction wants and the merc unit is willing).

But who determines those contracts? How are those contracts create? Does a computer code generate those contracts? Is it another thing Loyalists vote for?

If we had an established leader for each faction, I could see this working. However, we don't. So, I'm not grasping how a contract could be drafted up to entice mercs, when we don't have any one to create the contract to start with...

[NextGame]

StalaggtIKE, on 05 January 2016 - 12:58 PM, said:

BINGO! Reintroduce r&r for mercs. It makes sense for House to get free repairs.

Sure, as long as Loyalist units get zero reward other than loyalty points for anything they do on the battlefield. No cbills for loyalists as they clearly dont need them.

Edited by NextGame, 05 January 2016 - 01:32 PM.

[gloowa]

NextGame, on 05 January 2016 - 01:32 PM, said:

Sure, as long as Loyalist units get zero reward other than loyalty points for anything they do on the battlefield. No cbills for loyalists as they clearly dont need them.

Loyalists get mechwarrior salary.

Around 200 000 CBills per year of active duty.

Works for me.

Edited by gloowa, 05 January 2016 - 01:38 PM.

[Khereg]

Khobai, on 05 January 2016 - 12:47 PM, said:

sure why not? especially if the loyalty reward structure is changed to punish faction hopping and reward loyalists.

Ok, you just made me think of something...

-MS- could create 10 sub units and make each of them a loyalist in each faction.

Instead of the unit making and breaking contracts, we move around by leaving and joining the various units (up to whatever cap they put in place, of course).

I guess we would still have the 72 hour cooldown window to slow us down, but doing it as individuals and reaping higher rewards (assuming loyalists get higher rewards) would provide the incentive.

#newmeta?

Edited by Khereg, 05 January 2016 - 01:46 PM.

[Kotev]

I have engaged Ms & 228 in many battles and they have some good pilots but if they say is true about not attacking one another or other good organized teams they get no respect from me. If there isnt chalange whats the point of winning ?!

[Armando]

Tesunie, on 05 January 2016 - 01:17 PM, said:

But who determines those contracts? How are those contracts create? Does a computer code generate those contracts? Is it another thing Loyalists vote for?

If we had an established leader for each faction, I could see this working. However, we don't. So, I'm not grasping how a contract could be drafted up to entice mercs, when we don't have any one to create the contract to start with...

Again, if coded right it could be BOTH

Computer code generated:
For the 'any merc unit that completes the contact'...type of contracts.

AND

Faction Loyalist Unit Leaders generated:
Give the ability to 'create custom contracts' for specific merc units to every Loyalist unit leader in the faction. (This is how mercs units / faction units have been doing it from now back to the release of CW).

Edited by Armando, 05 January 2016 - 02:15 PM.

[Tesunie]

Armando, on 05 January 2016 - 02:14 PM, said:

Again, if coded right it could be BOTH

Computer code generated:
For the 'any merc unit that completes the contact'...type of contracts.

AND

Faction Loyalist Unit Leaders generated:
Give the ability to 'create custom contracts' for specific merc units to every unit leader in the faction. (This is how mercs units / faction units have been doing it from now back to the release of CW).

I get what you are trying to say, but I'm not getting how the system could work, forget on who would/could specifically control it.

If it's run by a computer code, wouldn't what we have already be basically the same thing? And it is easier to work on/with, it's already here. How could this entice mercs to join up with a specific faction then?
If it's run by "the faction", who specifically is setting those contracts up? Voting by faction unit leaders? All faction members? How would they address the individual merc unit to "entice" them to join?

[Bjorn Coston]

NextGame, on 30 December 2015 - 01:21 AM, said:

The other thing they should do is have someone control the politics for each faction and "hire" units, and a way to actually manage which planets a faction is attacking etc as this could balance things out and make it a bit more interesting.

This intrigues me. Maybe a format where each faction is allotted a certain amount of C-Bills (dependent on various variables like Planet Values etc.) and the cost for hiring a unit is directly related to the size of the unit? Therefore, a faction can choose to hire numerous smaller units or a few of the larger ones depending on their budget. Also, maybe not allowing Mercs to put tags on a planet and instead the planet goes to the Faction they fight for and they get royalties for taking or defending said planet. And if that's too big of an insult to not have tags on a planet, do the reverse. The Merc unit gets their tags on the planet but the majority of the planet value goes to their Sponsor Faction.

Also, maybe having the "Mercenary Liaison" make up contracts for Merc units to put certain planets under their protection for the duration of their contract. This could be expanded into attack/raid contracts as well.

I don't honestly know what I support in regards to the CW issue. While I don't believe players should be punished for organizing and running skilled and coordinated units (MS 228), the fact remains that CW is incredibly broken and mercenaries run the Inner Sphere. The various Houses are supposed to be well established economies, capable of supporting much larger units, campaigns, infrastructure, etc in order to maintain a star-spanning empire. Therefore, there should be WAY more incentives to stay Loyal and remain <---(Key word there) loyal.

[Jenovah]

Khobai, on 05 January 2016 - 11:59 AM, said:

actually capping unit sizes does a lot more than just remove player choice. itll create more units and help get units distributed more evenly across factions. itll also prevent singular units from dominating factions as much as they do now. and lastly itll make a bunch of crybabies quit the game which is the biggest plus of all.

i for one cant wait to see these big units of like 500 players get hit with a 50-100 player unit cap. its gonna be hilarious.



false. if youre one of those idiots thats hopping around factions gaming the system for rewards then your fun is definitely less important than mine.

if you didnt want your huge factions getting capped at 50-100 players you shouldnt have abused the system. you brought it on yourselves. now stop being crybabies. man up and take responsibility for your actions.

enlighten me then, oh wise one, where in the TOS or any rules did it state you couldn't create a unit, become successful, and continue to grow?

oh, that's right, those who can't, whine- then try and tear down the work of others.

[Armando]

Tesunie, on 05 January 2016 - 02:18 PM, said:

I get what you are trying to say, but I'm not getting how the system could work, forget on who would/could specifically control it.

If it's run by a computer code, wouldn't what we have already be basically the same thing? And it is easier to work on/with, it's already here. How could this entice mercs to join up with a specific faction then?
If it's run by "the faction", who specifically is setting those contracts up? Voting by faction unit leaders? All faction members? How would they address the individual merc unit to "entice" them to join?

If there was a contract system in place, mercs would NEVER join ANY House / Clan....only work contracts. In theory, a merc unit could take on a 'take xyz planet' contract with Kurita in the morning, then take a different ' take abc planet' contract with Wolf.

The 'non-computed' generated contacts would be created by the Unit Leaders of the Factions they are a part of (or by 'authorized contract negotiators' assigned by the Unit Leadership), and would be paid using Unit coffers (more planets 'tagged' by a faction unit...the faster the coffer money comes in) or a pilots personal funds. This is how Factions hire Merc Units today (and how it has gone down since CW started).

As an example lets say Kurita Loyalist want to pin Clan SJ to their 'home world' at the start of the season....they would 'hire' a merc unit to make it happen (for giggles lets say Loyalist pays Merc Unit 100,000,000,000 C-Bills to do this). Merc unit is successful they get paid. {This is an example of a real exchange that has already happened between a Loyalist and a Merc Unit}.

Jenovah, on 05 January 2016 - 02:30 PM, said:

enlighten me then, oh wise one, where in the TOS or any rules did it state you couldn't create a unit, become successful, and continue to grow?

oh, that's right, those who can't, whine- then try and tear down the work of others.

Not everyone can find / make friends "In-Game" easy (especially with the lack of tools to do so)....I try not to judge.

Edited by Armando, 05 January 2016 - 02:46 PM.

[Jenovah]

Tesunie, on 05 January 2016 - 11:49 AM, said:

There are other modes of play besides CW, for the record. And, if you have friends playing, you can compromise and flip between the IS and Clans from time to time, like every 2 weeks. Keeps the whole inventory available, and changes things up a bit from time to time for your group.

Or, you can do what other players have done, create two accounts. One is IS mechs only, and allies with the IS. The other is Clan mechs only, and allied with the Clans. Then, depending upon what your group of friends wish to play, you all just log into the appropriate allied account and play together.

So I'm supposed to reinvest money into more mechs, cbills, and time to grind everything? Yeah, sounds like a grand plan- did you buy stock in PGI?

As far as modes other than CW, its been covered why CW is more enjoyable than quick matches. Go read, don't worry- I'll wait.

[Jenovah]

StalaggtIKE, on 05 January 2016 - 12:58 PM, said:

BINGO! Reintroduce r&r for mercs. It makes sense for House to get free repairs.

Yeah, no.... It makes sense that I get charged to play if you do as well. As in the houses are taxed from their loyalist pockets in order to pay for their "military/mech's" repair and pay for merc contracts. Or do you think you should run free drops as well as have PGI code for cbill drops into your factions "bank" to pay mercs?

I'd love for R&R as a merc as long as all loyalists are being taxed in order to pay for their factions "business" dealings. But it requires an economy system.

[Khobai]

Quote

enlighten me then, oh wise one, where in the TOS or any rules did it state you couldn't create a unit, become successful, and continue to grow?

that wasnt the abuse.

the abuse was units constantly switching factions in order to maximize loyalty rewards.

it basically destabilized CW and made it unenjoyable for everyone else

I have no sympathy for those people. they deserve whats coming.

Edited by Khobai, 05 January 2016 - 02:38 PM.

[Jenovah]

Khobai, on 05 January 2016 - 02:38 PM, said:

that wasnt the abuse.

the abuse was units constantly switching factions in order to maximize loyalty rewards.

it basically destabilized CW and made it unenjoyable for everyone else

I have no sympathy for those people. they deserve whats coming.

So its our fault that we maximized the potential of a system? You characterize that as abuse? Because the TOS and COC doesn't.

It's almost like saying, "I'm going to buy this locust, and only run the stock loadout, because to maximize it to my benefit constitutes abuse- even though I'm using it as PGI introduced it."

Makes sense, how are those stock mechs working out for you?

[Khereg]

Khobai, on 05 January 2016 - 02:38 PM, said:

I have no sympathy for those people. they deserve whats coming.

And I just showed you one possible way we could dodge the bullet. We'll be loyalists in ALL the factions, reaping the increased rewards, voting on yr attack lanes, and essentially writing ourselves our own contracts, going wherever we please by leaving and joining our 10 faction-specific loyalist units.

We wouldn't be mercs if we didn't, right?

/effing mercs...

[Armando]

Khobai, on 05 January 2016 - 02:38 PM, said:

that wasnt the abuse.

the abuse was units constantly switching factions in order to maximize loyalty rewards.

it basically destabilized CW and made it unenjoyable for everyone else

I have no sympathy for those people. they deserve whats coming.

I get pissed when people play the game as it was designed too some times. Then I take a pill and chill the F^c% out.