102 replies to this topic

[Otto Cannon]

Greenduck, on 31 December 2015 - 02:55 PM, said:

2) Clan being nerfed into the ground
3) Super powered IS mechs

[El Bandito]

Greenduck, on 31 December 2015 - 02:55 PM, said:

2) Clan being nerfed into the ground
3) Super powered IS mechs

Yeah, keep telling yourself that. Helps you to sleep better at night.

Also, the big mercs knew the Clans will fold after they go IS, yet they have the gall to say they went IS just cause they want to play against the best there is? That's horse ****. If -MS- and 228 wanted actual challenge, they would play against each other. I only see selfishness here.

Edited by El Bandito, 31 December 2015 - 06:28 PM.

[Novakaine]

El Bandito, on 31 December 2015 - 06:26 PM, said:

Yeah, keep telling yourself that. Helps you to sleep better at night.

Also, the big mercs knew the Clans will fold after they go IS, yet they have the gall to say they went IS just cause they want to play against the best there is? That's horse ****. If -MS- and 228 wanted actual challenge, they would play against each other. I only see selfishness here.

You forgot self-aggrandizing.

[Sandpit]

Novakaine, on 31 December 2015 - 07:12 PM, said:

You forgot self-aggrandizing.

no, it was just apparent and obvious enough to not need special attention lol

[Aresye]

Deathlike, on 31 December 2015 - 06:01 PM, said:

Believe it or not, Paul's mega-change happened before Tukayyid 2.

http://mwomercs.com/...38-01-dec-2015/

Tukayyid 2 was Dec 4-7.

http://mwomercs.com/...nts?t=201512tuk

There wasn't enough time to evaluate the changes, but people played through said "nerfed Clan mechs".

I know. I was referencing those who continue to say the Clans are still OP after the change, and were the reason for most of the competitive teams to switch to Clan.

[Sader325]

https://docs.google....f=2&pli=1#gid=0

SWOL.

53% win rate.

No.

[MischiefSC]

Aresye Kerensky, on 31 December 2015 - 07:26 PM, said:

I know. I was referencing those who continue to say the Clans are still OP after the change, and were the reason for most of the competitive teams to switch to Clan.

IS has a tonnage advantage. If there's an overall mech advantage it's pretty thin; however if you're used to OP Clan mechs I'm sure playing on par with an IS mech felt like the worstest nerf ever in the history of forever. People who've been playing both however are saying they're more even than they've ever been.

The switch wasn't so much 'Now IS is OP' as it was 'Clans are not OP! We're all going IS so we'll stomp the (now empty) Clans and show you how it ruins the game when Clans are not OP!'

This was followed by a very dramatic hair flounce and the sound of sobbing and crying.

[Deathlike]

MischiefSC, on 31 December 2015 - 10:03 PM, said:

This was followed by a very dramatic hair flounce and the sound of sobbing and crying.

Personally, I've heard too much qq from the Clan that cried Wolf.

[Aresye]

MischiefSC, on 31 December 2015 - 10:03 PM, said:

IS has a tonnage advantage. If there's an overall mech advantage it's pretty thin; however if you're used to OP Clan mechs I'm sure playing on par with an IS mech felt like the worstest nerf ever in the history of forever. People who've been playing both however are saying they're more even than they've ever been.

The switch wasn't so much 'Now IS is OP' as it was 'Clans are not OP! We're all going IS so we'll stomp the (now empty) Clans and show you how it ruins the game when Clans are not OP!'

This was followed by a very dramatic hair flounce and the sound of sobbing and crying.

I'm more basing my opinions on the fact that I'm out-trading and doing better than players I know are at or above my skill level, while using IS mechs.

[SkyHammyr]

El Bandito, on 31 December 2015 - 06:26 PM, said:

Also, the big mercs knew the Clans will fold after they go IS, yet they have the gall to say they went IS just cause they want to play against the best there is? That's horse ****. If -MS- and 228 wanted actual challenge, they would play against each other. I only see selfishness here.

This.

You can't expect PGI to fix Human Nature.
People will always look for what's the easiest and the most profitable for them, regardless of the greater good.

Comp units went Clan for Tuk because they'd see the least wait times (IS had significantly longer wait times in both Tuk 1 & 2). You don't make CBills/LP waiting in line, so why stay IS when you know the drop que was so long?
Then, comp units went IS, all of them, "coincidentally" at almost the same time, so they wouldn't have to fight each other. You make more CBills/LP clubbing seals, so why fight each other when you can stomp PUGs?

Sorry OP, but no matter how you slice it, it's still baloney.

Edited by SkyHammr, 31 December 2015 - 10:12 PM.

[spectralthundr]

MischiefSC, on 31 December 2015 - 03:53 PM, said:

No.

It was not mech balance, it was players throwing a fit about mech balance not being in their favor anymore.

So they flounced off. Threw a fit and flounced. Not just SWOL, plenty of other Clan players and units left to "prove" that the game is bad when Clans are not op.

Problem is that in regular play it's pretty obvious that at least on the handful of quirked up mechs balance is very even. Sub-par Clan mechs are still better than sub-par IS mechs but in the context of CW it's probably the closest to balanced it's ever going to be.

The problem is that the bulk of Clan players, when push came to shove, only played Clans because they were better.

You can't balance a game around a bunch of players only wanting to play when the game balance is skewed in their favor. This isn't an insult or ad hominem it's an observation of what actually happened. As soon as balance got close to even the bulk of Clan players left - in a huff. That's not a game problem it's a player problem.

I say leave it. Population will equalize over time as people look for matches. If SWOL never comes back to CW then Clan Wolf will fill with people who want to play there anyway and they'll win or lose more on their actual game performance than game tech imbalances.

SWOL can stay or go, that in no way, shape or form should be a serious factor in game mechanics.

Bingo, especially this right here "

The problem is that the bulk of Clan players, when push came to shove, only played Clans because they were better.

You can't balance a game around a bunch of players only wanting to play when the game balance is skewed in their favor. This isn't an insult or ad hominem it's an observation of what actually happened. As soon as balance got close to even the bulk of Clan players left - in a huff. That's not a game problem it's a player problem."

I've played from both sides of the equation and to say that IS mechs are now some godly unbeatable mass is well.. it's flat out delusion. You're about as balanced as you're going to get it between Clan and IS at the moment.

The end all be all is teamwork and pilot skill is what wins drops regardless if you're dropping in Timberwolves and Stormcrows, Or Atlases and Thunderbolts. What ever house or clan the well coordinated units decide to play for at a particular time are the houses or clans that are going to have success.

[Sandpit]

MischiefSC, on 31 December 2015 - 10:03 PM, said:

IS has a tonnage advantage. If there's an overall mech advantage it's pretty thin; however if you're used to OP Clan mechs I'm sure playing on par with an IS mech felt like the worstest nerf ever in the history of forever. People who've been playing both however are saying they're more even than they've ever been.

The switch wasn't so much 'Now IS is OP' as it was 'Clans are not OP! We're all going IS so we'll stomp the (now empty) Clans and show you how it ruins the game when Clans are not OP!'

This was followed by a very dramatic hair flounce and the sound of sobbing and crying.

^
EDIT:

Edited by Sandpit, 31 December 2015 - 11:08 PM.

[Barantor]

The more members a unit has, the longer they have to wait with downtime while the new faction they want to join checks them out and makes sure they aren't just tricking them.

This will make it so that units that do want to change a lot will be small, and those that are huge will have a big downtime if they want to swap. To the point that if there were seasons or whatever then the super huge units would miss half a season if they want to swap mid-season.

Faction loyalty should be capped at a certain point and then a pop-up should appear that says "to go beyond you can't swap" and have larger rewards for those units that are with that faction through and through.

Swappers can get some rewards as mercenaries by swapping around to different factions and doing well. If they do well then their rating goes up and they get some of the same rewards as the faction loyalists, but they have to have been more than one faction in the last 6 months or something like that. If this were seasons then they might have to swap or something.

I think it could all be done and make sense with the lore, but there has to be limits on what units can do. I also don't think that any unit should have more mechwarriors than some of the lore huge units like wolf's dragoons, kell hounds, etc. But hey, I'm the lore junky that just wants this to not be 'generic mech game x'.

[Peter2k]

some ideas:

reduce planets that are being fought over
there's never a conflict on that many planets anyway
even if there would be a load of players suddenly going CW like in tuk event, you can just increase number of zones on the planet as a whole
when ceasefire starts (or 24h window?) that planet gets locked and a new front opens up



while being a Merc myself I'm not sure if Mercs should be able to "own" a planet per se
now the planet could say be owned by Steiner, giving rewards to faction members of Steiner
could say something about which Merc unit(s) helped out the most
Mercs get compensated differently (according to their performance, like win%)



now -MS- is IS
228th joined IS like 2 days afterwards

why not giving out a fast contract change to 1! unit (the one being fast enough) to switch if player numbers would be too one sided
with a small reward (like a small % boost to C-Bill income? for instance) for changing instead of costing gazillions for a big unit to break contract
while this could be abused, I'm sure there could be some kind of system in place




lastly
farming PUG's should maybe not pay as much as going up against KCom, 228th, EMP, ...

a match going up against a good 12 man takes way longer to complete, is way more challenging, while giving out less rewards as a whole (use of consumables, hard long fight, high risk of losing)

maybe make the reward for killing a member of a unit, and defeating that unit in a match worth my time
there's going to be a leaderboard and notoriety in the game, so why not tie it to that
defeating a top player could net, I don't know twice, or thrice the reward of a normal PUG?
like defeating a MS or 228th pilot give 1.5 times, KCom 2 times and so on according to leaderboard (or whatever gets into the game to rank players/units/mercs)

giving units as a whole an incentive to fight each other
normally people like incentives more than being restricted

[MischiefSC]

Aresye Kerensky, on 31 December 2015 - 10:07 PM, said:

I'm more basing my opinions on the fact that I'm out-trading and doing better than players I know are at or above my skill level, while using IS mechs.

Maybe you just weren't applying yourself in Clan mechs? Because that's not playing out in pug or group queues and all the people I know and trust to be unbiased seems to find it pretty clearly even.

Obviously YMMV but maybe the playstyle of IS mechs just suits you better?

[Nerdboard]

Happy new year? Lots of good troll post here also.

[adamts01]

It's all about c-bills

• Give planets a set value to own, divide that among members in the unit that own it.
  
• x amount of loyalty points = x amount of cbills every cycle.
  
• Pay more for fighting for underpopulated factions, that way mercs make up for not having loyalty points and will distribute themselves accordingly.

[Oderint dum Metuant]

It's amazing how a piss poor CW with its artificial limitations on planets under attack ended up way way worse than planetary leagues decades plus old.

Leagues where factions were led, and and players decided the politics and wars.

[spectralthundr]

DV McKenna, on 01 January 2016 - 03:04 AM, said:

It's amazing how a piss poor CW with its artificial limitations on planets under attack ended up way way worse than planetary leagues decades plus old.

Leagues where factions were led, and and players decided the politics and wars.

I still think MPBT:3025 even in it's sadly short lived beta form, handled it about as well as you could do it. Granted those were all 4v4 drops if my memory still works, and TTK was even far less than it's ever been in MWO. It was also some of the most fun I've ever had in not only a pvp multiplayer game, but in a Mechwarrior/BT title.

[Ghogiel]

El Bandito, on 31 December 2015 - 06:26 PM, said:

Also, the big mercs knew the Clans will fold after they go IS, yet they have the gall to say they went IS just cause they want to play against the best there is? That's horse ****. If -MS- and 228 wanted actual challenge, they would play against each other. I only see selfishness here.

If black watch rolled into CW as a 12 man they probably wouldn't get any competition or challenge in 1000 matches regardless of faction or who was on the other side.

It's not challenge. The only reason MS or SWOL win anything is because base rushing. And lets face it, that's not really a challenge except on boreal against an organised IS.